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Rise of the Dark Magical Girls


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Blood-
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 20664
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 9:46 pm Reply with quote
VerQuality wrote:
Side rant: it's really annoying seeing Wixoss constantly compared to Madoka. Apart from the use of a flash-forward dream sequence to stir early interest and a generally dark atmosphere, they really don't have much in common at all. Honestly I feel Wixoss is closer to Fate/Stay Night as a battle royale urban fantasy, yet that's a comparison that I've not once seen. Nor does yugioh, the originator of the 'dark card game fantasy' genre, get called out much. Nope, dark atmosphere and a cast of girls, clearly Madoka.


I have a certain amount of sympathy for your view in that Wixoss is not a magical girl show at all. However, the franchise has more in common with Madoka than what you have mentioned. Both deal with a malignant system that misrepresents itself. It uses the bait of granting wishes to lure in its participants, then twists the bait around into cruel "monkey paw" results. Needless to say, the suffering and despair of young girl characters is front and centre. On a more superficial level, the LRIGs themselves look like magical girl characters. That's why I lump Wixoss in with the actual magical girl shows.
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Chiibi



Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4241
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 12:34 am Reply with quote
NOBODY is going to talk about Devil Hunter Youko!?

Seriously, come on!!

That was the bloodiest (serious) magical girl show I'd ever seen until MGRP popped up.

And it was from the early 90s! Though a large difference with Youko and other dark magical girl shows was it wore its dark nature on its sleeve. What you saw was what you got. The style was not moe, Youko was not a kid, she was a curvy high school student and there was constant fan service and sexual innuendo. There was no cutey heart rod or anything; she fought with a freaking SWORD with an AXE on the hilt! The "cutest" thing about this show was its heroine's cute hair style. Other than that, it was not a cute show. Anime hyper

Anyway I can no longer complain about this 'trend' the article addresses since we are getting a brand-new Card Captor Sakura anime next year.

MY BODY IS READY.
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Aylinn



Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Posts: 1684
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:03 am Reply with quote
Quote:
You're saying 'to each their own' while simultaneously talking down to the people who enjoy them like a bunch of sick perverts.

I've honestly never met a single person who only likes Madoka for being dark and violent. If all you want is violence you're much better off watching schlock like Future Diary or Pupa.

You haven’t read my post with understanding. Where exactly do I talk down to people who enjoy them like a bunch of sick perverts?

I merely pointed out that shows targeting girls like Princess Tutu, Utena and Sailor Moon focus more on characters, their development and relationships and that is what makes them appealing to the target audience while the best part of Madoka is plot. The crushed and killed off characters is the one thing that distinctly separates Madoka form other magical girls’ series while characters from magical girls like Tutu move on and fight.

Maybe I should make it clearer, but I think that not only this additional darkness, but also that it was packaged into a decent plot is what makes Madoka popular. There is no attack in my post. I have just explained what I think makes Madoka a bit different and popular. If you think that there is something else that makes Madoka popular and that there is something more that it brings to the table than you can of course share with us.


Last edited by Aylinn on Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:13 am; edited 1 time in total
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fuuma_monou



Joined: 26 Dec 2005
Posts: 1639
Location: Quezon City, Philippines
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:13 am Reply with quote
Chiibi wrote:
NOBODY is going to talk about Devil Hunter Youko!?

Seriously, come on!!

That was the bloodiest (serious) magical girl show I'd ever seen until MGRP popped up.


As a fan of Devil Hunter Yohko, I don't think of it as a magical girl show.
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Vibrant Wolf



Joined: 07 Feb 2016
Posts: 109
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:11 am Reply with quote
am I really the only person in this chat who can't help but compare the way these new magical girls get their powers to demonic contracts? Seriously. I watched Madoka out of curiosity and noted that a cute/charming life form just asked a seemingly normal girl (living a happy life even) if she wants to form a contract with him. If she agrees, she not only get things like a wish granted and superpowers, but also a list of clauses and fine print that the "innocent" contractor deliberately chose not to mention, and the chance that their wish would backfire severely. Then I watched the first episode of Magical Girl Raising Project, where I noticed that the protagonist would also get her wish granted by some kind of seemingly cute and innocent entity, only to have the thing turn around and basically say "okay, now half of you have to die. have a nice day." If this is the way magical girl titles are going, then I predict that Mephistopheles (or even worse, Satan himself) will make an appearance, and have the girls sign the contracts in their own blood.




