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Spoken like a true anime outsider would say about anime.

(How many times have anime fans say "art is art and art is subjective and regardless no to any censorship." If some say Qwaser is crap, would it still be OK to edit it? Hmmm.............)

Most of anything is disposable entertainment, and that includes anime.

I was talking about the lack of artistic substance in modern American cartoons which is so painfully obvious that they have none. They're 99% ripoffs or remakes of old stuff. Which is why you can't make a business out of them like the Japanese can with their anime.

And at this point, this is all assuming there's even a strong market in Japan for US comics and animation. o the question is: Is there a strong market for US comics and animation in Japan?

And Qwaser is a bad example, there's no way, no matter how much you try, can the contents get passed the censorship and still end up making a show out of what's left.

See: the TV broadcast of Qwaser. It was hilarious, to say the least; whole minutes of footage would be a static image with the dialog. Qwaser is awesome, and yeah, it did pretty well, so we get to see the second manga arc animated. I'm looking forward to it.

enurtsol wrote:

mdo7 wrote: Also, Funimation version of Shin-Chan was indeed the way I would watch it. As Justin Cook said on ANNcast, the show in the Japanese version is inappropriate for kids in US, but too kiddish for adult audience. Hence, why the rewrite and changes. Adult Swim/Williams Street helped in acquiring it too, so it had to be tailored to their taste.

Mother*******. It's bad enough they ruined many of the great jokes in the Japanese version (which could've easily translated into "American" quite easily), but a frelling Cable Network had a hand in the editing process as well?

**** this ****.

asimpson2006 wrote:

Sunday Silence wrote: enurtsol wrote: mdo7 wrote: Also, Funimation version of Shin-Chan was indeed the way I would watch it. As Justin Cook said on ANNcast, the show in the Japanese version is inappropriate for kids in US, but too kiddish for adult audience. Hence, why the rewrite and changes. Adult Swim/Williams Street helped in acquiring it too, so it had to be tailored to their taste. Mother*******. It's bad enough they ruined many of the great jokes in the Japanese version (which could've easily translated into "American" quite easily), but a frelling Cable Network had a hand in the editing process as well? **** this ****. I didn't see anything wrong with the Shin-chan rewrite. They made it much funnier. They didn't ruin it.

You've got a point there. In fact, I quite like the Funimation Shin Chan. It's anything but G rated or bland like most of CN's previous work. I even liked the ending theme, but there has yet to be a Funimation song I've yet not to like.

The series was pretty much left the same with the exception of the names and some other minor bits.

Pointless stupid anger at CN.

enurtsol wrote:

Spoken like a true anime outsider would say about anime. (How many times have anime fans say "art is art and art is subjective and regardless no to any censorship." If some say Qwaser is crap, would it still be OK to edit it? Hmmm.............) Most of anything is disposable entertainment, and that includes anime.

I was talking about the lack of artistic substance in modern American cartoons which is so painfully obvious that they have none. They're 99% ripoffs or remakes of old stuff.

Which is why you can't make a business out of them like the Japanese can with their anime. I'm not trying to be biased against American cartoons and make Japan look like the God of animation, but it's clear that the Japanese are doing something right to get loyal fans and keeping them in while American cartoons don't condition the viewers to stay into animation as they get older anymore.

And what's stopping Japanese viewers from doing what we do? Not watch the dub if it's bad or butchered. Problem solved.

So how come American animators don't step in and do the same thing? Simple, American animation is not big business and does not have a fan base like anime does, both domestic and internationally.

Therefore, no one cares how American cartoons they are treated elsewhere, and as far as we know, the Japanese generally don't like them anyway with very few exceptions.

And Qwaser is a bad example, there's no way, no matter how much you try, can the contents get passed the censorship and still end up making a show out of what's left. You either like it or you don't, there's no way of changing it, apparently it was popular enough in Japan for them to make a 2nd season.

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

Pointless stupid anger at CN.

How is it pointless when the end product wasn't funny, or at best, toilet humor that never fit in with the material it was trying to replace?

Like I said, spoken like a true anime outsider talking about anime.
(Like when someone doesn't watch enough anime.)

You have a point here though, but it's more complicated than that.

TopGunman wrote:

And what's stopping Japanese viewers from doing what we do? Not watch the dub if it's bad or butchered. Problem solved.

Japan almost always dub animation.

TopGunman wrote:

So how come American animators don't step in and do the same thing? Simple, American animation is not big business and does not have a fan base like anime does, both domestic and internationally.

