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Sunday Spotlight [2005-04-24]


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neoboy3000



Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 12
Location: Michigan
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:39 am Reply with quote
i dont know if i buy the bit about not wanting the cut and uncut dvds to compete with one another at the same time. i mean, in the case of yu-gi-oh, the dubbed episodes are in what, season 3 now? and they've released only a couple of the uncut discs (which i'm not sure, but may not be the REAL first episodes, which were never aired in the states). anyway, if they take the chance to release uncut yu-gi-oh, what's the hold up on pocket monsters? if not the series, they could make a crap-load of cash just by releasing the movies (up through 4, after that miramax/disney has the rights). anyway, there's always going to be stuff like this going on, it's just the way things are *shrugs*
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Nagisa
Moderator


Joined: 19 Aug 2003
Posts: 6128
Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:17 pm Reply with quote
Cloe wrote:
Well, he also partly directed Mobile Suit Zeta Gundam, which many Gundam fans consider the best Gundam incarnation ever produced.


What exactly is a "Unit Director," anyway?
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Pepperidge



Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 1095
Location: British Columbia, Canada
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:45 pm Reply with quote
What 4Kids needs to do is stop polarizing their audiences. They need to realize that they don't need to excessively change shows to make them appeal to younger kids, and they don't need to wait over a year to produce an uncut dub to market as a completely distinct entity. They just need to produce one dub, alter it where necessary for TV, and sell the uncut version at the same time. He can go on thinking that the anime fanbase is insignificant based on the sales numbers of uncut YGO and Shaman King if he wants, but things are going to change once uncut One Piece (and possibly TMM) hits the stores.
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GoodLuckSaturday



Joined: 30 Oct 2003
Posts: 567
Location: Indiana
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:45 pm Reply with quote
Sorry, but Kahn's answer for changing the music didn't make sense. If he'd have said, "Well, we edit the series, so the original score wouldn't fit," I would begin to understand, but to "Americanize" a score that didn't feel Japanese to begin with is pretty silly. At least One Piece isn't a show that puts such heavy focus on its score to portray emotions that I can really notice it's gone, but man, that replacement score is a headache.
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Tenchi



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 4324
Location: Ottawa... now I'm an ex-Anglo Montrealer.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:48 pm Reply with quote
Curses, only now do I remember the one thing I wanted Steve to ask Al Kahn that I didn't remember to ask him to ask when I was chatting with Steve on AIM!

How is One Piece doing in the ratings with the 12-17 demographic? I know that Spongebob Squarepants was beating it in the ratings by a margin of 5-to-1, when One Piece was on at 9:30 a.m., but that's only with the 6-11 Nielsen demographic. No information is available anywhere free online about the Nielsen ratings among the 12-17 demographic for Saturday morning timeslots (as the advertisers are mainly concerned with the 6-11 demographic for the Saturday morning cartoon slots).

I'd imagine more 12-17 people watch Spongebob than One Piece, but I don't think the ratings discrepancy would be quite as vast as it is for 6-11. The overall numbers would probably be smaller as a lot of people stop watching cartoons and move on to other things once they're in their mid-teens.
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Tempest
I Run this place.
ANN Publisher & CEO


Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 10012
Location: Do not message me for support.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 2:09 pm Reply with quote
GoodLuckSaturday wrote:
but to "Americanize" a score that didn't feel Japanese to begin with is pretty silly.


Your commetn made me think, and I realized that, while the score doesn't sound "Japanese" it was probably chosen to appeal to the sensibilities and tastes of Japanese viewers.

Ie: The producers probably felt that this was the best music to use for a pirate show aimed at their target demographic.

4Kids and co probably felt that there was better music for their target demographic.

-t
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Jadress



Joined: 08 Oct 2003
Posts: 806
Location: Seattle. It purdy and nerdy!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 2:21 pm Reply with quote
Aww, I'm sad the old Nobuteru Yuuki interview was so short. I'd love to see more artsy questions asked, as I am an art nerd. A lot of his Lodoss War and other fantasy work looked very Mucha inspired, which I loved.

The Speed Grapher dude and Kahn interviews were really nice. As far as the way 4Kids does stuff, I have to somewhat agree with Pepperidge- I think a lot of the edits could just be done just for the TV broadcast. But more than that, I think so many of the efforts to 'westernize' anime for kids seems to be costly and unnecessary, particularly dialogue rewrites to add cheesy jokes and new lame music. Since when has background music culturally confused anyone? I think businessmen like Kahn and other people who do stuff for kids really underestimate kids. A lot of the best kids programming has layers of jokes or connotations that only adults or teens would get- shows like Animaniacs. Plus would it kill kids to learn something about other cultures?

Needless to say the release of uncut 4kids stuff is great news and maybe will stifle some of the constant whining and constipated-grunty-straining sounds of some of the people on this forum.. ^^;
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Pepperidge



Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 1095
Location: British Columbia, Canada
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 2:26 pm Reply with quote
Keep in mind that Al Kahn mentioned an uncut release for Yu-Gi-Oh! as far back as 2002. Where are we in 2005? Three volumes in, and a delay for the rest.

I put this in the same category as Bandai's commitment to release all of Gundam in North America or Disney's commitment to release all of the Ghibli films. Yeah, it'll happen eventually, but I think that giving an uncut, faithful release for Tokyo Mew Mew is as much a priority for 4Kids as releasing Turn A Gundam is for Bandai or bringing out Ocean Waves is for Disney.

Probably less, actually.
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ACDragonMaster



Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 405
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 3:57 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
That's correct, because it's too expensive to do the dubbing and the acquisitions because we rewrite, we re-script, we re-score. So it's very difficult to do that if you don't have any other revenue streams and we have to make sure we get that.


