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GLORIOUS RETURN: Oreimo #1-4


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The King of Harts



Joined: 05 May 2009
Posts: 6712
Location: Mount Crawford, Virginia
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:21 am Reply with quote
Can you guys put it at the top of the screen like translator notes? Just separating it someway from the main characters talking is good enough.


Another question that doesn't deal with the subs: How big are the 720p videos megabytes-wise? I'm just curious if I can watch another video without negatively affecting my internet, and I need to know how big a video is.
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PetrifiedJello



Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 3782
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:20 pm Reply with quote
tempest wrote:
While you may not want it translated, other people would complain if it were not.

I am not surprised. Those who'd complain probably send companies hate mail for not translating Japanese words in the background as well.
This is a joke.

Never hurts to ask.

Regardless, $5 is in the HD bucket for this series. Now, I just need to remember I bought the service to enjoy it when I get home. My forgetfulness is even more irritating.
Anime cry
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief


Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 1684
Location: Los Angeles, CA
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 1:14 pm Reply with quote
PetrifiedJello wrote:
I am not surprised. Those who'd complain probably send companies hate mail for not translating Japanese words in the background as well.
This is a joke.

And yet, sadly, it is not. You should see some of the letters people send the anime companies. Terrifying, truly.

We're working on a way to do translation notes, but on-screen is probably impossible. Our player right now has virtually no control over on-screen placement of text, so for now I told Kouryuu to just post any notes he wanted to make here.

And believe it or not, I actually cut about 15 lines of background chatter from this episode BECAUSE it was too hard to read. Luckily there was so much of it nobody could tell the difference. (They came from the original script, but the chatter is so layered I can't even tell if they were in the show.) Very Happy
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The King of Harts



Joined: 05 May 2009
Posts: 6712
Location: Mount Crawford, Virginia
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 1:22 pm Reply with quote
jsevakis wrote:
We're working on a way to do translation notes, but on-screen is probably impossible. Our player right now has virtually no control over on-screen placement of text, so for now I told Kouryuu to just post any notes he wanted to make here.

Poo. Well, as long the background chatter in future episodes is kept to a minimum and there are no more fujoshi, it should be bearable.

PetrifiedJello wrote:
Regardless, $5 is in the HD bucket for this series. Now, I just need to remember I bought the service to enjoy it when I get home. My forgetfulness is even more irritating.
Anime cry

I don't think you need to remember. As long as you're signed in it should automatically set to the 720p setting. At least that's how it worked for me since I didn't never even touched the resolution setting.
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samuelp
Industry Insider


Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 2231
Location: San Antonio, USA
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:03 pm Reply with quote
tempest wrote:
PetrifiedJello wrote:
The King of Harts wrote:
When there's background talk, can you NOT translate that in the future?

I second this request. It is irritating.


We kind of have to translate it. While you may not want it translated, other people would complain if it were not. What we're looking into is for a way to present it visibly different from the foreground conversation. Unfortunately this is a bit hard to do in our player at present.


If you can't do superscripts, then the other (less good, but better than nothing) solution is to make sure that background chatter is always the lower line, and relevant discussion is the upper line, or vica verca.
I.e. insert fake blank lines if needed to make the lines be consistently in the right place.
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PetrifiedJello



Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 3782
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:05 pm Reply with quote
jsevakis wrote:
And yet, sadly, it is not. You should see some of the letters people send the anime companies. Terrifying, truly.

No, thank you. This forum is more than enough.

Quote:
We're working on a way to do translation notes, but on-screen is probably impossible.

Why not on the video page itself? Just an idea that flew into my head.

Quote:
And believe it or not, I actually cut about 15 lines of background chatter from this episode BECAUSE it was too hard to read.

Psst... *looks around* perhaps an audio filter to remove background chatter completely? Wink I mean, who's going to know? Razz

In all fairness, what you guys have done to bring us so much is remarkable and I definitely appreciate it, even with slight irritations such as this.

Better this than nothing, that's for sure!

The King of Harts wrote:
I don't think you need to remember.

After my confirmation email, I went back to see what it did and saw the 720 option. However, it's useless to me because my TV is ED, not HD. 480 is the max on it.

