Forum - View topicThe X Button - Status Check Part 2
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B.K.
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Kato didn't write much of Xenogears and considering how he completely ruined the Chrono universe with Chrono Cross, it's a good thing he wasn't around for Xenosaga. |
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Eivion
Posts: 569 |
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I really loved the Breath of Fire series until 4 which I thought bland and unmemorable. Dragon Quarter was an interesting attempt to re-invent it to some extent, but I found the new system terribly frustrating. Its the only game I have ever actually taken back to the store. I do wish they would attempt another game in the series though.
Only played the second and third games int he Star Ocean series and the third game's big reveal killed it for me. Always dug the Western style of the Wild Arms series, but I found the series to become a bit boring and bland after the first two games. I think I'm one of the few people who loved Xenosaga. The story really interested me and i never had much of a problem with gameplay in any of the games. I just wish it wasn't rushed to the finish. One of these days though I really do need to go back and replay Xenogears for comparison, especially since I never actually beat it. I stopped at the very end due to having some troubles with the last area and boss. I honestly don't even recall much of the story at this point. |
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Emerje
 Posts: 7334 Location: Maine |
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They just announced Atelier Meruru: Alchemist of Arland for PS3, the third in that series. Seems to be a prequel featuring a much younger version of Rorona. Emerje (Ar tonelico Qoga arrived today, yay!) |
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teh*darkness
 Posts: 901 |
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Uh, afaik, Suikoden 1 IS on PSN for the US. And possibly "only" the US. Was released quite a while ago. Though I don't think they ever released the second one. Wow, lots of series covered here. SAGA- I first came to know this series though Unlimited SaGa. I don't think I played it for more than two hours before giving up on it. I tried again with the PS2 release of Romancing Saga, but after doing a little bit of level grinding shortly into the game, found the enemies seemed to have leveled 2-3x faster than me, and I couldn't kill anything before being slaughtered. Haven't touched the series since. Lufia- I only ever emulated the first two, and never beat either of them, but these were fun little games. And I never appreciated that the other two that were released in the US were both on the DS. Breath of Fire- I have fond memories of playing BoF IV. I really enjoyed the battle system, with the row mechanics, and the dragon transformations. Dragon Quarter, imho, was a horrible sequel. Putting a time limit on an RPG is the worst idea ever. I'd be willing to check out a new entry if they ever made one, though. Suikoden- I came to this party a little too late. I'd seen a friend playing the third one and thought it looked interesting enough, but could never find a copy. So my first time with the series was Suikoden 4. Good God, that game sucked so hard. I actually played quit a bit of it, despite myself, but ended up getting rid of it eventually. I tried again with number 5, and found it much improved, but just never got into it that much. Then they released Tactics, and any game with that word in the title, I stay faaaaar~~~ away from. Star Ocean- The Second Story is one of my favorite RPGs of all time. Til the End of Time ruined it. After the "big reveal" at the end of the game (I like how no one is saying what it is xD), I lost all interest in finishing the third game. I was grateful when they re-released the first two on the PSP, so that I could finally play the original game, but the remake of Second Story was brought really low by shoving the later games' battle mechanics onto it, limiting attacking to a 3-hit combo, and mages to a single attack with a wait period in between strikes. This makes it practically impossible to solo with Rena. And introducing Battle Trophies in the third game, then carrying them over into the fourth as a means to unlock in-game extras was just horrible, considering how ridiculous most of them are. This has to be the biggest fall from greatness I've ever personally witnessed. Wild ARMs- I've played every one of the numbered games in this series, though I've never beat any of them. Two and four were probably my favorites, but five is the only one I still have. I guess I'll get around to playing/finishing it someday. These were always fun, basic little RPGs. I'd like to see another full console iteration. Grandia- Ah, Grandia... First game I played here was Xtreme. I liked it quite a bit, and later tracked down the first two. I recall liking the original better than the second one. And I still have Grandia III for my PS2. JYB voicing the main character was the first thing I noticed, so I don't think I'll ever let this one go. It'd be pretty cool if they could make another entry in this series, especially if they got a budget behind it and released it on the PS3, not the 3DS or some other portable system. Atelier- 19 games in 14 years? Really?! Holy sh**! Well, currently I only own Atelier Rorona, which is fun enough, but I could never get into the Iris series, though I owned them all at one point. Too much focus on alchemy, and its effects on battles, bogged down the play for me. But the most recent games have been looking interesting, so I look forward to them coming over. Thanks, NISA! Shadow Hearts- I admit it. I bought SH because it was an M-rated RPG. I almost beat it too, until I used a gameshark code on my save file that leveled all my characters to 99 or 100, whichever it was, which made their transformations have no effect on their stats since they were already maxed out, and made them invincible... then I came across a boss battle that, my only guess is, I was supposed to die in, for the sake of the story. And I couldn't die... That killed it for me. I didn't feel like replaying the whole game just to see the last couple hours of story. Then when the sequels came out and were only rated T, I just never bothered with them. Yes, I am that shallow. >.