When the main The Simpsons voice cast are each earning at least $400K per episode, it's big business. Domestic animation is big business - they earn more than domestic anime. Maybe not many TV series so much internationally, though a lot of them are distributed worldwide because their parent companies own networks all around the world and thus merchandise everywhere. But definitely theatrical animation.

The American animators don't usually step in because they generally want their works to be enjoyed by as much people around the world as possible.

TopGunman wrote:

Therefore, no one cares how American cartoons they are treated elsewhere, and as far as we know, the Japanese generally don't like them anyway with very few exceptions.

That we don't know. Because the American animation otaku over there is as much niche as we are here. On the mainstream, however, generally Disney/Dreamworks/WB/etc. films outdo any anime except Studio Ghibli.

TopGunman wrote:

And Qwaser is a bad example, there's no way, no matter how much you try, can the contents get passed the censorship and still end up making a show out of what's left. You either like it or you don't, there's no way of changing it, apparently it was popular enough in Japan for them to make a 2nd season.

But that wasn't the question. If it's crap, should it still be edited?

Sunday Silence wrote:

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote: Pointless stupid anger at CN. How is it pointless when the end product wasn't funny, or at best, toilet humor that never fit in with the material it was trying to replace?

Maybe not your kind of humor, but it's the kind of humor Williams Street likes, and it did enough to pick up 2 seasons worth of 52 episodes.

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

Pointless stupid anger at CN.

How is it pointless when the end product wasn't funny, or at best, toilet humor that never fit in with the material it was trying to replace?

The Americanized Shin Chan not being funny is only soley YOUR opinion. The Adult Swim run was quite long over two years and brought in extraordinarly well ratings. The DVDs sold just as well too.

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

The Americanized Shin Chan not being funny is only soley YOUR opinion. The Adult Swim run was quite long over two years and brought in extraordinarly well ratings. The DVDs sold just as well too.

Then why did Funi drop it?

TitanXL wrote:

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote: The Americanized Shin Chan not being funny is only soley YOUR opinion. The Adult Swim run was quite long over two years and brought in extraordinarly well ratings. The DVDs sold just as well too. Then why did Funi drop it? :?

Cartoon Network could only get 52 episodes for broadcast. It also preformed better than Detective Conan which only ran on Adult Swim for 16 weeks.

enurtsol wrote:

Like I said, spoken like a true anime outsider talking about anime. (Like when someone doesn't watch enough anime.)

And how much anime is 'enough anime'? because I think 50+ is so much

enurtsol wrote:

TopGunman wrote: And what's stopping Japanese viewers from doing what we do? Not watch the dub if it's bad or butchered. Problem solved. Japan almost always dub animation.

But surely the original track is on the DVD's with optional on/off subs. Switch to that and problem solved.

The Simpsons is one of those few exceptions, plus it's been going on for years so everyone knows how the show is, or rather how it should be as it's gotten bad as the years went by. It's not like those almost every other cartoon that's made to keep the brats busy while the parents relax as TitanXL put it. Keep in mind that The Simpsons, Family Guy and whatnot are not made by solely animation studios, Fox makes TV shows, movies, documentaries, and has it's own new station and all the money they get from all those they are able to give The Simpsons people higher salaries than other companies.

enurtsol wrote:

TopGunman wrote: Therefore, no one cares how American cartoons they are treated elsewhere, and as far as we know, the Japanese generally don't like them anyway with very few exceptions. That we don't know. Because the American animation otaku over there is as much niche as we are here. On the mainstream, however, generally Disney/Dreamworks/WB/etc. films outdo any anime except Studio Ghibli.

That's not what I'm hearing, I hear that non-Japanese including Disney do so-so business over there.

enurtsol wrote:

TopGunman wrote: And Qwaser is a bad example, there's no way, no matter how much you try, can the contents get passed the censorship and still end up making a show out of what's left. You either like it or you don't, there's no way of changing it, apparently it was popular enough in Japan for them to make a 2nd season. But that wasn't the question. If it's crap, should it still be edited?

In today's world, no.

enurtsol wrote:

Sunday Silence wrote: GrilledEelHamatsu wrote: Pointless stupid anger at CN. How is it pointless when the end product wasn't funny, or at best, toilet humor that never fit in with the material it was trying to replace? Maybe not your kind of humor, but it's the kind of humor Williams Street likes, and it did enough to pick up 2 seasons worth of 52 episodes.

And it's not airing anymore, and theirs 672 more episodes to go, so your point?

I love Detective Conan; sadly it kind of doesn't work in America. It's too violent to be for kids like in Japan, and it's not really 'adult swim' material. Shame the dub never even got to Ai.