I just need to remember I paid for it to be commercial free. Very Happy

12 episodes. 5 dollar bills. 1 happy camper.
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The King of Harts



Joined: 05 May 2009
Posts: 6712
Location: Mount Crawford, Virginia
PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:27 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
However, it's useless to me because my TV is ED, not HD.

Your TV has Erectile Dysfunction?


*ahem* Anyways, while I little experience with HD anime, if this is a small sample of it, colored me impressed. On my 1080p TV everything was so bright and colorful and it just looked so amazing; especially the eyes and Kirino's hair.
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jyuichi



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 125
PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:15 am Reply with quote
ED= enhanced definition. 480P

PetrifiedJello wrote:

Psst... *looks around* perhaps an audio filter to remove background chatter completely? Wink I mean, who's going to know? Razz


Oh, there is always SOMEONE who notices. Wink The weirdest little things can turn into the biggest internet trollfests xP

While it would be nice if the background chatter was in a different color, it seems to be in a smaller font size which is helpful. I liked it being translated Smile

I was wondering what those wiki pages said, thanks Kouryuu!
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LUNI_TUNZ



Joined: 28 Apr 2010
Posts: 809
PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:25 am Reply with quote
The King of Harts wrote:
Quote:
However, it's useless to me because my TV is ED, not HD.

Your TV has Erectile Dysfunction?


*ahem* Anyways, while I little experience with HD anime, if this is a small sample of it, colored me impressed. On my 1080p TV everything was so bright and colorful and it just looked so amazing; especially the eyes and Kirino's hair.


Oh you people and your magical devices that make internet video appear on TV's.
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Emerje



Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 7337
Location: Maine
PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:27 am Reply with quote
Just going to echo some complaints: Need a better way to pause, most players you can just click on the screen to pause. Having to go for that tiny button takes too long and then you have to go back a little to catch what you missed while trying to pause. Definitely need to find a new place to put the translator notes. A different line is fine, just please stop putting them on the same line as the subs, some flash on the screen for just a split second between lines of dialogue, it's rather annoying. One last complaint: It's OK to leave the subs up after someone finishes talking, you don't have to take them down as soon as they stop. People don't necessarily read as fast as they talk so just leaving the last line on screen for an extra second can do wonders for the viewer

One minor complaint: a couple seconds of black before the show starts would be nice. For some of us the video starts playing pretty quickly. By the time I've scrolled down to the player, found the full screen button, and waited for the player to do its little zoom in thing I've missed the first few seconds of the show which doesn't sound like much, but depending on how an episode starts it could mean completely missing the first line of dialogue.

Now with that out of the way, the show is great, I really appreciate the fact that the translation isn't coddling the viewer and assumes that a person watching a show as otaku-heavy as this knows a thing or two about Japanese pop culture. I really love the video quality, very crisp and clean and it loads up quickly, it never stuttered once in four episodes for me. I'm really looking forward to more as things improve.

siradix wrote:
It's true that the English language might not have that many ways to accurately say "Big Brother." But we still have many ways to similarly convey the same meaning: "Big Brother," "Bro," "Bubba," "Brother," "Brother Dear," "Bud," "Beloved Brother," "Brother Dearest," "Darling Brother," etc.


God no! It's popular in Japanese, but nobody talks like that in English. We might refer to them that way, but would never address them that way, it would always be by name. And most of those listed are kinda creepy... Really what's important isn't so much what they're saying (since they're all basically saying the same things), but how they're saying it. They're examples of being cute, childish, formal, and respectful.

Emerje
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siradix



Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Posts: 62
Location: USA
PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:52 am Reply with quote
Emerje wrote:

siradix wrote:
It's true that the English language might not have that many ways to accurately say "Big Brother." But we still have many ways to similarly convey the same meaning: "Big Brother," "Bro," "Bubba," "Brother," "Brother Dear," "Bud," "Beloved Brother," "Brother Dearest," "Darling Brother," etc.


God no! It's popular in Japanese, but nobody talks like that in English. We might refer to them that way, but would never address them that way, it would always be by name. And most of those listed are kinda creepy... Really what's important isn't so much what they're saying (since they're all basically saying the same things), but how they're saying it. They're examples of being cute, childish, formal, and respectful.

