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Eh, this coincidences don't bother me. This is a comedy, not a mystery. For better or for worse, Moriko isn't the type of person who is likely to agree to IRL meetings with people from the game, so coincidental IRL meetings are the only way to get these people together IRL which is more fun than if they never meet IRL.

Episode 4

The first half where they were opening lootboxes wasn't that good except for the beginning where the store clerk managed to talk to Moriko. I liked when the old guy who came to buy smokes interrupted the two and Moriko didn't how to deal with that so she just quietly walked away and then worried about the whole thing on her way home. Laughing

The 2nd half of this episode was the really fun part. MoriMori-chan being forced to go out for a few drinks with Koiwai seems exciting. I'm hoping that Koiwai intends to do the classic thing where he'll ask Yuuta to come along as well and then cancel at the last minute.

Well, if he doesn't at least invite Yuuka along then he's being a huge dick. I assumed that was his plan from the start, but then it seemed he was more interested in rubbing Yuuta's face in the fact that he got a "date" whereas Yuuta didn't. The eppie ended on what I consider a cliff-hanger with Yuuta obviously starting to suspect who "Hayashi" might really be. Can't wait for next week!

Probably my favorite episode yet, so much social awkwardness! I definitely remember my days in sales, and wanting to talk to certain customers more. But the people in line would always, understandably, stare daggers at me haha "Come again!" Sounds too familiar.

The part where Lilac was enduring the criticism directed at her gear was hard to watch. Been in similar situations, where a clanmate would just go to town on another for microtransactions, and tension skyrocketed. I personally don't partake in microtransactions, but don't go making fun of someone's gear when they clearly like it :/

Honestly, every sequence in this episode is relatable, so I enjoyed it quite a bit. It was also nice to see Mori get excited about conversations with real people. It seems she does want to interact with people, but is still very much afraid. She's gonna have to overcome that fear soon, though, because there was a sentence in the episode that tells us her savings might be running low.

Regardless of if Koiwai is planning to bring Yuuta along, I still actually have a positive look at him. I think it is actually clear that he sees the type of person Moriko is, and forcing her into a bit of RL socialisation would be good for her, and he actually seems like a good guy about it, despite his teasing of the guy that clearly has more of a crush on her. I thought earlier he might be a bit of a player (not game kind), but he actually seems like a nice guy. And all is fair in love and war, or all those sorts of things.

Yet, Yuuta putting the pieces together that Hayashi's story is way too similar to that of Moriko, was something that had me laughing. I don't know what it is about this show, it is not like wacky hijinks, but parts just give me a good laugh.

Also, interesting new piece of information. Pokotaro and Himeralda are apparently a real life couple, which is an interesting addition.

Regardless, I am really looking forward to next episode, considering how things will go from here.

Clearly the mangaka is/has been an rpg player. That was exactly my experience and why I got so gun-shy about ever revealing any details about my real life unless I was pretty sure even the people I was talking about wouldn't recognize themselves. This show... ::shaking my head::

Koiwai is a snarky trickster of a guy, but I too think he's a good guy, considering also how compassionate he was toward Morimori-chan on the phone.

Episode 5

Looks like Moriko got the wrong date, and was under threat of feeling like she was stood up, but Yuuta took all the possible sivns that it could have been a coincidence, and went to the rescue. And still looks like the date is happening next episode. Hopefully good for her self esteem, although it did hurt her bank balance a little.

I want to use this to also going on the discussion that Koiwai is not a bad guy, he does invite Yuuta along, and I think Moriko is looking forward to it. Perfectly reasonable that she could do so.

Also news in that Kanbe found out who Moriko is, and along with him knowing Lily is a dude, althoughrobably not that they have met. I liked all this, it was fun.

No, Koiwai is a jerk, just not as big a jerk as he would have been if he hadn't invited Sakurai along. Look, I'm not joking about this and I don't want to hear any mealy-mouthed justification for Koiwai's action so let me spell it out: it is not cool, especially when you don't know a person very well, to pressure them into a social situation, ESPECIALLY when you plan to include a person that you KNOW they have already politely rebuffed. That is an effin' jerk move and anybody who doesn't recognize that has some fairly wonky social interaction views.

So you say that he is less of a jerk for Yuta, but then say he is for doing so. Again, you say that he pressured her into a social situation, but it really is not that bad as she is clearly kind of interested in it, only kind of anxious that she has let herself go a bit and needed to prepare. Though, maybe I have some "fairly wonky social interaction views", after all I have anxiety, especially in social situations. Which I will instead say that I might have some merit in understanding what someone who also have social issues might feel about things.

I don't know, I could totally see myself turning down and trying to escape social situations, while at the same time kind hoping to actually be made to go. You are focussing on her internal monologue about having her exits blocked in her being really made to do something she does not want, but that is not necessarily how a pretty deep introvert who understands that they probably need some socialisation. Agreed that it might be wrong to some people who refuse date because they really do not want to, and were trapped by being polite in accepting, a sort of predatory behaviour, maybe trying to take advantage of her, but that is not what happened.

This is my last time explaining this because I'm starting to get super pissed off. The only reason I'm persisting in this is that in this day and age I don't believe that people should support crappy behaviour towards women.

DP - and PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS BECAUSE IT IS 'EFFIN IMPORTANT - you do not PRESSURE a woman into going out to drinks with you. AND PLEASE DO NOT REPEAT THE STUPIDITY OF "oooo, but she's not that against it." The IMPORTANT POINT is that Koiwai had NO IDEA how Moriko would feel about the invitation other than HE WAS ALREADY AWARE SHE HAD TURNED DOWN A GUY HE WAS PLANNING TO FORCE HER TO SEE AGAIN. Why is that point not registering with you? No seriously WHY IS THAT POINT NOT REGISTERING WITH YOU??? Jesus Christ.

