Forum - View topic
NEWS: Kyoto Police Arrest 2 Chinese Suspects for Uploading Anime


Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
v1cious



Joined: 31 Dec 2002
Posts: 6028
Location: Houston, TX
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:56 am Reply with quote
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4125
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:57 am Reply with quote
co559 wrote:
relyat08 wrote:

Well, strictly speaking, if you don't have legal access to something, the right thing to do is to just not watch it. I use fansubs for shows that I can't legally get as well, now and then, but fansubs aren't "necessary". They are nice to have, sure, but nothing about anime is a necessity. Without fansubs our lives would be just as well off and we would just have more time to watch the shows that are legally available.
if fansub was not their anime in us would be nonexistent and relyat08 get off ann if you don't like anime


Well that sure makes no sense. I'm just stating what any normal human would recognize as the law. And what should be common sense: Anime isn't a necessity. It's entertainment.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Hellsoldier



Joined: 21 Jun 2013
Posts: 495
Location: Porto,Portugal,Europe,Earth,Sol
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:08 am Reply with quote
relyat08 wrote:
With all due respect Hellsoldier, you don't need anime. I'm sure there are other forms of entertainment you can get legally where you live, if you feel entertainment is a necessity, but if you truly do not know how you are going to eat tomorrow, you should really focus on that. Your situation still doesn't justify fansubs and illegal uploads of entertainment.


I get what you're saying: Basically, entertainment is not like water, gas, electricity, food et al , thus not a necessity. With all the deserved respect, and having in account all the sense you make, I'll still have to disagree. Here is why:

There's a saying around here the roughly goes like ''not of bread alone does a man live''. You see, what many times stopped me from snapping and having the nastiest thoughts on what to do with my life, was entertainment. Now, entertainment means a whole lot of things, like talking to your brother, reading an old copy of Gabriel Garcia Marquez's ''100 Years of Solitude'' (good book, have you read it?), or José Saramago's ''O Memorial do Convento'' or William Gibson's ''Neuromancer'', listening to music or watching anime.

Well, I'm passionate about rock/metal music and anime, as much as I am about philosophy, Blade Runner, Babylon 5, and Society overall. I used to have a copy of Metallica's Master of Puppets, and a few other records. I sold them all out of need for the cash. But I only got them because I liked them, and that's because of the Internet. Nowadays there's Spotify, that will even give profit to the artist for each listen (I recommend it), but I still keep copies around for the sake of preparation for a rainy day.

Anyways, all of this is besides the point. You said I should focus on the food. By that I assume you mean to try to get a job. Well, you see my location? I didn't make it up. I'm from the country of Fernando Pessoa, José Saramago and a complete and utter lack of jobs, circa 650$/month minimum wages, and gigantic youth unemployment. I was supposed to be done with University, and yet I didn't even go there nor got a job. McDonalds used to tbe the gold mine for first jobs... Not even they are taking any people.

Poor people didn't have money to spend on media in the first place, and it was fansubs and recorded tapes that created many fans. However, like many, with money I buy the stuff. And I haven't given up. I'm still gonna get a job, improve my life and the one of those around me, go to unirsity, and have disposable income, which then I can spend on entertainment.

But the reason I still think this way, and the reason didn't hang myself was (aside from a lack of rope, and for caring about my family) that entertainment kept me sane.

I don't use entertainment to run from my problems. I use it to cope with them. I am still searching for a job after all. And like me, millions do the same. And one day, the storm is over, I'll be well-off, and I will pay back. I will get my so-desired Shelf-Life worthy collecton... or at least subscriptions and a few discs.

I can dream, right?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4125
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:10 am Reply with quote
Hellsoldier wrote:

I can dream, right?


That was a great response man. I'm glad that anime has helped you deal with your situation. I can say definitively that it has helped me similarly. I certainly recognize the importance of entertainment to deal with aspects of life that are less than ideal. Life can be brutal at times, and having the simplest respite is truly invaluable. And obviously having some down time is important for the health of everyone. I didn't mean to come off as condescending in my initial comment, for what it's worth. I think you got my point though. Anime, specifically, isn't a necessity. While entertainment can be argued to be a necessity for many of the reasons you stated, anime is just one form of entertainment that no one has a right to. The core of my issue is simply the mentality that using fansubs is entirely justified. I use them now and then, but I don't try to justify it, I just accept that for what it is. And try not to use them when I have a better option. From the sounds of it, you do feel the same way.
I wish you the best of luck in getting a job! Seriously.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Kikaioh



Joined: 01 Jun 2009
Posts: 1204
Location: Antarctica
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:04 am Reply with quote
The problem with justifying piracy due to the limited global availability of certain titles, is that site rankings/metrics suggest that the majority of people who pirate actually come from countries with already existing (and oftentimes free) streaming options, looking for titles that are already available locally. You can look at the Alexa rankings for some of the top piracy sites, and a majority of their visitors will oftentimes come from the United States --- and when you visit said piracy sites, their most popular ranked titles will also often already be legally available in the US for free (usually titles such as One Piece, Naruto, Bleach, Hunter X Hunter, etc.)

