Forum - View topicNEWS: Ursula K. Le Guin on Gedo Senki
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DragonsRevenge
 Posts: 1150 |
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Guess I interpreted it wrong. And yeah, I ment the dark tower. There's a song called the Gunslinger, about the guy from the Dark Tower. My mistake. |
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skogga
 Posts: 29 Location: TN |
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LeGuin should not throw around criticism like "cutting corners" and "incoherence" without reference to her own work's flaws.
Likely this outcome may herald the cessation of attempts to adapt other english language works to animation in Japan. |
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MorwenLaicoriel
 Posts: 1617 Location: Colorado |
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I doubt it'll have THAT much of an impact. Howl's Moving Castle was also based on an english language novel, and that movie did excellently in Japan, AND the author was very positive of that movie as well. And even though Hayao Miyazaki's saying it's not good, and Le Guin's politely disappointed, the movie's doing well in the box office. I don't think that this will scare off the Japanese from trying to adapt english novels. |
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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I think Ms. Le Guin needs to just deal with it. I'm not a fan of Hayao Miyazaki, but c'mon. If I were "Mr. Hayao" I'd feel no shame in doing EXACTLY the same thing. Let's see:
-"Twenty or so years ago, Mr Hayao Miyazaki wrote me expressing interest in making an animated film based on the (then only three) books of Earthsea." (so, this would be when Hayao Miyazaki is an up-and-coming director) -"Six or seven years ago, my friend Vonda N. McIntyre told me about My Neighbor Totoro and we watched it together." (which is "coincidentally" around the time between "Mononoke Hime" (Miyazaki's first wide American release film) and "Spirited Away" (Miyazaki's Oscar winning film)) Again, I don't blame him at all. So, when I'm wanting to make your film, I'm not good enough, but suddenly when I'm a well known acclaimed director (the guy whose movies all are blockbusters in Japan) I'm "good enough" to adapt your novels. I'd also toss it to my "up and comer" (in this case, his son) and see what he could do with it, or else I'd have just tossed it back and said "thanks, but no thanks". I'm not saying it's not kinda rude on Ghibli's part, but I don't blame Hayao Miyazaki for not wanting to do it anymore. |
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Twage
Posts: 356 Location: North Bergen, NJ |
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Yeah, well, if you got a letter from some director you'd never heard of in a foreign country asking if he could screw around with your life's work you probably wouldn't think twice about it either.
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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But see, then I wouldn't go back over a decade later and ask him to do it. It's like having Spielberg come to ou in the late 70s offering to make your movie and you turn him away because he does sci fi and the only SciFi you know is Star Trek and you don't like that. But then later you see Schindlers List and think to yourself that the narrow view you pigeon-holed him in, based entirely on work that isn't even his is wrong and now that he's successful, hey he's a-ok. Better to just regret the missed opportunity or suck it up if he doesn't give you the respect you think YOU deserve. |
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mufurc
 Posts: 612 |
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Now, that's just pure speculation. We don't know their correspondence, how they were worded, what kind of extra information their messages to each other contained. Le Guin writes that back then she only knew Disney-type animation (and seriously, who would want Disney to adapt their life work?), then when she saw Totoro, she realized that this was good. I don't think she's lying. Mononoke and Chihiro made many people realize that animation =/= Disney and cartoons for kids (just read the reviews from back then), and many people became interested in anime, or at least Miyazaki's works. If I were in Le Guin's place, I would've definitely mentioned this to my message to Miyazaki sr. And if it was wounded pride that kept Miyazaki sr. from making the movie now, then maybe he should learn some humility. Getting to make an adaptation of a work, especially something like Earthsea, is a privilege and he should treat the matter accordingly. (As for tossing it to his "up and comer," as far as I know he was vehemently against his son making this movie, which I can absolutely understand - as I said, no-one with no experience in directing or animation should make a movie for such a big-name studio.)
But she didn't ask him to do it, she just said that if he was still interested he had her permission, which also implied that he had her permission, and not someone else. She says she was led to believe that Miyazaki sr. would oversee the production, which was the sole reason she agreed to Ghibli making the adaptation. She couldn't have known that Ghibli would let Miyazaki sr. do as he pleases and let him withdraw from the production, after all that, for whatever reason. This is extremely rude and arrogant on Ghibli's part, and even more so because they were dealing with such an acclaimed and popular author. I think Le Guin should be commended for dealing with the whole mess so diplomatically, other authors wouldn't be so polite. (Anne Rice, anyone?  )
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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It IS just specualtion, but seriously you (and Ms. Le Guin) are saying that she took what she knew about a single studio (granted, the best in America) that he was not even a part of or even in the same COUNTRY as, she was judging him based on that studio which was by most/all accounts in its WORST period in ITS history. (late 70s-early 80s is generally acknowledged as the time right before the Disney revival in the late 80s with Little Mermaid) Then, she didn't even have the courtesy to look into Miyazaki's work HERSELF just to check her own prejudice she instead gets shown one of his works during (what is arguably) HIS strongest American timeframe, and suddenly everything is great.