Emerje


Most of them? I would have figured only four of them would be awkward to hear. However, I've seen the awkward ones used in writings before. And yes, western cultures tend to use the person's name to display affection. Whether it be saying the person's real name, shorten version, or a shorten version with an ie suffix attached to the end. Personally I couldn't care less if ANN wanted to use oniichan or add the san, chan, or sama suffixes at the end of every name. My point is there are ways to convey the same meaning, even though it might sound "creepy" hearing it in anything besides Japanese.
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Emerje



Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 7337
Location: Maine
PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:03 pm Reply with quote
siradix wrote:
Most of them? I would have figured only four of them would be awkward to hear.


Well if you remove "bud" which isn't related to the others, it's short for "buddy" not brother, that leaves you with 7 so four would be most since it's more than half of them. "Dear", "dearest", "beloved" and "darling" are just waaay too endearing in English. The three remaining are OK, though "bubba" is usually something only toddlers tend to say because it's easy and eventually they grow out of it.

Quote:
Personally I couldn't care less if ANN wanted to use oniichan or add the san, chan, or sama suffixes at the end of every name. My point is there are ways to convey the same meaning, even though it might sound "creepy" hearing it in anything besides Japanese.


Sure, there's no questions that it can be said in other ways, but if you acknowledge that they sound creepy then why would you want ANN to use them? That's just taking a chance at turning off the viewers. It's not like they're expecting people to learn a new language, they aren't even expecting you to remember what they're saying, they're just trying to convey that there's more than one way to address an older sibling. With that being the case it may as well just stay in Japanese.

Emerje
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Roaring Sunset



Joined: 11 Nov 2010
Posts: 8
PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:26 pm Reply with quote
jsevakis wrote:

We left the phrase "Onii-chan" intact because the differentiation between different ways of saying big brother in Japanese is important to the show. Accuracy should never physically injure anyone. Wink


For full accuracy you'd have to use only Japanese in the captioning. But you're trying to make the material available to English speakers (er.. readers). Using some Japanese is useful for those who understand enough Japanese to know the meanings of the words, and can be necessary when there is no suitable English alternative.

You do have to draw a balance between detail and brevity. That's why specific terms exist, and specialist communications tend to develop specialized vocabularies. We don't have time to always say "car-sized truck with an open bed", so we say "pickup truck". Truck enthusiasts would use terms which distinguish between types of pickups.

This specific series has been inserting some explanatory comments in the subtitles, and apparently there is some missing text which might have explained this specific term.

I see that ANN's Encyclopedia does have a "Lexicon", but that is for terminology about anime. Perhaps there should also be a Glossary for phrases which are used in-show. For example, Akiba-kei is in the lexicon and belongs there because it's most likely to be used in ANN discussions, but Akihabara might belong in a Glossary if it is considered as likely to be mentioned in shows placed in Tokyo or in shows which include anime references.
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PBsallad



Joined: 19 Dec 2009
Posts: 338
Location: Phoenix
PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 1:27 pm Reply with quote
Emerje wrote:
Just going to echo some complaints: Need a better way to pause, most players you can just click on the screen to pause.


That and the spacebar. It would be great if both of those were added.
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siradix



Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Posts: 62
Location: USA
PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 4:42 pm Reply with quote
Emerje wrote:
siradix wrote:
Most of them? I would have figured only four of them would be awkward to hear.


Well if you remove "bud" which isn't related to the others, it's short for "buddy" not brother, that leaves you with 7 so four would be most since it's more than half of them. "Dear", "dearest", "beloved" and "darling" are just waaay too endearing in English. The three remaining are OK, though "bubba" is usually something only toddlers tend to say because it's easy and eventually they grow out of it.


I still know a girl who calls her brother, bubba, and she is in her twenties. So that's not always the case. As for bud, it's an example of endearment which can still be interchangeable, nothing more.

Quote:
Sure, there's no questions that it can be said in other ways, but if you acknowledge that they sound creepy then why would you want ANN to use them? That's just taking a chance at turning off the viewers. It's not like they're expecting people to learn a new language, they aren't even expecting you to remember what they're saying, they're just trying to convey that there's more than one way to address an older sibling. With that being the case it may as well just stay in Japanese.

Emerje


If I was acknowledging anything it was that it can seem out of place in western culture. You are the one who finds it "creepy," hence the quotes.
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