Forum - View topicAnswerman - Why Are Funimation And Crunchyroll Getting Married?
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Mr Adventure
Posts: 1598 |
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Oh, is that why HULU went from the one stop shop for (most) Anime similcasts to a ghost town over the course of a single anime season?
Good grief. |
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Kadmos1
Posts: 13549 Location: In Phoenix but has an 85308 ZIP |
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When it comes to legal anime streaming, I think other companies should look at how Funi and Crunchyroll does their business. This specifically applies to Hulu, where $7.95/month should be enough for no commercials.
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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Well, what I mean is that if selling upmarket is more profitable, then why bother selling downmarket at all? Logically, shouldn't that mean every business in an industry that intends to maximize profits head straight upmarket? Using your examples, why do Chevy and Toyota bother staying in their markets and not move up? I could also point out some examples where someone decided to go downmarket and netted huge bucks for them. Nintendo did so with the Wii, Southwest Airlines became a giant in the airline business practically overnight by undercutting everyone else's prices, and Motel 6 got way bigger than its competitors (though not as much anymore). In all three cases, the people in charge of these companies decided to do away with amenities and other things only a few people really want, and by doing so, are able to drive down their prices and put tremendous pressure on their competitors. I know there are some industries that cannot survive without an upmarket though. But maybe that depends on a per-industry basis? (Me, I rarely buy any anime unless it's on discount. Heck, a good 60% to 80% of all things I buy are on markdown, on discount, or part of a store promotion. Or things that are already super-cheap to begin with, like Hot-N-Ready pizzas at Little Caesar's. But maybe that's why I feel puzzled by all this. I am a largely downmarket consumer and a bargain hunter, putting me at the direct opposite of the approach of companies like Pony Canyon.) |
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DerekL1963
Subscriber
Posts: 1113 Location: Puget Sound |
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For some shows - by no means all or even most. There's going to be a few shows that will command a premium price because they're highly anticipated or part of a hot franchise... But most shows aren't and won't. If they hadn't 'gotten married', it's highly unlikely Funi and Crunchy would have gotten into a bidding war over Chi's Sweet Home for example. |
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relyat08
Posts: 4125 Location: Northern Virginia |
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It should be noted that Toyota and Chevy(GM) both DO sell upmarket, as do most auto manufacturers. That's why Toyota makes Lexus, and why GM has Buick, Cadillac, and GMC. Because there is a market for both types of vehicles. I understand what you're trying to say here, but I just thought I would point out that they are definitely going after that upmarket profit margin. |
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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I think I get what you mean.
So what I get from this is that upmarket, midmarket, and downmarket bring in different people (with some overlap, like restaurants), and that the upmarket is the one most likely to be profitable. However, there can be profit to be had with other markets too, and companies can find their ground in a market other than the most profitable one. Do I get that right? I do still think that, depending on the business, some industries will have different potential between markets, and maybe even some more specific ranges in the continuum (like most supermarkets being somewhere between mid- and downmarket). Mobile gaming is downmarket from console and PC gaming, for instance, and some companies have made a real killing there. I also believe industries can shift over time too. Canned produce, for instance, used to be upmarket but has since moved down, and this is an effect of improved technology. On the other hand, movie theaters have shifted upmarket in response to pressure from TV in the 1960's. Ketchup used to be a luxury item until Heinz made it affordable, and the market was yanked downwards due to one company's disruption of the industry. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5502 Location: Mexico |
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Will the US ever learn that Mexico is part of North America too Is it so hard to say US and Canada instead It's the exact same amount of characters |
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Polycell
Posts: 4623 |
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Of course it isn't part of North America! Everyone knows Latin America begins at the Rio Grande, so of course that's where North America ends!
spoiler[Obligatory /s. The correct term would be "Anglo-America.] |
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BigOnAnime
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 1222 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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$200,000 an episode? Good gawd, that's more than what ADV Films dealt with, and more than what Geneon paid for Heat Guy J thinking it'd do Escaflowne numbers just because it had the same creator.