I will admit, though, that those are the only ones I've actually tried. Magical Girls aren't really my thing anymore.
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Splitter



Joined: 19 May 2003
Posts: 1276
Location: Knockin' on Heaven's Door
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:59 am Reply with quote
Very disappointed that neither Paul nor anyone in the comments has brought up Uta~Kata yet. While My HiME and Nanoha were both setting established marks back in 2004, this one really went under the radar, but it has more in common with its successors than it's predecessors or works of its time. The main girl Ichika gets the power to summon mighty Djinn at her request and use their power, which allow her to transform, but what she doesn't know is while this power seems great at first, she comes to realize she's in the middle of a ritual that is slowly but surely destroying her mentally, emotionally, and physically. I remember watching Madoka and being reminded a lot of it by the Soul Gem aspect. Any fans of dark magical girls should definitely give it a look.
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 4678
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:43 pm Reply with quote
^I can definitely agree on Uta~Kata. It was quite the show.
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Chiibi



Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4241
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 3:12 pm Reply with quote
fuuma_monou wrote:
Chiibi wrote:
NOBODY is going to talk about Devil Hunter Youko!?

Seriously, come on!!

That was the bloodiest (serious) magical girl show I'd ever seen until MGRP popped up.


As a fan of Devil Hunter Yohko, I don't think of it as a magical girl show.


But it absolutely IS one.

She transforms with magical powers to defeat evil. It can't be categorized as anything else.....just because of a lack of a fluffy exterior.
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Blood-
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 20664
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 3:26 pm Reply with quote
I know that ANN's encyclopedia lists "magical girl" as one of the "themes" for DHY, but I certainly don't consider it one. DHY falls more into the tradition of "monster fighting" shows were the lead is a member of a certain family that has been fighting monsters/demons/evil spirits for generations and now it his/her turn to take up the trade. DHY has more in common with Ushio & Tora than magical girl shows. Don't argue about this, Chiibi, or I will lick your donut when you back is turned. Wink
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Blanchimont



Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 2244
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:14 pm Reply with quote
It's a bit ironic that Lynzee described DHY as a 'sexy magical girl show' last year when she gave us a list of OVAs to turn to after Ushio and Tora.
It's definitely sexy(though the style changes a lot between the older and newer parts) but I have to agree with Blood- that magical girl show isn't exactly how I'd describe it. Because if it was one, then so would 3x3 Eyes be...
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Chiibi



Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4241
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:37 pm Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
I know that ANN's encyclopedia lists "magical girl" as one of the "themes" for DHY, but I certainly don't consider it one. DHY falls more into the tradition of "monster fighting" shows were the lead is a member of a certain family that has been fighting monsters/demons/evil spirits for generations and now it his/her turn to take up the trade. DHY has more in common with Ushio & Tora than magical girl shows. Don't argue about this, Chiibi, or I will lick your donut when you back is turned. Wink


Lol I will argue when you are WRONG, Blood. Whether you "consider it" one or not, Devil Hunter Youko is absolutely a magical girl show. She transforms and fights evilz. Hell, she even uses a piece of jewelry to transform.. That should be your biggest hint! It doesn't matter that she uses a sword to fight. The girls from Rayearth use swords too and they transform as well. There is no difference between Youko and Hikaru, Umi, or Fuu in that aspect. Even Utena. I happen to be a magical girl expert and it is YOU who should not argue with ME because you're biting off more than you can chew. :p

Quote:
DHY has more in common with Ushio & Tora than magical girl shows.

DHY has more in common with hentai than magical girl shows.....what's your point?

I keep a padlock on my box of doughnuts with the key around my neck. :p

Quote:
Because if it was one, then so would 3x3 Eyes be...

Does she transform? Does she use magic?


'Magical girl' is not limited to only one style, you see. There is the battle genre, the idol genre, the slice-of-life genre (that would be Hime-chan No Ribbon); all the girl needs is a magical device or some kind of powers. If you wanna play that "but this show isn't like other magical girl shows", it's easy to do it with MULTIPLE titles, watch: Full Moon and Card Captor Sakura have nothing in common, Princess Tutu and Madoka have nothing in common, Kaitou Saint Tail and Galaxy Fraulein Yuna also have nothing in common but these are ALL magical girl series, regardless of that.


Last edited by Chiibi on Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Blood-
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 20664
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:14 pm Reply with quote
Chiibi, I submit to your superior magical girl know-stuff-ness. Eh, I licked your donut, anyway.
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Chiibi



Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4241
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:16 pm Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
Eh, I licked your donut, anyway.


That's not how you spell "doughnut" so you licked nothing. Rolling Eyes
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Rederoin



Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 1421
Location: Europa
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:27 am Reply with quote
Uta Kata is way older than Madoka and is not even mentioned?
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TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 4628
Location: Virginia, United States
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 1:01 pm Reply with quote
yurigasaki wrote:
but i definitely think we need to call the show out for what it is and stop acting like it changed the face of the magical girl genre for better or worse. It spawned some imitators and got some otaku talking but its realm of influence is actually a lot smaller than it seems.

Well, that is one way to look at it, but I see the opposite.

Still hoping Mahou Shoujo Site (Magical Girl Site) and Mahō Shōjo of the End (Magical Girl Apocalypse) get picked up for an anime adaptions.
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