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EP. REVIEW: KONOSUBA - God's blessing on this wonderful world! 2


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Blood-



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:16 am Reply with quote
Not for me. If I just see a repetition of the same one-note gags over and over, I'll move on. Especially for a show like KonoSuba where there really isn't any plot to speak of. I don't dispute your contention that shows that just mine the same territory can't continue to be successful, I was only talking frome my own perspective.
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Valhern



Joined: 19 Jan 2015
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:36 am Reply with quote
kinghumanity wrote:
Hyouka told a complete, structured, flowing story in 22 episodes. Your Lie in April told a complete, structured, flowing story in 22 episodes. Konosuba did NOT tell a complete, structured, flowing story in 10 episodes because they had to back-insert something that happened through a flashback that we never got to see. Get the difference?


Anime isn't done week to week, and the script isn't made up as the show goes, less so with an adaptation. They didn't go "Oh crap, we forgot to explain how Wiz came in to the story". Even though it isn't made week by week, anime is also never completely finished when the anime starts airing, on average there are two episodes completely finished before airing, the rest are finished week by week, and the production team basically prays for them to finish all the episodes in time. Even Mob Psycho 100, the best animated show last year (CR awards be damned) had its final episode finished the night before it aired.

What did happen here, and it's something that we can know because it happens to literally every other show, is that production schedule didn't hold up well enough to make the introductory episode for Wiz completely. Most anime go with a recap episode (nobody wants to do that), in the case of KONOSUBA, for one reason or another (perhaps because only 11 episodes were planned and a recap episode wasn't possible), they decided that the priority was to finish the final episode. This is not because they were just "lazy", it's that the production schedule came to bite them back, just like every other anime that doesn't have KyoAni on it. Wishing that somehow the anime were done by a certain studio so it would be better is naive at best, though.
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 2:50 pm Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
Kazuma is trash, Megumin is an idiot, Darkness is an M and everybody is a jerk (except for the Undead chick) forever.


No, no, Kazuma is a jerk, Megumin is a pyromaniac, Lalatina is a Meat shield, Aqua is an idiot (it says right there in her character card), Wiz is a t-800 (yep, that boobs and everything else is fake) and everyone else is a bunch of egoists Anime hyper
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MarineCorps



Joined: 31 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 6:21 pm Reply with quote
mangamuscle wrote:
Blood- wrote:
Kazuma is trash, Megumin is an idiot, Darkness is an M and everybody is a jerk (except for the Undead chick) forever.


No, no, Kazuma is a jerk, Megumin is a pyromaniac, Lalatina is a Meat shield, Aqua is an idiot (it says right there in her character card), Wiz is a t-800 (yep, that boobs and everything else is fake) and everyone else is a bunch of egoists Anime hyper


Lalatina's abs are really defined
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Blood-



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:15 pm Reply with quote
mangamuscle wrote:
Blood- wrote:
Kazuma is trash, Megumin is an idiot, Darkness is an M and everybody is a jerk (except for the Undead chick) forever.


No, no, Kazuma is a jerk, Megumin is a pyromaniac, Lalatina is a Meat shield, Aqua is an idiot (it says right there in her character card), Wiz is a t-800 (yep, that boobs and everything else is fake) and everyone else is a bunch of egoists Anime hyper


Oops, I confused Megumin and Aqua. Megumin is definitely not an idiot. Just a hapless narcoleptic, blower-upper-of-stuff.
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Key
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:52 am Reply with quote
I think the word you're looking for to describe Megumin, Blood-, is "chunibyo" - only she has actual power, which makes the joke even better.
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Blood-



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:57 am Reply with quote
Except that because she actually has power, she - by definition - cannot be chunibyo. She has an awfully cute hat, though.
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NPC



Joined: 21 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:41 am Reply with quote
Review wrote:
He's really not a good guy at all, as the litany of his faults on display in this episode reminds us


It's like we watch different series. Which litany that would be?

Accusations against Kazuma:

- stealing panties - his first use of the spell ever during training. He had absolutely no control over which item he got. Chris tried to swindle him out of all his money during this training session. At the trial Chris tries to explain what happened but prosecutor doesn't listen.

- stealing the sword - usage of spell during the duel, perfectly legal. According to conditions of duel he could demand anything from the opponent, he chosen to keep the sword (very nice of him). He didn't start the duel and was at huge disadvantage. The witness tries to explain, prosecutor doesn't listen.

- two girls accompanying his opponent refused to accept the result of duel, Kazuma scared them off by harmless hand gestures. What is wrong with that?

