Forum - View topicWhen Anime Series Jumped the Shark
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Zeino
Posts: 1098 |
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The Sensui and Three Kings arcs of Yu Yu Hakusho - Yusuke is a demon all along comes out of nowhere in a twist that feel like it was ripping off the "Goku is an alien" from Dragon Ball. Sensui''s personality and motives are incoherent as he goes from earnestly wanting to wipe humanity out to only caring about fighting Yusuke to wanting someone stronger then him to kill him in a rehash of Toguro's motives. (And the multiple personalities thing really just feels like an attempt to paper over the cracks.) The final fight is a rushed and anticlimactic curbstomp via possession deus-ex-machina which feels like Togashi just wanted the arc over with as quickly as possible in order to set up the next one. And to be fair, The Three Kings arc does have a very interesting set-up with the prospect of pitting Yusuke, Kurama and Hiei against each other in battle for the Demon World but then it quickly fizzles out into Dark Tournament-redux DBZ-lite edition with zero stakes and tension as all the S-class Demons turn out to be reasonable guys. And worst of all, it commits the unforgivable sin of leaving the best character, Kuwabara behind.
That is making too much of a one off conversation between Goku and Freeza speculating that all you really need to be a Super Saiyan is a pure heart and not a higher power-level. That was just them guessing about it what it took and not the gospel truth. It obvious now there was much more to it. See also further more details regarding Potara Fusion in the Goku Black arc of Super as another example of this kind that the fanbase inexplicably makes too much of big deal over. Last edited by Zeino on Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:56 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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Gemnist
Posts: 1757 |
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Not quite sure what you're trying to say about Suzaku. But basically, Suzaku's whole handling in R2 was contradictory. Sure, someone like that would have conflicting emotions, but if a guy spends many episodes saying "I will kill Zero because hatred guides me", and then randomly decides to take him prisoner, you know the writers are just trying to push the plot along. And when he decided to go full Lelouch, he instead became full idiotic jerk, choosing to not be upset over murdering millions because Lelouch wouldn't (even though Lelouch was always upset about murdering civilians) and then claiming he could become the Knight of One by killing the one person who could MAKE him the Knight of One. I mean, really dude. Meanwhile, Nina was ALWAYS portrayed as a victim, even before the Table-kun scene. Suzaku, Milly, Kallen, and Lelouch all even bluntly say it. We the audience are the ones who made fun of her being insane, but the characters? Yeah... As for Cornelia, she wasn't portrayed as being that much of a victim. I just felt that after Euphemia died, she became kind of pointless. And yet she kept escaping scenarios where she should have totally died. Also the incest, but I digress. |
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Pietato
Posts: 23 |
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Kill la Kill never jumped the shark. It was always crazy, and that is why people love it. It also progressed properly through the story from first to last episode.
Nick Creamer needs to look up what jump the shark means. |
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jroa
Posts: 537 |
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Perhaps the feeling is mutual, but I think your description of these events is slightly off and kind of confusing. In a few a words, what I am saying is that his character was, from the beginning, meant to be contradictory and what happens to him during R2 actually resolves said contradiction with some prior support rather than coming out of nowhere. Suzaku only says that "hatred" guides him two episodes before the end of S1. Which makes sense as an immediate reaction to the surrounding events, but it isn't what had motivated him all along. Not killing Lelouch is simply indicative that, despite those words, he wasn't prepared to cross that line yet. Instead, he was still clinging to his excuses for changing the Britannian system and thought that showing his loyalty to the Emperor (by capturing Zero, etc) could make him Knight of One, sooner or later. In short, he gave up his initial instinct for revenge in exchange for accomplishing a greater goal that reflects all of his previous preaching. He does start to show some aggressive and less morally inclined actions after this, which might qualify as hypocritical even if it is part of an internal conflict. Nevertheless, Suzaku definitely wasn't consciously trying to be like Lelouch. Early R2 shows that, unlike other Britannians we saw, Suzaku was still against allowing a repeat of the stadium massacre. As matter of fact, it is the "slaughter of millions" that finally breaks him, later on, by showing the futility of his excuses.
I don't think you're taking into account all of the ways in which the show framed her actions. The only time Nina was treated like a victim in the literal sense was when she had been held hostage in a hotel. If anything, the table scene makes her come across as weird and creepy, not as sympathetic. I think that's problematic, mind you, but for other reasons. In fact, I'd say the audience would need to be blind in order to believe that the staff wasn't finding it amusing to draw her with clear facial expressions of insanity not once but at least three times (and they make fun of her more explicitly in side materials). That doesn't mean some characters can't sympathize with her situation. Milly was just being kind to a friend, which is a natural reaction, but doesn't blame anyone for her condition. Same with Kallen, though she said even less about the topic than the others. At the same time, Schneizel was merely exploiting her science skills, less out of pity and more out of necessity. Suzaku was predisposed to blaming Lelouch and he, not the show, saw Nina as one of his victims but that tells us more about him than her. Many episodes later, when she tells Suzaku to bring that bomb into battle and screams about using it, the show isn't presenting that as the right idea. |
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Shadowrun20XX
 Posts: 1935 Location: Vegas |
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I would say Naruto, after pervy sensei dies. The show dive bombed for me after that.
