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Mohawk52
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 12:18 pm
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Steroid wrote: | Yes, I favor the doers over the stand-stillers, the new to the status quo. And I believe that a single person's enjoyment is more important that many peoples' peace.* I believe in being narrow and deep.* |
*Read self-centered and inconsiderate.
Quote: | To me, life is about achieving happiness, not avoiding pain. |
No matter who, or how many peoples lives you trample over to achieve it. In the UK that's known as "anti-social behavior" and it's against the law if done in public.
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Steroid
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 329
Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 2:03 pm
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Mohawk52 wrote: | Read self-centered and inconsiderate. |
Yes, I am self-centered rather than other-people-centered. Why should a person be otherwise?
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Quote: | To me, life is about achieving happiness, not avoiding pain. |
No matter who, or how many peoples lives you trample over to achieve it. In the UK that's known as "anti-social behavior" and it's against the law if done in public. |
Trampling lives is not what is done by yaoi fangirls. Trampling lives is what is done by laws proscribing anti-social behavior.
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Mohawk52
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
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Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 2:53 pm
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Steroid wrote: |
Mohawk52 wrote: | Read self-centered and inconsiderate. |
Yes, I am self-centered rather than other-people-centered. Why should a person be otherwise? |
If you weren't such a hikikomori, you wouldn't need to ask.
Quote: | Trampling lives is not what is done by yaoi fangirls. Trampling lives is what is done by laws proscribing anti-social behavior. |
You wouldn't be one of those anarchists types would you? With an attitude like that you would be a perfect candidate for an ASBO.
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Zalis116
Moderator
Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 6867
Location: Kazune City
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:49 am
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Just out of curiosity, since this is as good a place as any to post about it: Is AnswerMan on a one-week hiatus, or has the posting been delayed? Don't worry, we all know you're busy, Zac, but a little "No AnswerMan this week; please enjoy these cute kitten photos" on the front page would soothe the burning antici--pation that rages within us all
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 1:35 am
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Zalis116 wrote: | Just out of curiosity, since this is as good a place as any to post about it: Is AnswerMan on a one-week hiatus, or has the posting been delayed? Don't worry, we all know you're busy, Zac, but a little "No AnswerMan this week; please enjoy these cute kitten photos" on the front page would soothe the burning antici--pation that rages within us all |
The winds just didn't blow in my favor this week; a freak email accident caused me to lose all of my email during the past week, and I'm also working on the Fall Anime Preview 2006, which is extremely time consuming.
The column will return next Friday, and I do apologize for the unannounced hiatus.
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fighterholic
Joined: 28 Sep 2005
Posts: 9193
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 2:47 am
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Mohawk52 wrote: | his thing |
Everybody has the right to pursue something that makes them happy, and when they find it, they should enjoy it. However don't make yourself inhumane and refuse to help others if there is a need for it. You will regret it later.
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Kilgamayan
Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 275
Location: Location, Location.
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Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:06 pm
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Steroid wrote: | Very true, but as I've said before, my right to throw a punch exists to the limit of your face, and not before. Unless I've actually done damage to you, not just irked you, it's still correct to do it. |
Not entirely true. You don't have to actually come in contact with me for me to feel threatened/violated.
Also, you failed to respond to his point about your right to be annoying ending at his ears, which is a lot more pertinent to the discussion of annoying yaoi fangirls than punching someone in the face.
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Steroid
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 329
Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 10:27 am
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fighterholic wrote: | Everybody has the right to pursue something that makes them happy, and when they find it, they should enjoy it. However don't make yourself inhumane and refuse to help others if there is a need for it. You will regret it later. |
If I regret it, it becomes my problem, not yours. But just because there is a need does not mean that there is a claim on help. That is the needer's problem, not mine.
Kilgamayan wrote: | Not entirely true. You don't have to actually come in contact with me for me to feel threatened/violated. |
Just because you feel threatened doesn't mean you're actually damaged. How you choose to feel about something is another thing that is your problem.
