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Answerman - This Old Dub

I do admit that the series had too many main characters with names that started with M: Mamoru, Makoto, Minako, Michiru. Their names in the old dub were Darien, Lita, Mina, and Michelle respectively. Not as bad. I actually learned in creative writing that it's never a good idea to have multiple lead characters with names that start with the same letter. It just gets confusing. It's not that bad in Sailor Moon since the characters are introduced at different times, but that was one thing I appreciated about the old dub.

Justin is right. The creator of SM, from what I've read, hated the American chop-job, so there is no way in hell she would ever approve it.

people can forgive those edits just like with the pioneer editing of DBZ

jr0904 wrote:

people can forgive those edits just like with the pioneer editing of DBZ

Well, first of all, Pioneer didn't edit DBZ, to my knowledge. They distributed, as Funimation's distribution wasn't a thing then. It was Barry Watson et al at Funimation who did the editing, the chopping, the censorship, and script changes.

I'm surprised at the dearth of examples on the lip-flap issue. For example, I thought Ghibli routinely did voices before the animation.

BooktapC wrote:

From your column since you wrote that the creators don't really care about dubs of the 90's sorry if misunderstood something. Not sure what you meant since could have read in a different way? Let me know what you meant! I would love to know what you meant to say from your column.

You're taking what Justin said as being absolute & without exception. Normally, the Japanese don't care about some seemingly-random edited dub of a product from the 90s, and possibly even the early-00s... But then you have exceptions like Sailor Moon, where the original creator DOES care about the DiC.

And by "care" I mean she's hates it & doesn't want it being re-released; Zac even talked about it slightly on the ANNCast that came out today. What Justin is saying is that the moments we get these edited dubs are because the Japanese don't care, which is most of the time, but the moments we don't is usually because they do care, which is rare but does happen.

I'll be honest not entirely sure what it is you are really meaning now but since really dislike extremely long discussions. I'll say thanks for at least attempting to explain things. Still sort of confused but that is okay! I am just glad that Sailor Moon is releasing in North America and getting a new dub. That's all I need to know.

Aquasakura wrote:

Concerning the answer to the first question: I never (at least so far) have this problem of noticing the characters’ mouth movements don’t match the voice. It’s only obvious for me when I either watch a non-animated movie or show that has been dubbed over, or the animation makes it that obvious (which seems to usually happen with animated shows that are not well put together from my experience). I guess I’m not that observant when it comes to that aspect with animation.

Probably you're not used enough to Japanese language syllables that ya can't trace it to lip-flaps yet, e.g. when you're watching, you're just reading the subtitles and not matching the sounds to the lip-flaps.

Aquasakura wrote:

Concerning the answer to the third question: I know those dubs can be found on Youtube (or at least the Sailor Moon one as my sister was watching them a while back on that site for old times’ sake. I’m just assuming the Cardcaptor Sakura dubs can be found on Youtube as well). With that said, I’m with the Awnserman on this one concerning of not seeing them anytime soon. Besides those dubs were very terrible, and it doesn’t seem like many people want to see those dubs.

Not so much for Cardcaptors, since it was so radically rearranged in the U.S. to make Li Syaoran the co-focus for the boys-dominated cartoon market. Though it seems for Canada and some other countries, a complete dub was done by Nelvana.

(Wish I kept a copy of that year's public financial papers that, as a publicly-traded company, Nelvana had to publish regularly for investors, detailing its assets and acquisitions including how many millions of $$ it paid for CCS for how many years.)

But trust me, a lot of people still want to see the old Sailor Moon dub. People like it enough despite everything. Especially in Canada where it got big that the Canadian dub VAs were celebrities and of course the famous Canadian band Barenaked Ladies' 1998 Billboard #1 hit "One Week" include the lyrics:

Gotta get in tune with Sailor Moon
'Cause the cartoon has got the boom anime babes
That make me think the wrong thing

And that's why them SM dub voice cast will be on Anime Expo this coming July.

Aquasakura wrote:

Although there have been cases that an old dub has been re-release. For example a company called Discoteck Media has re-release old dubs of these shows called Samurai Pizza Cats and Monster Rangers. So I guess there are those who do want to see the old dubs probably for nostalgia reasons (or so as a means they can get together with their friends and rip off/make fun of just how terrible they were).

Those dubs weren't terrible though. Changed in the case of Samurai Pizza Cats, but not terrible. Heck, that's the only reason people even remember that show. Before that, people hadn't heard of it, and even afterwards, fansubbers weren't interested in subbing the original (back then, we did try to find anyone who's interested in doing it).

IMHO here's my thoughts on this, as one who's probably on SM mailing lists before many of ya had even heard of it, being on this phenomenon relatively early instead of years after original broadcast:

I think initially Naoko Takeuchi was reveling on her surprise worldwide fame and riches beyond her wildest dreams. Why wouldn't she? She's young and relatively fresh to the top; it's her first big megahit; it's what made her to where she's now. Anybody in her position would be reveling. She was even smiling from ear-to-ear when she visited the Anime Crash store traveling in the U.S. - here's a photo!



(Now ya guys be asking what's Anime Crash? )

And here's a letter:

• In the planning stage for this new Sailor manga serial, her editor, Mr. OsaBU (called "Osappi" in English in Mixxzine) suggested Naoko-sensei about creating Sailor suited soldier as new character. Then, she got the idea from "Go-ranger" (Power Ranger) to make 5 sailor soldiers as a team. Sailor Moon's story was staged in space because Naoko-sensei was a big fan of "Uchuu Senkan Yamato."
  
  Sailor Moon had a blessed start. Kodansha and Toei took a strategy called "Media Mix" which not only publishes manga but also takes it to TV at the same time.
  