So while you can argue a certain degree of "look-the-other-way" flexibility when it comes to piracy for individuals coming from poor backgrounds in less advantaged countries, most of the people pirating don't actually fit that description. From what I can tell, the vast majority of pirates today already have legal streaming access to titles that they're looking for, and either A. don't want to deal with ads for the free streams, B. don't want to pay for a subscription, C. have nit-picky issues about streaming video players, D. don't want to deal with different streaming services, or E. are just stubbornly clutching onto their piracy habits. None of which are at all legit reasons to stiff the anime studios and original content creators, and are more to the effect of self-indulgent/entitled excuses.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Wandering Samurai



Joined: 30 Mar 2014
Posts: 874
Location: USA
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:16 am Reply with quote
Used to torrent all the time in my younger days, but now I use Netflix and Japanese streaming websites like Gyao. Japanese law enforcement comes down a lot more than what I've heard in the US, and since I live in Japan, I'm not chancing illegal activity. Why would I when I get free streaming anime legally on Gyao? And I know Japanese, so that takes care of whether I need subtitles or not. There's ways of getting your anime legally, it's just how you go about it. Also some anime companies will upload episodes on Youtube through their channels for a limited time, you just have to put in the time to watch those episodes before they're taken down.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
+ 光



Joined: 22 Mar 2016
Posts: 226
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:26 pm Reply with quote
+ 光 wrote:


Are they really so difficult to take down?


This was a dead serious question.

Anyway, it would be great if the revenue from the adds on pirate site somehow made its way back to the anime industry...spoiler[for all we know it could be used to fund ISIS war efforts]

EDIT: Sorry, that was a really bad joke. But I'm not so idealistic to think the money is going for something good...maybe it is just for some guy's new Lamborghini.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Alan45
Village ElderVillage Elder


Joined: 25 Aug 2010
Posts: 8673
Location: Virginia
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:57 pm Reply with quote
@+ 光

The problem is that the internet is literally world wide and law enforcement is national or in some cases local. Likely the people running the site are in one country and the servers are in another. It is not easy to take down a site if it is located in a country where it is not against the law or law enforcement doesn't care (or can be persuaded to not care).

Add to that the fact that in the US enforcement of copyright is not a terribly high priority (except for Disney) and enforcement of Japanese copyright is even lower. Enforcement is more or less left to the rights holder to take to civil court. That hasn't worked very well.

In the unlikely event that peace broke out world wide and the NSA needed something to do, piracy, at least in the US could be enforced but don't expect it to happen soon.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Hellsoldier



Joined: 21 Jun 2013
Posts: 495
Location: Porto,Portugal,Europe,Earth,Sol
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:35 pm Reply with quote
relyat08 wrote:
Hellsoldier wrote:

I can dream, right?


That was a great response man. I'm glad that anime has helped you deal with your situation. I can say definitively that it has helped me similarly. I certainly recognize the importance of entertainment to deal with aspects of life that are less than ideal. Life can be brutal at times, and having the simplest respite is truly invaluable. And obviously having some down time is important for the health of everyone. I didn't mean to come off as condescending in my initial comment, for what it's worth. I think you got my point though. Anime, specifically, isn't a necessity. While entertainment can be argued to be a necessity for many of the reasons you stated, anime is just one form of entertainment that no one has a right to. The core of my issue is simply the mentality that using fansubs is entirely justified. I use them now and then, but I don't try to justify it, I just accept that for what it is. And try not to use them when I have a better option. From the sounds of it, you do feel the same way.
I wish you the best of luck in getting a job! Seriously.


First, I'd like to thank you for this reply. It has literally made my day. It's not everyday that I find somebody who gives me polite, concrete, earnest and sound replies. It was and is both my pleasure and my duty to reply in kind. I didn't take anything you said badly.

Secondly, I appreciate that you liked my reply. Yes, that is exactly how I feel about it. If you can get it legal, do it. It's good for all. If not, your time will come. I also hold the belief that entertainment should be a help, or even a passion, or even a job if you so wish and understand how hard it is... But never a drug. Some people will waste their lives watching stuff, playing games, surfing the Internet and whatnot. In one of my other peaks of depression, I was such a person. If anybody else is reading this and is such a person... Snap Out of It. You'll feel you wasted your life, like that rant Subaru gave about himself in Re: Zero. You'll alienate the people who care for you... And even the stuff you love so much will start feeling empty. You'll become Comfortably Numb, to quote a Pink Floyd song.

