Forum - View topicThe List - 7 Brother-Sister Romances That Went Too Far
|
Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 Next Note: this is the discussion thread for this article |
| Author | Message | |||
|---|---|---|---|---|
frozenkex
 Posts: 17 |
|
|||
|
The only reason incest is a taboo is because potential birth defects (chance of which isn't too significantly larger above general population) - it is evolution, simple as that. Any other rationalizations people use and come up with are irrelevant.
If science figures out a way to effectively prevent increased risk of birth defects from incest then there will be no reason for taboo and stigma to exist. If there is any abuse at any point it would be wrong not because of incest but because of abuse.
I'll put it this way. It's no different than consenting relationships between non-siblings in anime, really. Thus not having rational reasons why it should be looked down on. "It's a taboo" isn't a good argument, other than pointing out the fact that it's a taboo, as well as being appeal to popularity fallacy. Homosexuality is also taboo in many places, including many places in US (full of religious rednecks).
I'm very skeptical of these statements. Both oreimo and eromanga sensei are best-selling light novels, and people like taboo-stuff, including OUTSIDE of otakudom. Not stigmatizing incest is actually pretty open minded, liberal point of view of the west, especially among people who aren't religious. Hell any reasonable philosopher or an intellectual would be saying this. So lets not say it's an "otaku thing" okay? It's perfectly reasonable, progressive and not too uncommon view even for someone who hasn't seen an anime in this century. If one can't come up with rational argument for it to be wrong/bad etc, then there is no reason to stigmatize or look down on it. Which is how people should come up with their conclusions, not based on general perception of society. Especially when nowadays many people are so wrong about so many things, that rational people cant just adhere to everything that makes other people comfortable. And it's worth it to push liberal views and make people apply some rational thinking for progress. I mean, look at how many people are still denying climate science. |
||||
|
||||
|
Just Passing Through
Posts: 276 |
|
|||
|
The X-Files - Home. Just watch that on a loop until you're disabused of the notion. Or this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkiOm-vmpcY Personally, I'm uncomfortable with an article giving space to the one aspect of anime that automatically pushes my 'Ew' button, |
||||
|
||||
TheAncientOne
 Posts: 1871 Location: USA (mid-south) |
|
|||
Aside from being a work of fiction, as I recall, those people had also interbred for generations. I don't see anyone here arguing the effects of that. That also becomes a moot point if the persons involved never have children. Fortunately, it has been quite a while since simply not having children was stigmatized. The simple fact is we are arguing over something that is rare in real life (consensual incest) and would be likely to remain so even if it were made legal tomorrow (with certain restrictions, for example, requiring sterilization of one of the involved parties). The sad fact is the bulk of the incest that actually occurs is non-consensual. |
||||
|
||||
Slashman
 Posts: 253 |
|
|||
Right here is the key and closer to this entire discussion. Consensual incest is not a norm because of the blocks placed by evolution to discourage it. Those blocks are different in animals (the urge to roam far away from their place of birth to look for a mate for instance). Sometimes those blocks fail. Nothing works perfectly 100% of the time. Humans develop psychological differences, or force the issue (royal intermarriage) or the unfortunate abuse situation. Animals face shrinking habitats and reduced numbers via hunting etc. These bro-sis anime/manga/LNs attempt to dramatize an extremely unlikely and uncomfortable topic into something entertaining. Koi Kaze represents the most realistic take on this but it is also arguably the hardest one to watch because of the realism in its story. In the end, if you don't like these themes, then stop watching/reading the material. No one has to rationalize their like or dislike of these kinds of stories to anyone. In the end they are all fictional. |
||||
|
||||
|
Just Passing Through
Posts: 276 |
|
|||
The problem is that it's no longer a niche, or even a genre, it's anime mainstream. The one-sided unrequited inappropriate relationship is an anime comedy short-cut. Brothers crushing on sisters, sisters crushing on brothers, teachers and student, parents and children, it's a cheap and quick way to get a laugh. There are so many shows that I enjoy for 99% of the runtime, and just have to roll my eyes and look past the stupid incest comedy |
||||
|
||||
|
WingKing
Posts: 617 |
|
|||
For the record, I had no idea that was even "a thing" in the fandom in the first place - it's not the kind of thing I normally pay much attention to. And this is why you never blindly trust Google, boys and girls. For those of us who don't know a lick of Japanese law and are just doing a quick two-second lookup before we post a message board comment, trying to avoid saying something stupid, the very first thing a Google search for "japanese age of consent" brings up right at the top of the page is that it's 13. It doesn't go into that kind of detail about prefectural-level laws unless you actually stop to read the whole article. I'm a professional librarian who knows better, and even I still make these kind of mistakes. Learn from this, and don't do what I just did - take a few extra seconds to double-check your information. Knowing that doesn't change my point about disliking the premise of Kiss x Sis, though. If anything, it only reinforces my dislike for it. |
||||
|
||||
|
ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 2944 Location: Email for assistance only |
|
|||
|
Hey, sorry if it seemed like I was calling you out since it looks like this was a coincidence. Since I first started watching anime, I've seen "Japan's age of consent is 13" usually attached to "which is why it's totally okay for me, a 25-year-old male, to be attracted to and want to sleep with Japanese middle school girls" or something along that line. After over a decade worth of being in the fandom, I can't help but eye roll when I see it as people try to excuse that and justify why their attraction would totally be okay in real Japan when really they'd be so, so arrested.