Bleach after Ichigo's father's reveal, that was cool build up but then all the enemies from there were not fun to watch, wait for or tollerate. Hunter X hunter after the World Tree. It feels like its headed where Yuyu hakusho fizzled out at. One piece Time Skip just makes the characters horrible. If you have ever played Final Fantasy 1 and you get to the mid point where you jump to the future, taking your level 30 character back to level 1 is what OPs time skip felt like to me. |
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SillyPerson
 Posts: 39 Location: Vatican City |
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OK, I fully agree with people who say the endless eight episodes of The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya ruined what was previously a good show, or that the third Tenchi Muyo OVA series got to be really nuts and overblown and not in a good way but in a bad way. I agree that Naruto and Bleach end up just going on and on and on and on...
But people are going after Code Geass, Kill La Kill, Sword Art Online, and Death Note... and even Gurren Lagann? Whining about minor flaws instead of enjoying how awesome those shows are? Please, stop your whining and complaints about those shows, they are all supremely awesome. Criticism of shows like those really annoys me. A lot of people here really like to nitpick minor details in shows that are thoroughly enjoyable. They are just cartoons, stop complaining about character or plot development that seems to lack believability or be contrived... they are not just cartoons but extremely enjoyable ones and nitpicking minor perceived faults just detracts from the enjoyment of shows that are otherwise extremely fun. And please, nobody bring up Neon Genesis Evangelion either, it is also very awesome and enjoyable, please don't complain about how weird it is or how it "jumps the shark" or whatever. Seriously though my favorite show is probably Excel Saga and this "jumping the shark" thing is what Excel Saga constantly does all the time, right from the first episode to the last episode. In fact the last episode's title is "Going Too Far". Shows that go too far actually appeal to me a whole lot, I LIKE it when things escalate out of control and get crazy... most of the time. In the 3rd Techi Muyo OVA series that was an exception because it was just bizarre and made no sense and I had been watching Tenchi Muyo for a whole bunch of episodes, both Tenchi Universe which I saw first and then the OVA series, and the 3rd OVA series is just nonsense, like, let's randomly have a guy appear who can blow up the moon instantly by aiming his hand at it, and do the same thing to half the Earth, and then let's elevate 2 of Tenchi's waifus along with the alien woman we previously thought was the main antagonist into all-powerful all-knowing goddesses and then have a meaningless fight and then some poorly written time travel that makes me glad well-written time travel exists in the form of Steins;Gate. Supposedly the purpose of the 3rd OVA series was to have continuity between the Tenchi Muyo OVAs and the show Tenchi Muyo! GXP. Well, they could have gone about doing that in a much less annoying manner. And the Endless Eight Haruhi Suzumiya episodes are so bad, I hate them with such a passion, they completely ruined the entire Haruhi Suzumiya franchise for me, I can't stand Haruhi Suzumiya at all. In the Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya, I was rooting for her to stay disappeared and for Kyon to not reset the world and got upset when he made the wrong decision and screwed up the entire universe by putting it at the whims of that annoying brat I hate, Haruhi, again. Haruhi Suzumiya does have time travel that is well-written, though, I have to give them credit for that, but they really pissed me off with the Endless Eight so badly that it is hard to enjoy that franchise at all. I have heard rumors about Boku no Pico being the worst anime ever. I doubt it. Nothing could be worse than Endless Eight. I seriously want to watch Samurai Flamenco now, though. All the complaints about it make it sound like exactly the sort of thing I would LOVE, as someone who loves Excel Saga and all of its wackiness. Of course I doubt it could be as good as Excel Saga... NOTHING is as good as Excel Saga. The complaints about Samurai Flamenco just sound like things people could say about Excel Saga, the best show ever made ever, spiraling out of control. It is a shame Puni Puni Poemy and Nerima Daikon Brothers, made by the same anime director as Excel Saga, the legendary Nabeshin, aren't as good. I guess they didn't have as good source material... Koshi Rikudo must be a genius. Apparently in some reviews people claim Excel Saga got worse in the second half especially when Ropponmatsu was introduced... I LOVE Ropponmatsu! Those episodes that some people review badly, I really like. Maybe I am just weird? No, other people are weird, not me. |
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omiya
 Posts: 1825 Location: Adelaide, South Australia |
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I only started watching the anime after the Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya movie had been released in Japan and it had been recommended, so I could choose to skip the Endless Eight, having been warned about it, and only ended up watching the last episode of the Eight. (I certainly don't complain about having discovered the music of Minori Chihara through the series either). When the Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya movie finally was released with an English dub I was able to enjoy watching it with friends. For those of us who mainly watch anime after each cour has finished, it's worth knowing about the episodes that might spoil the enjoyment of the rest of the series and deciding whether to watch or skip them. |
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