  Naoko-sensei originally prepared story only for one season to go with the TV series (nobody thought it was going to be such a BIG hit), therefore, she repeatedly struggled to come up with new story for each season.
  
  TV episodes caught up with manga in the end of the first season. That's why "Makaiju-hen" (Doomtree series) was added to TV's R season. So, there's no Ann or Alan in manga! Remember!!!
  
  She told Mr. OsaBU "I wanna quit!" at numerous times. She says "It was incredibly dreamy 5 years. Even though I struggled at times, I was having fun, joy, and happiness of my life."
  
  She really appreciates all the support received from fans and people who helped her during the five years.
  
  
  A message from Naoko-sensei to fans in all over the world
  
  Naoko-sensei wrote a message for fans all over the world in "Genga-shuu Vol. 5." I think a lot of fans in the US also own this book. But did you all know that there is a message for us in the end? It's written in Japanese.
  
  The following is an excerpt/summary of what she says in that message.
  
  (She said she read fan letter from Jakarta and another one from Reunion Island after completing the drawing of the cover of this book.)
  
  
  
  • There are people who support Sailor Moon manga or anime in places where I don't even know! This is exciting!
    
    Everytime I read fan letters from somewhere far away, it brings tears in my eyes. Tears of joy. It warms up my heart and makes me say "I'm going to live my life fully from tomorrow."
    
    I was able to discover this kind of joy by drawing Sailor Moon.
    
    First, "Sailor Moon" was a little personal world made up and existed only in my mind. But now with many people's work, it's spread all over the world.
    
    Seeing many people from all over the world writing to me and saying "I love Sailor Moon," I know that it happened for real. I won't say "I can't believe it" anymore.
    
    I used to think people in other countries have different languages, lifestyle, race, and therefore, it is difficult to understand each other. But now I know everybody is the same human being. With everybody's power, everybody can share the same feeling.
    
    I have many dreams. One of them is to look at the earth from space. But now, I can think the same thing that an astronaut would think by looking at the earth from space even when I am sitting down facing my desk or laying in my bed.
    
    There's only one earth.
    
    I am very very happy that I can feel this joy.
    
    I am so glad that I drew Sailor Moon. Thank you so much everybody. I dedicate this book to all the Sailor Moon fans all over the world with love. Wishing everybody happiness.....
    
    Naoko Takeuchi
    5/23/1997
  
  

These were not isolated incidents. She was enjoying herself. She was enjoying all these different adaptations around the world. (Surely ya guys don't think the N. American version was the only one that made some changes, right?)

SM was planned ("manufactured") from the start to become a hit in Japan - that's why the manga, the anime, the merchandise, the marketing blitz, etc. all came about almost simultaneously. (It wasn't the traditional route where an artist toils on her manga -> the manga gets successful enough to become an anime -> anime becomes a hit -> merchandise!) That it became a worldwide phenomenon exceeded the production committee's expectations. Those adaptations did their job, what they're supposed to do --make them money and famous-- and Naoko Takeuchi was a premiere cog going along in that machine.


Now, as not too uncommon as artists become older, they become more attached and look back on what else they could've done with their baby. SM was Takeuchi's big breakthrough, her magnum opus, her one big baby. Of course she'd wanna go back and do her one and only properly, this time do it her way, without needing Toei and production committee alongside to emphasize manufacturing a lucrative phenomenon around the world.

BooktapC wrote:

I'll be honest not entirely sure what it is you are really meaning now but since really dislike extremely long discussions. I'll say thanks for at least attempting to explain things. Still sort of confused but that is okay! I am just glad that Sailor Moon is releasing in North America and getting a new dub. That's all I need to know.

No one in Japan gives a crap about Lily C.A.T. or Samurai Pizza Cats, but people, including it's creator, still care about the original Sailor Moon, and remember it fondly.

You seem to be making it a more complicated issue than it is.

I heard that whoever dub Cardcaptor Sakura (I forgot the name of the company)

were trying to make Syaoran appear to be the main character of the show.

However if that was the case they didn't do such a good with it. I can vaguely remember seeing a few episodes of Cardcaptor Sakura (which they just called "Cardcaptors" as you probably know) and I got the impression the main focus of the show was Sakura instead of Syaoran.

By the way why do you wish you had those financial papers of whatever particular year?

enurtsol wrote:

Changed in the case of Samurai Pizza Cats, but not terrible. Heck, that's the only reason people even remember that show. Before that, people hadn't heard of it, and even afterwards, fansubbers weren't interested in subbing the original (back then, we did try to find anyone who's interested in doing it).

Wow! The U.S dub that show were that good that know one bother to translate the Japanese dub at the time. Never heard this before. Well just in case you are still interested Discoteck Media has also already release the Japanese dub of Samurai Pizza Cats with English subtitles late last month. http://www.discotekmedia.com/kyatto_ninden_teyandee.htm

Interesting! I been wanting to know the history behind the making if Sailor Moon ever since after reading Codename: Sailor V. As for Anime Crash I wouldn't have heard of it, but not just because I wasn't as familair with Japanese animation at the time, but I am going to assume it was in California (most likely located in Los Angeles) and I don't live in that state. That and I also haven't heard of a Sailor Moon mailing lists, but again it wasn't like I could have heard of such a thing at the time.

As for Animax dubs, I thought the Nodame Cantabile dub, which can be heard in the stream carried by Crackle, was pretty decent. The actors don't have the panache of Kawasumi Ayako and Seki Tomokazu though.

No US dvd release yet is surprising though.

I think Justin was speaking about anime for television with their limited budgets.

It just gets confusing. It's not that bad in Sailor Moon since the characters are introduced at different times, but that was one thing I appreciated about the old dub.

Without a useful M&E track, any dub production would require coming up with an all-new audio track, including sound effects and music queues.