animenewsnetwork.com/news/2012-01-30/adv-court-documents-reveal-amounts-paid-for-29-anime-titles http://www.fandompost.com/oldforums/showthread.php?17057-1-amp-Only-License-Rumors-amp-Speculations-Thread&p=353552&viewfull=1#post353552
https://twitter.com/moja_cos/status/744773462850338816 https://twitter.com/moja_cos/status/744776823716741120 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744835179823276032 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744835373419790340 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744836570524454913 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744855553281654785 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744855732781092864 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744856115268063234 https://twitter.com/ultimatemegax/status/744856306960347136 Also something to keep in mind, the company handling international rights is seeing most of this licensing money, the other members of the production committee don't see as much, so this doesn't necessarily put shows in the black automatically. Just like how with discs, whoever on the committee is handling discs sees most of the money while say the company on the committee handling merch rights gets only some of that. In order for a show to be fully profitable, each member needs to make their money back. |
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yuna49
Posts: 3804 |
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It's called "price discrimination" in economics and is one of the powers that monopolists possess. (All shows are monopolies in the sense that they have no substitutes. If you want to own Samurai Champloo, Samurai Flamenco is not a replacement for it.) In these cases the profit maximizing strategy is to offer your products at different price points to attract customers with different levels of demand. Consider the traditional distribution model for anime. First, it starts with multiple disc releases with only a few episodes each. These are all aimed at collectors. After some time passes you might see a "budget" release with the entire series packaged together at a lower price point. These are intended for less intense purchasers who might pick up a complete series on a whim at under $50 that they never would have bought as singles at $25 each. |
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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I see. So the idea is that multiple markets can be profitable, and in the case of these collectors-first strategies, the collector market is the most profitable one but a smart company will go for other profitable markets if they can sell to them too.
What happens during a market disruption? Is that when a lower market suddenly becomes more profitable? I know that's when a company taps into a lower market that has always existed but not served (or not served properly) by the existing industry. On one hand, the lower market quickly becomes a more profitable one, but on the other, technically, this market has been around before the disruption but was untapped. (I think it's the bargain-hunter in me, but any time I see an entire industry selling upmarket, I always wonder if there are ways a company can come in to disrupt it.) |
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zrnzle500
Posts: 3767 |
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Here's an article on the subject tl;dr version
Also I will note that while the upmarket is most profitable, that doesn't mean it brings in the most profits. If you sell much more at the lower price (and profit) you can make more than if you sell a smaller amount of more profitable higher priced ones. Say for the car market, while luxury cars are more profitable, I imagine car companies make most of their profits in downmarket cars. But this isn't necessarily the case in all markets/industries. Which brings me to a type of goods where disruption is no issue. In economics there are what are called Veblen goods, where the demand curve is sloped upward instead of downward. Basically as the price goes up, people actually buy more of them instead of less as with normal goods. Luxury goods are the primary example. No one wants a discount yacht. This is because these goods are status symbols and the more they cost, the more impressive their owners look in their social group. Bringing this back to anime, that is not going with Bluray/DVD prices in Japan. As another commenter pointed out, the market in Japan for anime BD/DVDs is inelastic. Basically changes in price don't change how many fans are willing to buy. You could charge less for the discs but the fans in Japan will buy the same amount anyhow so all that happens is you make less profit, so they just charge as much as the market will bear. Now that doesn't mean there aren't savvy shoppers who will go for cheaper ones from say America, hence the region coding for DVDs and the Blurays where the subs can't be turned off among other things. But charging less wouldn't really disrupt the market too much, just cut into their profits a little. |
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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Hmm, I don't really think much about market elasticity, even though I should. I always assume every market is elastic to some extent, even though I find myself smack dab in some markets that I don't think is that elastic. Or rather, when I look at an inelastic market, it makes me wonder ifit's possible to induce some elasticity to it.
Anime used to be so much more mainstream in Japan than it is now though, so regarding anime's elasticity in Japan, it feels like it kind of stiffened out over the decades. I also feel something should be done about that. Whatever it was about anime that allowed it to be shown as something other than late night programming and toy commercials, can it ever be brought back? Or am I imagining a time that never existed? |
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zrnzle500
Posts: 3767 |
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Depends on whether you consider shonen titles toy commercials, as stuff like Naruto and One Piece doesn't air late night. Conan I think airs during the day too. There are mainstream anime but it is more family oriented like Chibi Maruko. There are others I'm probably neglecting as well. But yeah many of the shows that are followed in the West are late night or near late night. And toy commercials don't have to be bad. Gundam was (and kinda still is) one.
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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Of course. Shows meant to sell toys can be good shows, or at least well-respected shows with a sizable fanbase. From the western side of things, Hasbro in particular is very good at that. (They're even planning on a Hasbro Cinematic Universe. A comic book super-crossover series is already underway.)
What I'm wondering is what magic it was that anime had up to the 90's. It's become increasingly niche, so there had to have been a time anime was less niche than it is now. |
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