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maximilianjenus



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:23 am Reply with quote
it'd be interesting ot know if this happened with anime original shows o}and which ones (gundam?),
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leafy sea dragon



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:24 am Reply with quote
Though it was more of a reboot, I was thinking about the change in hands between the two series for Hunter X Hunter, and from that I figured the reason behind changes in studios was because anime studios are only contracted to keep making the show until some certain point, after which the production committee is free to pick someone else. Though I figure in rare cases, it's because the studio goes out of business and the production committee needs to find something to replace them.

That being said, it isn't without precedent in western animation either, such as what happened with Superjail!, The Simpsons, or Arthur, and in all three cases, the look of the show changed drastically. In those cases, however, the reasons were very different and could apply to anime equally as well. For Superjail!, it's because of a lack of availability from the previous studio requiring them to find another; for The Simpsons, it's because improving animation technology required them to find some other company that had the necessary equipment; and for Arthur, it was because the other studio could create episodes cheaper. I know two of those reasons were already listed under this article though.

Say, one more thing: This column calls them "seasons," but I see many users of this site call them "cours." What is the difference between them?
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BlueBeast33



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:40 am Reply with quote
Yeah I remember when this happened to Log Horizon. I really didn't like the character design change when it went from Studio Satelight to Studio Deen. Plus I think the show looked a bit better overall in its first season. This tends to be more common with light novel adaptations though from what I've seen, so I guess it's a good thing I don't watch many of those these days.
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Paiprince



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:00 pm Reply with quote
At times, you can't even tell the difference unless you pay extra attention. Yuru Yuri's latest season wasn't made by studio Dogakobo, but by TYO Animations and Oreimo from AIC Build to A-1 studios. There are cases where they carry over a lot of the previous staff like directors and chief animators that they maintain the overall style.
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Shay Guy



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:01 pm Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:
Say, one more thing: This column calls them "seasons," but I see many users of this site call them "cours." What is the difference between them?


"Cour" has a pretty fixed meaning -- a quarter-year block of episodes. Anime tends to be made in multiples of those, so you'll have some series that are 12 episodes, some 26, a few kids' shows with 50. (The numbers aren't exact; there's a good amount of variation, but you'll rarely see a 20-episode series.)

"Season" tends to be loosely applied when it comes to anime, but it's pretty convenient for scenarios like American TV, where a show reaches an endpoint, stops airing for a while, then starts again. Less so with year-round shows like Dragon Ball Z, though even for adaptations of long-running manga that model is on its way out.

Examples: My Hero Academia aired one cour last year, in the spring calendar block, and now it's airing a two-cour second season. Code Geass, Log Horizon, Assassination Classroom, Kaiji, and Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans all had two seasons that were two cours each. (Gundam SEED was a single four-cour season back in 2002, and the sequel was another four; like I said, on its way out.) Sword Art Online is also 2x2, but I used to hear people refer to the second half of season 1 as "the second season", back before SAO2 started. Pretty Cure's seasons are all four cours, and each starts airing right after the previous one ends. High School DxD has had three TV seasons, each one cour.

When talking to non-anime-fans, I think I'd prefer to say "quarter" over "cour". Less jargon to learn.
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DerekL1963
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:02 pm Reply with quote
Justin wrote:
But it's important to remember that unless the show is being created or planned by the anime production studio itself, then the studio is just a vendor. And how vendors work in anime is not much different from vendors in any other line of work, whether it's producing anime or cutting the lawn.


However, it's hard to keep that distinction straight when a good deal of the promotional material focuses on the studio. Which kinda makes sense, as production committees are ephemeral and shadowy and can't really be used as a 'hook' to attract viewers.

leafy sea dragon wrote:
Say, one more thing: This column calls them "seasons," but I see many users of this site call them "cours." What is the difference between them?


In Japan, a season is a broadcast period (Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall). In the West, a season is an uninterrupted broadcast sequence. In Japan a cour is a block (generally 13) of episodes, and the term is not used in the West at all. So for most shows, the terms can be used interchangeably, though it's not technically correct. For longer shows (like the currently airing Sakura Quest at 24 episodes), that's not quite correct because while it's a single season (in Western usage), it's two cour spanning two seasons (by Japanese terminology).