|
||||
|
||||
Heishi
 Posts: 1317 |
|
|||
Because they're not even siblings? They're cousins? 
|
||||
|
||||
|
AksaraKishou
Posts: 1410 Location: End of the World |
|
|||
|
What people need to realize is that Literature is not the same as Real Life.
I don't give 2 cents if a book includes incest of any kind of it goes against my moral compass. IT'S NOT REAL LIFE! Bottom line, why wouldn't you be happy that a book shows you hypothetical scenes of something you don't want to see in real life? PS: For the person that mentioned Tokyo Raven spoiler[in the light novels, it is shown that they're not related at all. She was abandoned at Yasuzumi's door step. So yeah, i'm 100% behind the Harutora x Natsume ship.  ]
|
||||
|
||||
|
Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18185 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
|
|||
There's not a lot of evidence to support one way or another on the point of how widespread the acceptance of incest is. As Justin noted in this Answerman column, Japan has a long and involved history with incest, which is probably a big part of why it shows up as often as it does in Japanese media. Hence otaku (especially Japanese otaku) are going to be more inclined to be accepting of it than the general Western population. And BTW, religion has nothing to do with it. I'm non-religious and liberal-leaning on most things and I don't see it as acceptable. While I think you're probably right that you would see greater acceptance of it among liberals than conservatives, I still think you're talking about a small minority here.
Oh, let's not go there. These are two entirely different kinds of issues and not even close to being on the same scale. |
||||
|
||||
|
frozenkex
Posts: 17 |
|
|||
So why do you see it as unacceptable? Like if it was two consenting siblings, that love each other, that were being responsible and wasn't gonna have kids?
I think people, who don't blindly accept cultural taboos as part some sort of objective morality, aren't religious and are progressive, would listen to rational arguments. And in absence of good arguments against it, they will find it acceptable. |
||||
|
||||
|
Animegomaniac
Posts: 4078 |
|
|||
The author forced her to end the relationship. Writing's a funny thing and it's pretty easy to tell times when "the author takes control!" plotting takes over what was otherwise natural character interactions. Some writers give in, others give up, others run their work into a wall. Oreimo opted to jump off a cliff, in part because they already in a relationship, in part because neither wanted to end it, in part because neither tried to correct things and in part because Kyosuke and Kinrino spent the first season connecting as brother and sister, not romantically. One possible saving grace of the series is as parody, given that the incest theme was brought about by the otakus of the series for the otakus of the audience, both reasons being "incest is hot!". Pity that doesn't work because it's stupid. The guy's an idiot, the girl's a shrew...definitely less Beatrice, more Kate I think; Much Ado Beatrice would have made the series, a knowing perpetrator of tropes rather than victim of them... in short,the only they have going for them is the incest. And we're right back at "incest is hot!"... and the number of replies this thread has. |
||||
|
||||
Blanchimont
 Posts: 3447 Location: Finland |
|
|||
So WHY do you think it's not acceptable, if no harm is done? If it's for the same reason some people might like the color red but puke to the color blue, then that's fine because that would at least be an answer as to the 'why', after all tastes can't be argued with. But if it's not, then what's the rationale, seeing as you don't come from a religious background? In the Western world, incest between consenting adults is legal in France and Spain. |
||||
|
||||
Jonny Mendes
 Posts: 997 Location: Europe |
|
|||
In Europe is also legal in Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Portugal and Russia. |
||||
|
||||
Polycell
 Posts: 4623 |
|
|||
|
||||
|
||||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group