> Xenosaga- Being used to the FF games, I didn't think it'd be a problem to pick up Xenosaga 2 when it first came out, without having played the first one. Holy crap, was I wrong. The battle system played with me and destroyed my will to live. So I tracked down a copy of the first game and played through it, and loved it. Then I tried tackling 2 again. I liked the updated character designs, but the way they changed the battle system was annoying as hell. And it didn't help that the enemies seemed to have this ability to rig the card system, so they always got the boost card on their turn, or would boost in the right order so that three turns out, they still got the boost card. I knew the system, but the AI was just freaking brutal, wouldn't even give me a chance to get the boost. Argh!!! I bought the third one just to have all of them once I heard it would be the last one, but I never completed the second, and the third is still unplayed, to this day. On a side note, Tomb Raider Trilogy comes out next week, published by Square Enix. I realize it's not really a Japanese game, but I'll give it an "honorable mention", at least. |
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FaytLein
 Posts: 1260 Location: Williamsburg, VA |
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As a die hard RPGer, I remember fondly being a kid, going across the street to the rental store and picking up a new game each week. I played the heck out of the first two Breath of Fire games, the first two Lufias, and once the PSX hit the house, I dove into Suikoden and Wild Arms too.
But I would love it if they remade Wild Arms 2, minus the insane translation and flesh out the Ogre Battle series. With only 4 games released stateside, I think that could be a great series to bring back. BoF too, just don't bring back Quarter. I understand being different, but that is just....bleh. |
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naninanino
 Posts: 680 |
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If you ask me, SO2 is the worst of the SO games I've played (2,3,4). The battle system is ancient and stops when spells are cast, it's extremely glitched, the story isn't nearly as ambitious as the 3rd, the item creation is total nonsense and the dubs are horrible compared to 3rd at least. Then only good things in it are the main duo, recruitment and private actions. In other words, it has the best characters in SO games I've played.
3 and 4 are better games. Both have a battle system that blows 2 out of the water. 3 is the only one with a decent story and 4 shines mostly with its technical issues. It's the usual RPG snobbery, the worst kind of snobbery among gaming commuties, which shows its very ugly side when speaking about SO or FF games. |
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Chrno2
 Posts: 6171 Location: USA |
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This was a really fun column. Glad to see some titles that deserve mention.
-Breath of Fire: Ah those were the days. While I do agree somewhat with your analysis of the series it's still a pretty fun series to play. Yeah the plots are pretty simple, but you have to admit it was different. There are not many RPGs out there where the cast of characters are non-humans. The closest games I can think of that barked up that tree a tad was Lunar, Grandia, Far East of Eden, (maybe) Dragon Quest, and Albert Odyssey: Legend of Eldean (another WD title, that I wish I had a chance to play) of the SS days. While a small series it sparked many a fans who in their devotion and sometimes (rabid) fandom created heated debates to link all 4 games. In a way BOF sort of turned into the Zelda of Capcom. BOF4 was the deeper of the 3, some fans didn't like it because they didn't like the character designs. But some Japanese fans liked it, even though BOF wasn't a huge franchise. As for BOF:DQ5, while trying to be different which is what all companies do, just downright pissed folks off. You just don't take the dragons out of the game. BOF5 really alienated hardcore BOF fans. Especially when those fans grew up with the earlier series. Y'know how gamers get. But other than that if you look at it for it's story you might find something you like. Personally, BOF is one of my all time favorite RPGs aside from the early FF days. I had only concerned myself about FF when IV was released here as II (Zelda was my first RPG experience). When I first saw it advertised I wanted to give it a spin. While the gaming mags touted it as being different because of the 1/4 gaming experience when compared to what Square was using I was sold. But what made the game fun for me was the timing, and the friends I had around me who also played it that made it more enjoyable, no matter how standard the game was. Then I went on to BOF2 and that became my favorite of the SNES days. There is a community called Dragon-Tear.net. They became the source to all things BOF. Think they're still around. Now if Johji Manabe did game you can only imagine what THAT would be like. Dog-men, cat-men, dragon-men/women, cat-eared