The only moment he may look bad in this episode - he was briefly rude to prosecutor Sena after spending two days in prison with looming death sentence. She kinda deserved it and more. She botched the investigation having perfect lie detector. She called witnesses completely irrelevant to the case and then ignored what they had to say. She very nearly got the innocent guy killed, he only was saved by Darkness'es deus-ex-machina intervention.

Granted, all this was done for comic effect. But so was Kazuma's rudeness. Without all this the episode would be boring 5 minutes long slice of life story about nice reasonable people.

Kazuma's bad reputation in town is based mostly on crazy things the team (and Chris) say about him in public, it is a running joke. It appears that viewers get the same impression somehow.

Also, off the top of my head really not a good guy Kazuma:
- didn't rat out Wiz standing in front of the gallows
- accepted full responsibility for teleporting the "power core" to save the town and for actions of his very new team
- generally was a major contributor to saving the town, twice
- turned few misfits into a team capable of this feat
- died IRL trying to save girl's life

He is way better then most people of his age I ever met, me included. "He's really not a good guy" - really? That's a one extremely high bar.

Blood- wrote:
Except that because she actually has power, she - by definition - cannot be chunibyo.


The name of episode in which she joins the party is "An Explosion for This Chuunibyo!". So, this word doesn't mean what you think it means. It describes behavior and has nothing to do with power.
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Blood-



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:24 am Reply with quote
[quote="NPC"]
Review wrote:
Blood- wrote:
Except that because she actually has power, she - by definition - cannot be chunibyo.


The name of episode in which she joins the party is "An Explosion for This Chuunibyo!". So, this word doesn't mean what you think it means. It describes behavior and has nothing to do with power.


My understanding of the word is that it refers to a person who is under a delusion that he or she has special powers and is deluded about there being mystical beings, plots, etc. Megumin claims she is the greatest Explosion Mage in the world - which, for all we know, she may be. But even if she isn't, claiming she is doesn't make her a chuunibyo, it simply makes her mistakenly boastful.
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zrnzle500
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 9:52 am Reply with quote
NPC wrote:


It's like we watch different series. Which litany that would be?

Accusations against Kazuma:

- stealing panties - his first use of the spell ever during training. He had absolutely no control over which item he got. Chris tried to swindle him out of all his money during this training session. At the trial Chris tries to explain what happened but prosecutor doesn't listen.

- stealing the sword - usage of spell during the duel, perfectly legal. According to conditions of duel he could demand anything from the opponent, he chosen to keep the sword (very nice of him). He didn't start the duel and was at huge disadvantage. The witness tries to explain, prosecutor doesn't listen.

- two girls accompanying his opponent refused to accept the result of duel, Kazuma scared them off by harmless hand gestures. What is wrong with that?

The only moment he may look bad in this episode - he was briefly rude to prosecutor Sena after spending two days in prison with looming death sentence. She kinda deserved it and more. She botched the investigation having perfect lie detector. She called witnesses completely irrelevant to the case and then ignored what they had to say. She very nearly got the innocent guy killed, he only was saved by Darkness'es deus-ex-machina intervention.

Granted, all this was done for comic effect. But so was Kazuma's rudeness. Without all this the episode would be boring 5 minutes long slice of life story about nice reasonable people.

Kazuma's bad reputation in town is based mostly on crazy things the team (and Chris) say about him in public, it is a running joke. It appears that viewers get the same impression somehow.

Also, off the top of my head really not a good guy Kazuma:
- didn't rat out Wiz standing in front of the gallows
- accepted full responsibility for teleporting the "power core" to save the town and for actions of his very new team
- generally was a major contributor to saving the town, twice
- turned few misfits into a team capable of this feat
- died IRL trying to save girl's life

He is way better then most people of his age I ever met, me included. "He's really not a good guy" - really? That's a one extremely high bar.


Well he threatened to steal the underwear of the Kyoya's hangers-on (and that hand motion was creepy) and even when he (accidentally) stole Chris's underwear, he did swing them around in the air and celebrate as the other witness described. And while he did acquire the sword according to the rules, proceeding to sell it off is kind of a dick move.