I'm not saying "Miyazaki is awesome", I don't even really like many Ghibli works (Spirited Away and Porco Rosso being notable exceptions). But I'm saying it's kinda bitchy to expect a man who IS trying to retire (albeit, doing so in a continuous "one more time" kinda way) to be right there for your movie after you treat him that way. Again, I think Ghibli should have just said "thanks, but no thanks", but I don't blame Miyazaki for not wanting to 'waste' whatever he has left in the tank adapting her book. |
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mufurc
Posts: 612 |
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But you see, the majority of people are not interested in animation. Most non anime fan people I know could care less about animation in general, and some of them even have problems watching animated features. They can't get over the fact that it's two-dimensional, the prejudice that cartoons are for children and are thus infantile, that the characters are deformed (compared to real life), that they can't fully read their expressions, etc. etc... actually, many people I know have trouble telling anime characters apart. (An example: my mother who has no interest in animation whatsoever but usually likes what I like, watched three anime features so far, the Utena, Escaflowne and GITS movies. In case of the first two she kept confusing the characters with each other, and I had to pause the movie occasionally to tell her who was who. She had no such problems with GITS because there were few characters and they didn't look alike, and the chara design was not entirely alien for her. In fact, GITS was one of the very few animated features she enjoyed.)
Most people have an image of "animation" in their heads and are simply not interested enough to see if it's a correct image or not. They see a Disney film or a Cartoon Network feature or an anime, they don't like it, and their opinion of animation is formed. I'm not saying this is good, but that's life for you. So the thing is, one shouldn't expect anyone to be interested in animation, and certainly not to the extent to do research on the topic just because some guy she's never heard about told her he'd like to adapt her work as a cartoon. Maybe if it was someone she's heard about before, or someone a friend of hers knew, or something like that, then she wouldn't have dismissed him so easily. Or if he sent her a copy of, say, Laputa or Nausicaa so that she could base her decision on that. (I would definitely do that, especially if I'm writing to someone who most probably hasn't the faintest idea who I am. I mean, really, to Le Guin his offer probably sounded something like "Hello, I'm Some Guy from a faraway country, and I make cartoons. Could I make a cartoon out of your life work that you guard like a tigress? Please?" For a better impression, imagine the LotR cartoon adaptation playing in the background.) I don't think Miyazaki had any right being offended by the way his request was treated (and in fact, I don't think he was... and if he was, holding a twenty-year-old grudge is not very commendable). |
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cymbol
Posts: 23 |
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I thought about HeeroTx's version of what happened, even though it is just speculation. Heck, I was just about to post exactly the same thing before I read my own words under a different name.
I don't see a problem with her criticism of the film. It didn't fit her idea of what she tried to convey. Tough. I don't feel bad for Miyazaki Goro, either. The author didn't like his adaptation much. Tough. Anyone would be upset, and rightly so, if one's life's work wasn't perceived as what one thought it would be. But perhaps more importantly, she said it was a good film. Miyazaki was not trying to write a book, but was directing a film. To him who said that it is a previlege to make an animation out of the works of someone as famous as Le Guin, that goes both ways: it is also a previlege to have one's work made into an animated film. As far as fame goes, one is only famous to people who has heard of him (or insert /her if it pleases you); I wonder if the average anime watcher has read Le Guin, or cared to, before the making of this feature. Would it sow more interest in her books? Miyazaki faced much stress, pressure, and risk in this work; the well established author who has long finished these books did not, however tarnished she might have believed her ideals were. And as such, Miyazaki deserves some credit for this alone. To him who remarked that it is not commendable to hold 20 year grudges, I shall provide two responses. 1. It is human. 2. It might not have been a grudge; perhaps Miyazaki Hayao didn't want to butcher Le Guin's work (whether he did that to others aside); perhaps he simply lost interest (maybe the later books sucked, or he doesn't have the energy, etc.). And lastly, to him (including Le Guin, or insert /her if it pleases you) who believes that Le Guin was cheated into believing that Miyazaki Hayao would be "overseeing" the production of the film, I ask, does a car need two steering wheels? |
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mufurc
Posts: 612 |
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I beg to differ, but let's agree to disagree. (Still, I doubt Victor Hugo would feel honored by the Disney version of The Hunchback of Notre-Dame, or Tolkien by the LotR cartoon adaptation...)
Er, she didn't because there was no need? She wrote the books long ago and she had nothing to do with the adaptation (although she says she offered ideas which were apparently ignored).
To "her," actually.  Anyway, that's what I also said, that I don't believe Miyazaki (sr) was offended by Le Guin turning down his offer. Studios and directors always seek material to adapt and it's only natural that some authors don't give them permission to adapt their works. It's nothing out of the ordinary.
She says: "We were very disappointed, and also anxious, but we were given the impression, indeed assured, that the project would be always subject to Mr Hayao's approval." I don't think she was "cheated into" believing this, I think the problem was that somewhere along the line Miyazaki sr. decided to leave the project (apparently because he couldn't accept Goro directing it). I'm not saying he had no right to do this, but it was rather rude toward Le Guin who offered her permission to him and apparently only agreed to Goro directing the movie because she was assured that he would oversee the production. I'm sure he had a good reason for leaving the production but I also understand why Le Guin feels disappointed by this. |
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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Do you honestly think Gedo Senki would have seen the light of day, or that Goro Miyazaki would have finished it, if Hayao Miyazaki "couldn't accept" him directing it? The one thing I'll give to Ms. Le Guin is that if Hayao Miyazaki WANTED to be involved with Gedo Senki, Hayao Miyazaki WOULD HAVE been involved with Gedo Senki. |
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