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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 9:35 pm Reply with quote
Thatguy3331 wrote:
*Sigh* The time has finally come, Index is on the shelf life colomn, the inevidable Index vs railgun arguments will begin ...

Why would Index vs Railgun arguments be inevitable, when Railgun is so clearly superior?
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getchman
He started itHe started it


Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 8677
Location: Bedford, NH
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:05 pm Reply with quote
agila61 wrote:

Why would Index vs Railgun arguments be inevitable, when Railgun is so clearly superior?


because i doubt everyone shares that opinion
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Bablioteca



Joined: 22 Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Location: REPUBLIC OF TEXAS
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:07 pm Reply with quote
Ground Control to Psychoelectric Girl (i just call it erio)

is a show about faith, to me, i thought that the baseball well encapsulated the entire series by ultimately making our mc question his own idea about 'aliens'. Yashino the spacesuit girl really twists things to an interesting perspective.
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shamisen the great



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 658
Location: Oregon, USA
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:09 pm Reply with quote
Wakazhi wrote:
I like Denpa Onna, but probably the main deal-breaker for me was the box art. I'm used to fanservice or whatever, but I just don't like anything ecchi-esque on my shelf, especially something very noticeable (i.e. NISA's LE releases) . If a standard edition blu-ray comes out, I'll definitely consider that.
I guess I've been doing this too long or I'm just desensitized to ecchi, because I didn't even register that the cover might be considered inappropriate. It seemed pretty tame to me.
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ANN_Bamboo
ANN Contributor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 3903
Location: The OC
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:50 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:

Because we all know that lightning is caused by magic instead of electrostatic discharge, and that lightning moves slowly enough that one can put their hand in the way before it hits.


HEY MAN this is a show about espers and angels who recharge mana, okay? Let's not get nitpicky about things.
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HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:54 pm Reply with quote
ANN_Bamboo wrote:
dtm42 wrote:

Because we all know that lightning is caused by magic instead of electrostatic discharge, and that lightning moves slowly enough that one can put their hand in the way before it hits.


HEY MAN this is a show about espers and angels who recharge mana, okay? Let's not get nitpicky about things.


You need to take this approach to enjoy the show at all. By the end of season 2, it becomes painfully clear that Touma's hand is a complete plot hax device and there are absolutely no logic or rules to how it works.

And that issue with the characters getting tossed aside? Yeah, it mostly just gets worse about that.
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GiriOni



Joined: 10 Aug 2012
Posts: 218
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:38 am Reply with quote
HitokiriShadow wrote:
ANN_Bamboo wrote:
dtm42 wrote:

Because we all know that lightning is caused by magic instead of electrostatic discharge, and that lightning moves slowly enough that one can put their hand in the way before it hits.


HEY MAN this is a show about espers and angels who recharge mana, okay? Let's not get nitpicky about things.


You need to take this approach to enjoy the show at all. By the end of season 2, it becomes painfully clear that Touma's hand is a complete plot hax device and there are absolutely no logic or rules to how it works.

And that issue with the characters getting tossed aside? Yeah, it mostly just gets worse about that.


Eh... plot hax device? Now I may seem biased. (lol) You need to read the LN's to understand the symbolism behind his hand, and later volumes reveal more why it works.

A Kazuma quote:
"Not explaining things really is a special sort of story structure."
Translated from the afterword of his light novel 'A Simple Monitoring'. (man this guy's titles)

While I admit the anime is flawed, even the light novel, it's not the same shounen shovel about friendship, there's deeper meaning in the story.
In the most recent light novel it explores what a human is by having a program that goes against its master (essentially having emotions), and a girl who can only thing in 'yes or no' questions (like a program).

I need to stop ranting on this subject.
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Fencedude5609



Joined: 09 Nov 2006
Posts: 5088
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:41 am Reply with quote
The symbolism is that Kamachi's a hack.
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Kastel



Joined: 19 Apr 2013
Posts: 170
Location: Chicago
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:41 am Reply with quote
GiriOni wrote:
symbolism behind his hand


His hand can do things. It's very symbolic.
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HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:53 am Reply with quote
GiriOni wrote:


Eh... plot hax device? Now I may seem biased. (lol) You need to read the LN's to understand the symbolism behind his hand, and later volumes reveal more why it works.


It's never a good sign if you have to site the novel to explain how it works.

Quote:

A Kazuma quote:
"Not explaining things really is a special sort of story structure."
Translated from the afterword of his light novel 'A Simple Monitoring'. (man this guy's titles)


What. It's hilarious that anyone would try to use this in [expletive] Index, where they spend massive amounts of details explaining how the magic or science is supposed to work.