babes, ugly fish people, etc... No one does more extensively than him. -Suikoden: Another great series too bad it didn't get as much attention that it deserved. Suikoden 2 seemed to be the better of the series. Plus it was great that you could continue using past data from previous games memory. I did enjoy Suikoden 5 for what I saw. It's a shame that the series popularity just fizzled like that. They have a pretty large community too. Suikosource. -Xenosaga: Can't say much about that series. If anything I was too busy wondering how it fit in with Xenogears, of course you find out that it doesn't. It would have been nice if the original creator of Xenogears had been able to continue the series the way it was meant to go. The perfect works has tons of data. Talk about text heavy. Too bad folks will never see what the series could have been Next time try sticking to simple storytelling instead of getting heavy into religious psychobabble. You have to admit it was interesting. Love it or hate it, just like EVA. Did anyone ever noticed that both were also around similar times. One end of 80's and the other early 90's. It's also good to know that the character designer behind Xenogears and Xenosaga was Kunihiko Tanaka. Does Key the Metal Idol ring a bell to anyone? -Star Ocean: Running around like a headless chicken sounds about right. Never played the series, received a copy as a b-day gift, got about barely a 1/4 of the way and it ended up in the hands of the person who gave it to me. I have to admit the music is great. Then I got to see the original SO games. I was like so this is how it's always been. Though I curiously wondered if Tri-Ace had some connection with Namco's Tales of series. -Wild Arms: I remember that game. I still have yet to finish my copy. Yep it was the title that got swept aside for FFVII. Since the both came out around the same year. Though I have to admit it was an interesting game, I enjoyed the music but I didn't get far enough to enjoy it. It was a fun game but hasn't aged as well. The 2D part is fine, but when people look at graphics from a 3D standpoint... To bad all the follow-ups couldn't grab anyone's attention either. -Grandia: I still have yet to get into that game. Funny how it's another game that you either love or hate. Grandia 2 looked interesting. -Altelier series: Never knew they could grow such a franchise from that series. Things have come a long way since Altelier Marie. -Lufia: I remember that game, never played it. Don't know if I would now that they changed the battle mechanics. Mysterious blue haired women, kind of like in the first Ys. -Shadow Hearts: I always wondered what that game was about. Demon hunters, who couldn't get into that? I heard of Koudelka didn't know they were connected. Though that Shadow Hearts: Covenant sounds awesome. C'mon who couldn't love vampire wrestlers? I practically died laughing when I heard that one. -PE: That's when Square actually did TRY to do some different things even when they were on the damn FF band wagon after FF7's success (which I'm still pondering to this day). I think the only reason why PE still managed to stick around because of Nomura's involvement. If it had been anyone else they probably wouldn't have cared. Look at what happened to other games they did. Vagrant Story, Xenogears, BFM, as well as others. Now all they do is FF no matter how trite it is. They can't do anything else yet they can't be dethroned. -SaGa: I've played the few we got on the GB. Y'know the ones labeled FF Legends? Well, those were SaGa games. At this time 2 and 3 are the only ones remade for the DS. Though I find it funny that the Romancing SaGa series spun off from the SaGa games. It would have been nice if we had got them when we needed RPGs way back when. Now the only way of seeing them is on YT through emulation. I do hope that Square considers releasing the 2 SaGa games here but I'm not holding my breath. So many memories during the days of gaming. Please find more to talk about. There are so many titles that need a little light shined on them. Keep up the great work. |
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ZeetherKID77
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The mention of Lunar reminds me that the series needs more exposure. Although it seems like the only thing we can hope for from that series is a remake of Eternal Blue on PSP. Unless the rumored Lunar 3 is going to be on 3DS (the DS Lunar from what I hear is horrible)
I have played Grandia 2 (the PS2 version, which manages to be a not so good DC port despite the PS2 being more powerful) and I found it very fun. Voice acting was cool and somewhat over the top. On a side note, the article mentioned Xenoblade and I remembered how ill-fated the title seems to be in the US: NOA took it off release schedule, then suddenly got the copyright renewed, then they have it up as "Monado" under TBA status and now it's probably DOA. Hopefully we get it or The Last Story here. |
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Dessa
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It's not snobbery. People like what they like. Personally, I think that while SO3 has the better battle system, the skill and item synthesis systems seem tacked on, especially compared to SO1 and SO2's very well-done systems. I haven't played SO4, nor the remakes (okay, I'm about a half hour into SO1's remake, but that doesn't really count), so I can't comment on those. For story... SO3 didn't have a bad story. It was the plot twist, that negated everything you did in the previous two games, and, heck, negated everything you did in the first half of that game. Take that out, and I doubt many would have a problem with SO3's story.