Thirdly, I wholeheartetly thank you for your support. Now I feel even more motivated to get what I want. And for that I thank you. I am also glad that entertainment helped you as well.

Lastly, I apologize for the lenght of my posts, and for the late reply.

Have a great day, and Rock the World.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
TheMorry



Joined: 08 May 2014
Posts: 532
PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:24 am Reply with quote
Kb24lol wrote:
Just wish they could get all those pirated anime sites off the web.

Right, as you I hate illegal stuff. But as a Dutch (netherlands) anime fan I dont have a legal way to pay for watching anime. I would subcr to Funimation etc if i could.... So unless rules and stuff do not change for anime fans in Europe to watch legal stuff from the US then im happy there are illegal website.

I refuse to wait months before something reaches Europe finally on DVD or blu-ray, its unfair. I import from the USA, Australia and UK anime companies. So honestly i could care less about thise illegal website because there is no legal way right now. If they change the rules finally and include whole Europe as a streaming anime zone together with USA then i pay happily.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Kadmos1



Joined: 08 May 2014
Posts: 12788
Location: In Phoenix but has an 85308 ZIP
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 2:00 am Reply with quote
Uploading anime is not illegal if you got consent from the rights holders, the very rare case of it being a public domain anime, and the situational aspect of fair use (which is probably more of a Western thing).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 4423
Location: Virginia, United States
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 11:18 am Reply with quote
relyat08 wrote:
And what should be common sense: Anime isn't a necessity. It's entertainment.

The anime must flow, or else the guild navigators will get you.

As someone who has watched anime regularly since the Eighties, it is a necessity. By now its a long running lifestyle choice.

If it exists and you don't sell it to that country, for whatever your reason, then you shouldn't cry when people watch it illegally. Personally, I think it is immoral to say we are going to sell it to country A, but we are not going to sell it to country B; furthermore country B is not allowed to watch it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4125
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:24 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
If it exists and you don't sell it to that country, for whatever your reason, then you shouldn't cry when people watch it illegally. Personally, I think it is immoral to say we are going to sell it to country A, but we are not going to sell it to country B; furthermore country B is not allowed to watch it.


Sounds like a personal problem to me. This is just a fact man. Like I said before though, I have no problem with people utilizing the available options to watch things when legal is not possible. People get way too defensive about this. In the most technical sense, no one has a right to any of this stuff, yes, so if you can't get it legally, you shouldn't partake, but that's not how things work with the internet, obviously. And I recognize there are grey areas. Like I also said, I use fansubs now and then for shows that I can't get legally too! Pretty much everyone does. THAT IS NOT THE PROBLEM.

TarsTarkas wrote:

As someone who has watched anime regularly since the Eighties, it is a necessity. By now its a long running lifestyle choice.


But you're missing the point of my comment. You will not die without anime. You will not even have a markedly worse life. There are other forms of entertainment. People lived full lives before anime existed, and if it did not exist today, they would do the same.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2489
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:32 pm Reply with quote
relyat08 wrote:
You will not die without anime. You will not even have a markedly worse life. There are other forms of entertainment. People lived full lives before anime existed, and if it did not exist today, they would do the same.


Modern humans have existed for more than a hundred thousand years, civilization has existed for thousands of years. But would you tell here and now to your closest fellow to stop watching movies and tv series (whether they are broadcast openly, thru cable or streamed thru the internet)? Your arguments apply just the same. Then why do you expect a different reaction just because anime atm is watched by a smaller fraction of the population?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4125
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 2:50 pm Reply with quote
mangamuscle wrote:
relyat08 wrote:
You will not die without anime. You will not even have a markedly worse life. There are other forms of entertainment. People lived full lives before anime existed, and if it did not exist today, they would do the same.


Modern humans have existed for more than a hundred thousand years, civilization has existed for thousands of years. But would you tell here and now to your closest fellow to stop watching movies and tv series (whether they are broadcast openly, thru cable or streamed thru the internet)? Your arguments apply just the same. Then why do you expect a different reaction just because anime atm is watched by a smaller fraction of the population?


I don't even understand what you're trying to say.

But if you're asking me if the same applies to TV and movies, yeah, of course it does. This applies to all forms of entertainment. I have no double standard here. I've laid out everything in the most clear way possible. No one has a right to any specific form of entertainment.
Not to be rude, but are you having difficulty understanding English? Go re-read some of my comments. I've addressed this very clearly repeatedly in this thread and others.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group