But the real problem is that the show later ignores established rules for how magic/science works and how Touma's hand interacts with them. Index doesn't necessarily need to explain the precise details of how his hand works, in the sense that it explains how the magic circles for various spells or whatever work. It DOES need to have a logical way that his hand affects things and be consistent about it. This is where Index runs into problems.

Though honestly, this is one of the show's lesser issues. It's character issues are far bigger, along with the contrivances and contortions to let Touma resolve most situations.

Quote:

even the light novel, it's not the same shounen shovel about friendship, there's deeper meaning in the story.


This is completely irrelevant to what I was criticizing it for. Nice ideas only mean so much if the execution sucks. See also Sword Art Online and Kokoro Connect for some recent examples.
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Kastel



Joined: 19 Apr 2013
Posts: 170
Location: Chicago
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:58 am Reply with quote
HitokiriShadow wrote:
Nice ideas only mean so much if the execution sucks. See also Sword Art Online and Kokoro Connect for some recent examples.


This is not true.

Anybody who analyzes the neotextual construction in Sword Art Online will realize the role of Kirito is the writer. Many desituationisms concerning the collapse, and some would say the futility, of predialectic class may be revealed. However, I suggest that we have to choose between cultural poststructural theory and Lyotardist narrative.

Lacan uses the term ‘neotextual construction’ to denote the role of the participant, in this case the writer as Kirito, as poet. In a sense, Baudrillard’s essay on cultural objectivism implies that the goal of the writer as the character is significant form.

Any number of discourses concerning neotextual construction exist. However, if precapitalist desituationism holds, we have to choose between neotextual construction and the pretextual paradigm of context.

Most people do not realize the neotextual construction in Sword Art Online.

And the same goes with Index. In a Derridian deconstruction of the work, we can see the writer suggesting the use of textual subcapitalist theory to deconstruct class.

Index is really a ‘textual subcapitalist theory’, denoting a pretextual paradox.
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Swissman



Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 521
Location: Switzerland
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:04 am Reply with quote
Kastel wrote:
HitokiriShadow wrote:
Nice ideas only mean so much if the execution sucks. See also Sword Art Online and Kokoro Connect for some recent examples.


This is not true.

Anybody who [...]


That must be very sarcastic of you.
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zensunni



Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 1260
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:17 am Reply with quote
Every time I see an ad for Ground Control to Psychoelectric Girl I have to force myself to not click buy! I really enjoyed the series and I absolutely love NIS's art books and premium editions. But with Hanasaku Iroha already half out and not bought and Tari Tari and a few other shows coming out soon, I have to stay on budget! At the end of the series, I didn't feel that I liked it enough to purchase it. I can't let the pretty shiny art sway me, no matter how much I think that Erio has one of the best character designs on the face of the earth.
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rinkwolf10



Joined: 05 Apr 2009
Posts: 750
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:28 am Reply with quote
Honest to say, at the middle of the series I watched Index just for Touma because I liked him as a character. He scrapes to get by, but tries his best to help others, he thinks of others well being before his own.

Also, of the better plot twists is that spoiler[he loses his memory in like episode 6] which was really unexpected (moreover, the way they reveal the fact carries the most impact) and if you kept that fact in mind from then on, all his struggles carry a lot more weight and value. That even though spoiler[he doesn't remember who he was before,] he still acts the same way in helping out others and valuing others problems higher then his own. Showing that he was not acting the way he was for an ulterior motive, but it was more of at the core of his being.

Another thing I really liked was the unexpected fleshing out of Accelerator. I like how the show took a typically cynical bad guy that you thought was just an ass and rationalized his actions and showed that even characters like him could be misunderstood.

That whole thing about investing into characters and then the show changes to a whole new set of characters never really bothered me. The only character you really need to invest in is Touma. Although, I would be lieing if I said I didn't miss Mikoto's presents, if for nothing else them the comic relief she brings when the two of them meet. I really liked Mikoto but she is at her best when Touma is involved because I some why think that they have really good chemistry together.

Anyways, those are my thoughts on the series. I think if you don't try to pick apart Index (as most have shown already that you can) you could enjoy the show immensely just for it's values and what it does accomplish rather then what it doesn't.
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Fencedude5609



Joined: 09 Nov 2006
Posts: 5088
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:35 am Reply with quote
Rinkwolf wrote:

Also, of the better plot twists is that spoiler[he loses his memory in like episode 6] which was really unexpected (moreover, the way they reveal the fact carries the most impact) and if you kept that fact in mind from then on, all his struggles carry a lot more weight and value. That even though spoiler[he doesn't remember who he was before,] he still acts the same way in helping out others and valuing others problems higher then his own. Showing that he was not acting the way he was for an ulterior motive, but it was more of at the core of his being.


Oh [expletive] christ I can't even rationally respond to taste this horrible.
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