Quote: | Also, you failed to respond to his point about your right to be annoying ending at his ears, which is a lot more pertinent to the discussion of annoying yaoi fangirls than punching someone in the face. |
I did respond in describing it as a matter of place and ownership. It's the right of the master of the house, so to speak, to determine to right or wrong of fangirl activities. A convention organizer can turn a blind eye to them, or ban them, or even mandate that every person at the convention must squeal and scream, or leave. Any assemblage of people can determine their own bylaws on a case-by-case basis. In public, the damage standard must apply; annoyance is not damage. And therin lies the rub. Since annoyance is not damage, there is a time and a place for yaoi fangirl screams, and to decry them in their proper place is as wrong to expound them in places they are not welcome.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:43 pm
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Steroid wrote: |
In public, the damage standard must apply; annoyance is not damage. And therin lies the rub. Since annoyance is not damage, there is a time and a place for yaoi fangirl screams, and to decry them in their proper place is as wrong to expound them in places they are not welcome. |
So apparently then you are not familiar with public disturbance laws. If someone calls the police and complains that your music is too loud, no matter what time of day it is, they'll come and shut you down and potentially fine you. Why? Because you were annoying and someone complained.
If you're a performance artist and you have a loudspeaker and you're screaming at people in the middle of the park on a Saturday, odds are the cops are going to haul you off for creating a disturbance. We have laws in place specifically to prevent people from being annoyed. But apparently on Planet Steroid that's not how it is!
"Annoyance is not damage". This isn't true, and the laws don't back your claim up at all. You don't seem to have any clue at all how the laws in this country actually work; again, you argue based on whatever you think reality SHOULD be and then try and claim that that's how it is.
Also, you're "I'm in favor of things that shake up the status quo!" speech is cute and precious, but it's also meaningless adolescent blather. The world does not operate in the manner you think it should and I'm really happy for that; you seem ultimately self-absorbed, unconcerned with the well-being of others, bizarrely confident in your own totally bogus interpretation of both the law of the land and the constitution of this country.
One day you're going to actually act in a way that you feel is appropriate according to how you "think things should be" and you're going to get arrested for it. And something tells me even that will fail to knock some common sense into you.
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burzmali
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 143
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:58 pm
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But Answerman, don't put him down! He's the future of the Libertarian party!
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Steroid
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 329
Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 3:23 pm
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Zac wrote: |
Steroid wrote: |
In public, the damage standard must apply; annoyance is not damage. And therin lies the rub. Since annoyance is not damage, there is a time and a place for yaoi fangirl screams, and to decry them in their proper place is as wrong to expound them in places they are not welcome. |
So apparently then you are not familiar with public disturbance laws. If someone calls the police and complains that your music is too loud, no matter what time of day it is, they'll come and shut you down and potentially fine you. Why? Because you were annoying and someone complained.
If you're a performance artist and you have a loudspeaker and you're screaming at people in the middle of the park on a Saturday, odds are the cops are going to haul you off for creating a disturbance. We have laws in place specifically to prevent people from being annoyed. But apparently on Planet Steroid that's not how it is!
"Annoyance is not damage". This isn't true, and the laws don't back your claim up at all. You don't seem to have any clue at all how the laws in this country actually work; again, you argue based on whatever you think reality SHOULD be and then try and claim that that's how it is. |
Laws, laws, laws. If we're going to talk about what is, then let's dive in with both feet. Laws are words written down by overpaid men who can't get real jobs. An appeal to such authority is nothing in support of your claim that annoyance is damage. A troop of policemen might haul me off for speaking my mind in public, or a highwayman might haul me off because he wants my money. Both represent wrongs--damage--done to me. And just as the policy of a gang represents no moral basis for such a wrong, neither do the flowery words of a law. Right is right, and wrong is wrong, any time and any place.
Quote: | Also, you're "I'm in favor of things that shake up the status quo!" speech is cute and precious, but it's also meaningless adolescent blather. The world does not operate in the manner you think it should and I'm really happy for that; you seem ultimately self-absorbed, unconcerned with the well-being of others, bizarrely confident in your own totally bogus interpretation of both the law of the land and the constitution of this country. |
I am. Self-absorbed in the ultimate, concerned with the well-being of others only in the periphery. Each person's well-being is his own bailiwick and concern. You seem to think it should be otherwise; I wonder why, considering your reverence for things as they are.