From other parts of the series, he brought Aqua to the world he was sent to out of spite. That girl he "saved" was in no danger as it was from a slow moving tractor. I could probably find more if I wanted to. But overall while he is not all bad, he is not all good either. You can say his rudeness was for comedic effect but so is the unfairness and rudeness against him.
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NPC



Joined: 21 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 11:32 am Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
My understanding of the word is that it refers to a person who is under a delusion that he or she ... But even if she isn't, claiming she is doesn't make her a chuunibyo


So, basically, you made up the word meaning all by yourself and insist that other people have to use it? Counterproductive. You can try to argue with series creators if you feel that your grasp of Japanese is better then theirs. FYI, http://jisho.org/search/中二病

zrnzle500 wrote:
Well he threatened to steal the underwear of the Kyoya's hangers-on (and that hand motion was creepy)


Why wouldn't he? He won the duel, they couldn't object to results. If Kyoya had any objections (he didn't) it was up to him to make them when he is conscious. They called him names and demanded the sword back, the sword that never belonged to them. Arguing was pointless so he scared them off. If he wasn't creepy they would continue nagging him. He didn't threat to steal panties specifically, it was all in their heads. No harm done.

Quote:
even when he (accidentally) stole Chris's underwear, he did swing them around in the air and celebrate as the other witness described.


Did you miss the part where she tried to swindle him from all his money he risked his life for? Chris suggested to teach him the spell and used the lesson to deceive him. He was glad that he didn't steal a rock and had something to negotiate the return of the money. His actions were completely justified. Chris tried to explain it during the trial. Also, Chris was wearing shorts, so missing panties didn't affect her much.

Quote:
And while he did acquire the sword according to the rules, proceeding to sell it off is kind of a dick move.


Nope. Dick move was for Kyoya to attack vastly weaker opponent without good reason. It was his fault he lost his sword. Kazuma had no obligations to him, he had good reasons to detest the guy.

Quote:
From other parts of the series, he brought Aqua to the world he was sent to out of spite.


Why not? Was she nice or something? She got exactly what she was dishing out. He was well within the rules set for him against his will or control. And, frankly, he did her a service. Sitting in this foggy space and teasing new souls for eternity can't be good for anyone.

Quote:
That girl he "saved" was in no danger as it was from a slow moving tractor.


He didn't know it so it is irrelevant. He though she was in danger and acted accordingly with percieved danger to his own life, so large in fact that he had a heart attack. This was selfless act and the fact that you mention it as something bad puzzles me.

Quote:
I could probably find more if I wanted to. But overall while he is not all bad, he is not all good either.


More of that would be pointless. Nothing you mentioned is bad, most of it just normal human behavior. No one is "all good". He is mostly normal, occacionally awesome. Much better than average.

Quote:
You can say his rudeness was for comedic effect but so is the unfairness and rudeness against him.


It's like you reading my thoughts. Oh, right, you do, I wrote them down few hours ago. Kinda pointless. "You can say" makes no sense - I already did.
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Blood-



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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 11:45 am Reply with quote
NPC wrote:
Blood- wrote:
My understanding of the word is that it refers to a person who is under a delusion that he or she ... But even if she isn't, claiming she is doesn't make her a chuunibyo


So, basically, you made up the word meaning all by yourself and insist that other people have to use it? Counterproductive.


Oh yes, I remember you now. You are that guy who loves posting like an obnoxious jerk. Nah, I didn't make up a definition for chuunibyo that only I use. I provided a definition that I am familiar with and which I believe many people here would agree with. If that definition is wrong, then what is the definition as you understand it?
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zrnzle500
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 12:11 pm Reply with quote
@NPC I'm not saying he was not in some way justified in doing some of the his actions, just that the actions were nonetheless bad in some cases. Generally speaking, there is a difference between doing things legally (or within the rules) and doing things ethically. Just because you're following the rules doesn't mean you can't do so in a dickish way. Also I'm sure you've heard the saying "Two wrongs don't make a right" so doing mean things to people who were mean to you does not make them less mean or jerkish. Neither does saying it is normal human behavior make his actions not bad. There is plenty of normal human behavior which is bad or jerkish, including some of the stuff he did.

I never said that the tractor scene was bad, merely that it was not an an unmitigated good scene. Good intent is not the only condition for some act or someone being good.

While he did not specifically say he would steal their panties, he a) had done that before and b) pointedly did not correct them for thinking so (so they would be scared off), so I think it is reasonable for them to conclude that he was going to, even if that wasn't the case and there was a chance that it might have been.

Swinging around women's underwear and going woohoo with a embarrassed woman who is presumably the rightful owner of them is a bad thing to do. The fact that I have to explain that to you is astounding.

You seem not to understand what I meant when I said "you can say...". That is there to acknowledge that you said it but then use that sentiment of "His rudeness is ok because it was just for comedic effect" and apply it to all of the other characters actions against him as they were also just for comedic effect.

If what Blood- says is true (what I've seen is not out of line with such an interpretation), I don't know if any further discussion would be fruitful. I've said what I have to say and if you want to continue on these points, I don't believe I will be contributing further to it.
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NPC



Joined: 21 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2017 1:13 am Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
You are that guy who loves posting like an obnoxious jerk.