It's not a big deal, and only the most pedantic of nitpickers will call you on it.
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jesusalcala11
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:03 pm Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:

Say, one more thing: This column calls them "seasons," but I see many users of this site call them "cours." What is the difference between them?

A "season" can be as long as a year. "Cours" are sets of 13 weeks, so there are 4 cours per year.
Attack on Titan Season 1 is 25 episodes while Season 2 is 12 episodes. Season 1 would then be two cours while Season 2 is one cour.
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leafy sea dragon



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:18 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:
"Cour" has a pretty fixed meaning -- a quarter-year block of episodes. Anime tends to be made in multiples of those, so you'll have some series that are 12 episodes, some 26, a few kids' shows with 50. (The numbers aren't exact; there's a good amount of variation, but you'll rarely see a 20-episode series.)

"Season" tends to be loosely applied when it comes to anime, but it's pretty convenient for scenarios like American TV, where a show reaches an endpoint, stops airing for a while, then starts again. Less so with year-round shows like Dragon Ball Z, though even for adaptations of long-running manga that model is on its way out.

Examples: My Hero Academia aired one cour last year, in the spring calendar block, and now it's airing a two-cour second season. Code Geass, Log Horizon, Assassination Classroom, Kaiji, and Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans all had two seasons that were two cours each. (Gundam SEED was a single four-cour season back in 2002, and the sequel was another four; like I said, on its way out.) Sword Art Online is also 2x2, but I used to hear people refer to the second half of season 1 as "the second season", back before SAO2 started. Pretty Cure's seasons are all four cours, and each starts airing right after the previous one ends. High School DxD has had three TV seasons, each one cour.

When talking to non-anime-fans, I think I'd prefer to say "quarter" over "cour". Less jargon to learn.


I see. Sounds like anime fans place more importance on mid-season breaks than fans of western television, and they'll divide them up accordingly. South Park commonly takes mid-season breaks, for instance, and My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic is taking one right now, but the breaks themselves are never classified and treated as continuous whenever episodes are listed or organized.

DerekL1963 wrote:

In Japan, a season is a broadcast period (Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall). In the West, a season is an uninterrupted broadcast sequence. In Japan a cour is a block (generally 13) of episodes, and the term is not used in the West at all. So for most shows, the terms can be used interchangeably, though it's not technically correct. For longer shows (like the currently airing Sakura Quest at 24 episodes), that's not quite correct because while it's a single season (in Western usage), it's two cour spanning two seasons (by Japanese terminology).

It's not a big deal, and only the most pedantic of nitpickers will call you on it.


That's okay. No one ever has. It just confused me, is all. Seasons can be interrupted in the west though, as I mentioned about the mid-season breaks just above, which are taken with so little importance that the only way you'd really know a mid-season break happened is if you found a list with original airdates and you spot a gap in them (like what I observed a couple of points into The Twilight Zone's original series).

I initially figured a season was uninterrupted production until I learned in behind-the-scenes information with South Park that that show's mid-season breaks is so that the people in charge of the show (Trey Parker, Matt Stone, Eric Stough) can wind down as they can only handle about 12 to 13 episodes at once, and they finish the rest of the season a couple of months later. In that case, a season is only really defined in their contracts with Comedy Central. South Park has a very atypical production schedule though, and it's the only successful example I know of that has interrupted production mid-season besides continuous-production shows like Saturday Night Live or The Daily Show.
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MarshalBanana



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:24 pm Reply with quote
What I find weird is that sometimes you get a show like Osomatsu, where the studio who made it back in the Showa era make the new version, yet you get something like Log Horizon where a different studio makes a second season within the same year the first season came out.
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Shay Guy



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:34 pm Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:
I see. Sounds like anime fans place more importance on mid-season breaks than fans of western television, and they'll divide them up accordingly. South Park commonly takes mid-season breaks, for instance, and My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic is taking one right now, but the breaks themselves are never classified and treated as continuous whenever episodes are listed or organized.