Umm... Eva was 1995, Xenogears was 1998 (and Xenosaga was 2003). So I'm not sure where you're getting 80s from.
Telenet Japan's Wolfteam originally came up with the concept for "Tale Phantasia", but they wanted a better publisher, so they went to Enix, and then Namco. Namco insisted on a lot of changes to the game (which eventually became Tales of Phantasia), which a) pushed back the game's release by a year, and b) caused a lot of the staff to leave Wolfteam and form Tri-Ace. Following the game's release and staff departure, they re-staffed Wolfteam, and eventually (2003) renamed it to Namco Tales Studio. So yeah, there's a connection. |
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Chrno2
Posts: 6171 Location: USA |
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You're right, where the hell did I get that from? Gawd, was the early 90's that far away that when friends were passing around the bootlegs that I for some reason thought it was 89? Thanks for correcting me. Well, again see how close they are in years. Though I know a game reviewer who HATED Xenogears to the point that you felt that deep down he loved it. It was funny reading his breakdown of the series. Think it was the whole Chu-chu Jesus thing.
Thank you! I always figured there was some connection but it was a matter of finding the link. The reason I brought this up was because if you look at some of the early Tales of games (ie.- Tales of Destiny, which we got) and SO2 you can see a similarity in the menu interface. Not to mention both game series had the same composer Motoi Sakuraba. Though I'm sure there was more to it than just the obvious. Yet both used some form of active battle system. Thanks for the info. I'm actually reading it now. |
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bravetailor
Posts: 817 |
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Not much to say since JRPG fans (and anime fans who play JRPGs) always have their own opinions about the genre and specific games.
Though I do think BOF Dragon Quarter is lacking in supporters around here. I think it was a very interesting game and IMO, misunderstood. Then again, I've always felt the rest of the series was pretty bland. And I've been playing the series since the SNES days. (Now, as for why I would play something I feel was "bland", well, I was just a diehard JRPG fan in the SNES days. So I had to play everything. And I'm not saying I didn't enjoy BOF, just that they didn't stand out to me as special) |
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naninanino
Posts: 680 |
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To be frank. 2,3,4 all have similar plot twists. You're always doing something else for the beginning of the game and then BANG, you're doing something else. This holds true to events after Expel in 2, Styx in 3 and the 2nd visit to Aeos in 4. |
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teh*darkness
Posts: 901 |
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The plot twist in SO2 isn't really a plot twist, it's a continuation of the already established story at the beginning of the game, and the realization of what the Sorcery Globe is that you've been tracking through the whole of Disc 1, and finding out where it came from. That's not even close to what they did at the end of SO3. And I can't comment on 4, as I haven't played it all that much, but iirc, it's supposed to be a prequel, taking place even before SO1, which means it falls under the "reveal" in SO3, so anything crazy they do at the end of Last Hope wouldn't really surprise me, since I already know the circumstances of the universe the game takes place in. |
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naninanino
Posts: 680 |
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No, it is exactly the same. In 2 you're tracking Sorcery Globe and BANG, you are in a completely random place with slightly altered objectives. It's exactly the same as in 3. You're hunting the 4D beings, when all of the sudden you are in a completely random place and must re-evaluate your objectives. The events after Expel is no small deal, it is definitely a plot twist. |
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Shale
Posts: 337 Location: The Middle of Nowhere, DE |
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I liked the way 3 did it. Instead of just being a random switchup, it started out with a war being interrupted by the arrival of Fayt and Cliff - beings with technology far more advanced than anything on that planet, enough so to swing the balance instantly. Then, once they're finally free to leave, their war is crashed by the 4D beings, a civilization as far beyond them as they are beyond Elicoor. There's a symmetry to it that's far more satisfying than "Oh crap, the wise men want to blow up the universe, better stop them."
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