Quote: | One day you're going to actually act in a way that you feel is appropriate according to how you "think things should be" and you're going to get arrested for it. And something tells me even that will fail to knock some common sense into you. |
But I do act that way. I go about my business, refusing to damage others, but acting as I see fit beyond that. And I take care to avoid arrest for acting as I see fit, just as I take care to avoid being run over by busses. And just as catching a disease would render no moral stigma to me, neither would such an arrest.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 3:27 pm
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Steroid wrote: |
Laws, laws, laws. If we're going to talk about what is, then let's dive in with both feet. Laws are words written down by overpaid men who can't get real jobs. An appeal to such authority is nothing in support of your claim that annoyance is damage. A troop of policemen might haul me off for speaking my mind in public, or a highwayman might haul me off because he wants my money. Both represent wrongs--damage--done to me. And just as the policy of a gang represents no moral basis for such a wrong, neither do the flowery words of a law. Right is right, and wrong is wrong, any time and any place.
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Hahahahaha, right, senator/representative/governor are not REAL jobs. They're just overpaid idiots!
Alright alright, enough. It's been fun but you drove this bus into crazytown a few pages back and now you've driven it straight over a cliff.
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Steroid
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 329
Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 3:49 pm
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Zac wrote: | Hahahahaha, right, senator/representative/governor are not REAL jobs. They're just overpaid idiots! |
Well, a governor is an executive. Even granting a legal system based on the proper moral law, it is still necessary to coordinate force to see that criminals are punished and made to give restitution where possible. But people who legislate that which should be intuitive and logical? Yes, those are overpaid idiots.
Quote: | Alright alright, enough. It's been fun but you drove this bus into crazytown a few pages back and now you've driven it straight over a cliff. |
If you wish to end the discussion, by all means do so. To toss off an unsupported claim of my insanity seems more like an attempt to state a point than to cease arguing.
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HellKorn
Joined: 03 Oct 2006
Posts: 1669
Location: Columbus, OH
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:36 pm
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Steroid wrote: | But what does common courtesy do for the person who is more interested in acting out their urges than in harmony? Let's say I'm a yaoi fangirl, and I want to act out and squeal. What does it do for me to restrain myself? |
It creates a balance in society. If you don't have that balance, then you get chaos and discord akin to anarchy, and if you believe anarchy to be a glorious thing, then you're an idiot through and through -- take that as an insult to any "anarchist" out there, but if these so-called "liberators" actually paid attention to countries who are currently anarchies, then they would realize that it's hardly "desirable."
Quote: | It might convince other people to restrain their urges, but that doesn't bother me. |
There must've been some failure in raising you for you to honestly not think that it isn't "right" to be considerate of others.
Quote: | Hurting yourself is not wrong, just stupid. Give people the facts, let them make their own decisions, and get out of the way. |
Please, don't pull out the relativism card.
Quote: | Yes. We are not all one family, or one group. We are a collection of individuals, all acting in our own interests. When someone projects that interest in the face of the general populace, it should be celebrated. |
So if I have the urge to thrust all sorts of insults upon you, threaten you and your family, etc. then that should be celebrated according to your logic, right? As long as I don't "actually hurt you," then it's all fine because I didn't follow through on what I said to do, right?
Quote: | To me, life is about achieving happiness, not avoiding pain. |
Then what if one's own happiness/pleasure can only happen at another person's sadness/misery? You seem to have no regard for anyone but yourself, really.
Zac wrote: | The winds just didn't blow in my favor this week; a freak email accident caused me to lose all of my email during the past week, and I'm also working on the Fall Anime Preview 2006, which is extremely time consuming. |
Personally I'm curious if you're going to buy into the hype around the Death Note anime adaption like so many others, potentially sounding as if it were the Citizen Kane or 2001 (though I'm not that hot on Citizen Kane myself).
Quote: | The column will return next Friday, and I do apologize for the unannounced hiatus. |
Good to hear.
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fighterholic
Joined: 28 Sep 2005
Posts: 9193
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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:04 pm
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Zac wrote: | Hahahahaha, right, senator/representative/governor are not REAL jobs. They're just overpaid idiots!
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Zac, you forgot the president!
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