Yeah, I gotcha. Avatar's extraordinarily messy production schedule also comes to mind, as does the two-month break The Good Place took between episodes 8 and 9 of its recent 13-episode first season (a perfect anime length!).

Another way to think of it is that anime doesn't really take "breaks" that way. You reserve 13 timeslots in consecutive weeks and you will have something to deliver for them, come hell or high water (and both are common). If scheduling goes completely FUBAR, the studio throws together a recap episode, but you can't just say "hey, can we push back the last four episodes a month or so?" except in extraordinary circumstances. Like Madoka's final episodes getting delayed by the tsunami.
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relyat08



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:38 pm Reply with quote
maximilianjenus wrote:
it'd be interesting ot know if this happened with anime original shows o}and which ones (gundam?),


It would depend on if the animation studio is on the production committee. Considering they more often are with Anime Original works, it would be much more unlikely for one to transfer to a different studio(You could say something like Evangelion did, going from Gainax to Khara, but that's a bit different, of course).
Gundam is partially owned by Sunrise, if not fully owned by them, so I don't think that would ever be able to change hands. At least not unless they sold the rights.
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Lord Geo



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:50 pm Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:
This column calls them "seasons," but I see many users of this site call them "cours." What is the difference between them?


The easiest way to think about them is that a cour is a specific span of time, while a season applies to an entire production as a whole. As others mentioned, a season can be any length that's deemed necessary, regardless of how many cours it takes to fully air.
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Animegomaniac



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:36 pm Reply with quote
If I recall the rumors and/or facts correctly, Love SNAFU changed... everything from studios to design and directors... because the original creators pulled a "Gunslingers Girl" as they didn't like the finished result, in this case the dead eyed Hachiman design and the production team clearly favoring Yui over more balanced time between the two girls.

I'm a huge fan of the first season but really dislike the second... for this show and Gunslinger Girl. The original creator doesn't always know what's best for a different medium.

To put it generally, there are cases where the director moves along with the property to new studios or there's a concentrated effort to match seasons but then there are the times where the franchise owners want you to be aware the work is "under new management".
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TasteyCookie



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:55 pm Reply with quote
Sometimes it's a good thing when they change. Snafu season 2 was superior to season 1 in pretty much every way in my eyes. Better animation, better art, better direction, and a much better flow.

That was a more drastic change though than most. As usually when studio's change you can hardly tell much of a difference.
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leafy sea dragon



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:03 pm Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:
Yeah, I gotcha. Avatar's extraordinarily messy production schedule also comes to mind, as does the two-month break The Good Place took between episodes 8 and 9 of its recent 13-episode first season (a perfect anime length!).

Another way to think of it is that anime doesn't really take "breaks" that way. You reserve 13 timeslots in consecutive weeks and you will have something to deliver for them, come hell or high water (and both are common). If scheduling goes completely FUBAR, the studio throws together a recap episode, but you can't just say "hey, can we push back the last four episodes a month or so?" except in extraordinary circumstances. Like Madoka's final episodes getting delayed by the tsunami.


Ah, that makes sense. I forgot it goes hand in hand with the status of reruns between Japan and the western world, where western television will just show reruns as the show goes on break even if it's in the middle of a season, and that's why we don't consider mid-season breaks that important, whereas a mid-season break in an anime has to be planned in advance, both its starting point and stopping point. (On the other hand, I am pretty sure the South Park mid-season breaks ARE planned out in advance too, and Comedy Central lets them do it as long as they can finish out the rest of the season by the end of the 12-month period.)

Lord Geo wrote:
The easiest way to think about them is that a cour is a specific span of time, while a season applies to an entire production as a whole. As others mentioned, a season can be any length that's deemed necessary, regardless of how many cours it takes to fully air.


Hmm, my impression has always been that a season is a more or less 12-month period, though I know they can vary a bit. Early seasons of The Simpsons were shorter than 12 months, but they settled on an exactly 12-month cycle after enough time (which I'm guessing is to ensure there is a Treehouse of Horror episode every season).
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