And you are the guy who thinks he is right just because he wrote something and switches to ad hominem attack when he can't support his point with logic. Nice start with name calling.

Quote:
Nah, I didn't make up a definition for chuunibyo that only I use. I provided a definition that I am familiar with and which I believe many people here would agree with. If that definition is wrong, then what is the definition as you understand it?


I gave you the link, you can click on it. You are free to check other dictionaries if you don't trust this one. Also, you are avoiding rather important point that the name of the episode is "An Explosion for This Chuunibyo!". How come?

Chuunibyo is a condition that very much exists in real world. Supernatural powers on the other hand don't exist, therefore they can't be a qualifying condition for being a chuunibyo by definition. So, your assessment "except that because she actually has power, she - by definition - cannot be chunibyo" makes no sense whatsoever. It is very simple, just think about it.

Minamin has patch on her eye that "seals the power that otherwise would destroy the world". Sounds familiar, doesn't it? Is it true? Nope. 90% of everything Minamin says about herself and her powers is delusional crap. She is the classical case. She is even aware of existence of this condition - when Aqua refers to herself as a goddess, Kazuma explains that "she is one of those people" and Minamin replies "sad".

zrnzle500 wrote:
Also I'm sure you've heard the saying "Two wrongs don't make a right" so doing mean things to people who were mean to you does not make them less mean or jerkish. Neither does saying it is normal human behavior make his actions not bad. There is plenty of normal human behavior which is bad or jerkish, including some of the stuff he did.


I disagree. If people behave jerkish to you, you are entitled to some pushback without becoming a jerk yourself. This is how it works in real world. Self defense is not just a right, it is a duty. As long as your reaction is proportional it is also ethical.

Quote:
I never said that the tractor scene was bad, merely that it was not an an unmitigated good scene. Good intent is not the only condition for some act or someone being good.


It was unmitigated good. The guy voluntarily put his life in danger to save other person. The fact that danger turned out to be not real doesn't change it. There is nothing bad about it.

Quote:
While he did not specifically say he would steal their panties, he a) had done that before and b) pointedly did not correct them for thinking so (so they would be scared off), so I think it is reasonable for them to conclude that he was going to, even if that wasn't the case and there was a chance that it might have been.


He didn't have to correct them, he wanted them to go away. Scaring them off allowed to avoid the actual violence.They verbally assaulted the guy, threat is a common response to it even now and we are looking at medieval setting. Try insulting a guy IRL and see if his default reaction "you will hear from my attorney" or some form of physical threat (if you are lucky and it is only threat, so, don't really try it). There was no any chance because he didn't cast anything.

Quote:
Swinging around women's underwear and going woohoo with a embarrassed woman who is presumably the rightful owner of them is a bad thing to do.


Few seconds ago Chris tried to trick him to get the money he and his companions risked their lives for. This is quite an offense. She was entitled to some embarrassment. No, it doesn't make him a jerk.

Anyway, to summarize - Kazuma is an extremely reasonable guy and his actions are mostly justified. I can't think of one case of him being mean for no reason. On the other hand examples when he acts as a very good (brave, just, reasonable, selfless) person are too many to mention. So, I think that "really not a good guy" don't fit him very well.

Quote:
That is there to acknowledge that you said it but then use that sentiment of "His rudeness is ok because it was just for comedic effect" and apply it to all of the other characters actions against him as they were also just for comedic effect.


I very explicitly applied it both to his actions and to actions toward him. So your reapplying of it just didn't make much sense, you just repeated what I said before.

Quote:
If what Blood- says is true (what I've seen is not out of line with such an interpretation), I don't know if any further discussion would be fruitful. I've said what I have to say and if you want to continue on these points, I don't believe I will be contributing further to it.


Well, you can judge by yourself. I think I was polite enough. If any disagreement with you point of view is unacceptable for you, it is indeed your right.
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zrnzle500
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2017 1:47 am Reply with quote
^Now, now. I'm fine with people disagreeing with me, I just have neither the time nor the interest in having lengthy arguments that have no sign of ending in any agreement beyond agreeing to disagree. While there are points I could address, I don't see either one of us changing the other's mind. I do think he has his good moments but overall he's still kind of a jerk like pretty much everyone else in the show. I'm not saying he's a villain but more of a "I love you man but you can be kind of a dick sometimes." These type of loveable jerks comedies don't really work if they are completely unsympathetic at all times.

I misread part of your post, my bad.
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