...you know, I have to say, if it's *that* expensive to redo everything, why on earth are they doing it?

Quote:
Only to make it more Western. We westernize it so that children in English-speaking countries will understand it, and to us that is very critical.


You know, I have an INTENSE dislike for people who assume that kids are inherently unable to understand things. Because you know what? They can, and they do. Of course, if you treat kids like they can't, and that you expect them not to, they won't. But when it's clear that you expect them to be smarter than that, they *will* rise to it.

Heck, people in general will do that, but it's most obvious in kids. That's what marks the difference between a good and a bad teacher- a good teacher expects his students to succeed, and so they do.

In other words, I think that this claim by 4kids is a load of nonsense. They're just perpetuating their own myth.
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Joe Mello



Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 2088
Location: Unlocked
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:26 pm Reply with quote
Well, I do agree that saying that 4Kids properties being released uncut is saying that it's gonna rain. It'll happen eventually. However, that's no reason to get testy, nor get immensely filled with hope. Just patiently wait for the time to come. It'll be worth it, I'm sure.

I think there are two reasons why the uncut DVD's aren't a big sell. The first is the negative connotation that comes with being an uncut DVD. Some parents will think "Uncut?! Blood and violence and Communism! Oh noes!"

The second reason why the DVD's don't sell could possibly be brand loyalty or, as the case may be, brand disloyalty. Some other consumers would think. "4Kids?! Editation?! Oh noes!"

Of course the people who were screaming at 4Kids probably had the fansubs, anyway. Rolling Eyes
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Jifty



Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Posts: 35
Location: Frostburg, MD
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:27 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
I think they have to understand that because the price of these acquisitions is so high, that if they want this programming to come to the United States then they're going to have to accept the fact that it's going to be available in two styles. Because the only money that can be made that helps pay for the acquisition is obviously whether or not we're able to outfit it for the masses. And fitting it for the masses requires editing. And if we didn't do that, it'd be very difficult for us to afford to bring it in, just to release it to the anime fan who would be looking for the uncut version. I think we're trying to satisfy both sides of that by having it both ways so that we'll be able to afford them.


Oh yeah, because ADV, Geneon, Bandai, etc. are really failing for not doing what you do. Rolling Eyes
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Wyvern



Joined: 01 Sep 2004
Posts: 1139
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 7:34 pm Reply with quote
Al Kahn isn't the best guy in the world at winning arguments, I take it.

Q: Why do you guys edit anime?

A: Because it's very expensive to produce, and editing is the only way to offset those costs.

Q: Why are your series so expensive to produce?

A: Because we edit anime.

So you guys edit anime because it's expensive, and it's expensive because you edit it. Good show.

What irritates me about Kahn is how stuck-up he is. He keeps talking about "the masses" like they have the collective intellegence of jello mold-we have to change this, cut this, rewrite that, because "the masses" would riot in the streets if their dull, puny brains were confronted with the idea that people from Japan have different-sounding names.

At least it's good to know we'll all be getting uncut DVD's of The Cramp Twins sometime soon. That's the one everyone's been waiting for, right?
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Haiseikoh 1973



Joined: 24 Apr 2004
Posts: 1590
Location: Waiting for the Japanese 1000 Gunieas.
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 7:36 pm Reply with quote
Wyvern wrote:
At least it's good to know we'll all be getting uncut DVD's of The Cramp Twins sometime soon. That's the one everyone's been waiting for, right?


Who?

No seriously, what the hell are you talking about?
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Steventheeunuch





PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 8:09 pm Reply with quote
Wyvern wrote:
Al Kahn isn't the best guy in the world at winning arguments, I take it.

Q: Why do you guys edit anime?

A: Because it's very expensive to produce, and editing is the only way to offset those costs.

Q: Why are your series so expensive to produce?

A: Because we edit anime.

So you guys edit anime because it's expensive, and it's expensive because you edit it. Good show.

What irritates me about Kahn is how stuck-up he is. He keeps talking about "the masses" like they have the collective intellegence of jello mold-we have to change this, cut this, rewrite that, because "the masses" would riot in the streets if their dull, puny brains were confronted with the idea that people from Japan have different-sounding names.

At least it's good to know we'll all be getting uncut DVD's of The Cramp Twins sometime soon. That's the one everyone's been waiting for, right?


Hey, I never realised we had so many industry professionals and experts here. I mean, why the hell didn't I just interview you instead of I dunno, the CEO of a 2 billion dollar company?

Seriously, for every time you shouts "BUT ITS NOT NESSECARY 2 CUT D ANIMES Anime smile", there's several other reasons why it should, and why it does. Ontop of that, if you don't market your series correctly, then you run the risk of not licensing other things from other companies in the not too distant future.
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ANN_Bamboo
ANN Contributor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 3903
Location: The OC
PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 8:20 pm Reply with quote
Wyvern wrote:

What irritates me about Kahn is how stuck-up he is. He keeps talking about "the masses" like they have the collective intellegence of jello mold-we have to change this, cut this, rewrite that, because "the masses" would riot in the streets if their dull, puny brains were confronted with the idea that people from Japan have different-sounding names.


This may surprise you to hear, but the MAIN MARKET for the shows that 4Kids licenses and airs... is NOT a bunch of nerdy otaku. People keep assuming that anime fans buy tons of DVDs, and that several thousands of fans buy each uncut DVD, and companies like ADV and Bandai are on the same financial footing as 4Kids. You're all wrong. You people argue and argue like you know the market better than the CEO of a 2 billion dollar company, and it's ridiculous. You assume that the North American anime market is huge and wildly successful and each DVDs sells tens of thousands of copies, when you could'nt be further from the truth. He has sales figures, you don't. The end.
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