Ugh, I have to stop writing about this, it is raising my blood pressure. No wonder there are women who have so many difficulties in real life ... just too many guys out there THAT JUST DON'T EFFIN' GET IT.

And I am all for stopping gross behaviour against women, but I really think you are exaggerating the whole situation. If you are saying to never put any pressure whatsoever to get a women to drink with you, than it you are pretty much saying to never ask a woman out for a drink, or anything. Because really any invitation can be some level of putting pressure on the other. And we really were seeing that scene through the mind of a woman who clearly has some social issues, that really any interaction at all can feel like some pressure. Indeed Koiwai was able to take the situation to avoid Moriko's usual avoidance of the situation, but it was not nearly as you seem to think it was..

And if you think this stance at all is any indication that I am or would become a person who would be trying to manipulate women to go drinking with, then it is laughably mischaracterisation. I don't or rarely drink, and am a person who worries endlessly over being a bother to someone else, even those who clearly are enjoying the interaction, that it is actually a problem. I may not be a woman myself, but I can see parts of myself in parts of Moriko, and sympathise where an interaction could be uncomfortable. Especially if what was running through my head was used to frame the interaction, like quasy being harassed, but not entirely indicative of how it actually went, because that is just how things go when you are like that. The store clerk was worried that it was a situation where she was being harassed, but saw that it really was not a problem when she became familiar with him.

I don't know, maybe I am being wrong, or having a bad look. But I really think the anger being measured is from by some of her internal monologue, which needs to have certain factors taken into account. I don't want to get to serious about it, chances are it is not a direct one to one, but a character I think Moriko shares a great similarity to is Tomoko from Watamote, only around a lot longer that she has a certain grasp of her capabilities in looking after herself. But the big things were in how that show the internal struggles inside of Tomoko could be practically violent, where the smallest interaction could practically be a panic attack, and as suffering from similar things, that the display was not such an exaggeration as some might think. Years later some of those internal freak outs don't just go away, you just learn to avoid them more, even if you sort of don't always want to.

What Koiwai did was barely pressure her, it was only in the sense of a socially anxious person who usually avoids any such interactions, which is what was used to frame the line "he is cutting off my exits". It was actually humorous to me who could recall similar level of feeling of exits being removed, the thing that stops us from doing things for our own benefit. I actually could directly relate it to recent situations I had, where I have been job searching and my des providers finally found something. It was actually causing some pretty large anxiety where on the outside it just appeared like a great time of a long wait and opportunity, if my internal monologue was being used you would have thought that I was being aggressively pushed into a sudden commitment, that was taking away my freedom like a slave, and causing problems for everyone involved. Yet I also knew it was not really that bad, and that if that was the case I could have put a stop to it because I have agency against something I think is actually bad. And it is like the same feeling that people think the some situations in Watamote are just cringe, yet I actually find hilarious, because the actual conflict is something you mostly made in your head, and it really was not that bad.

Let me break down Koiwai's behaviour for you:

He finds out that a woman has politely rebuffed a friend's invitation to dinner. This is a woman he doesn't know very well, having never met her in person and only knows from some work-related telephone calls. So he decided - without consulting with the friend who confided in him - to go and find the woman in person to ask her out fro drinks. He finds her and deliberately makes it impossible for her to politely decline. He doesn't tell her that his real agenda is to set up a situation where she will be forced to meet in person a man she has already politely turned down.

So, DP you HONESTLY think there is nothing wrong with what I've outlined above? This is perfectly acceptable behaviour? Wow... just... wow.

Blood- wrote:

He finds her and deliberately makes it impossible for her to politely decline.

I don't agree with this, I don't think it was impossible to politely turn it down. What was backed more in a corner was that she cannot find a reason to herself not to go.

Blood- wrote:

He doesn't tell her that his real agenda is to set up a situation where she will be forced to meet in person a man she has already politely turned down.

And that is also up to dispute, because while he has somewhat invited Yuta, that he went there because Yuta has been a little lovesick, he actually has not made it yet a case that it is a bait and switch. I don't think Yuta has even made it a case that he will go yet based on his conversations.

And at the end of the day, it is just a few drinks, it is not like he is taking her on intimate romantic dinner, forcing such a situation on her or Yuta.

Amazing. You can actually bring yourself to admit that he backed her into a corner. Well, that's progress I guess.

But, you can't bring yourself to acknowledge that Koiwai did this to bring Yuta along as opposed to, oh, he just REALLY wants to have a drink with Moriko alone. Rolling Eyes

Yeah, it's kind of hard to have an intelligent conversation with this level of cluelessness.

Oh, and by the way, of course you won't recognize it because your entire soul is dedicated to believing that Koiwai is not a jerk in any way, but IF you are right and Koiwai had no intention of inviting Yuta along then his teasing about how he got a date with Moriko when Yuta couldn't would make him a super jerk. Oh, except in your mind where it actually makes him a hero for spurring Yuta on to greater efforts in the future. Rolling Eyes

DuskyPredator wrote:

Blood- wrote:

He finds her and deliberately makes it impossible for her to politely decline.

I don't agree with this, I don't think it was impossible to politely turn it down. What was backed more in a corner was that she cannot find a reason to herself not to go.

I have to agree with Blood on this one. Koiwai specifically cut off all the typical polite excuses one might give not to go (like "sorry, I'm busy") before she could even make them. The only way she could possibly have turned him down was to straight up say "I'm not comfortable with drinking with you, I just don't want to go." This is typically not considered "polite", and societal pressures make it really hard to say this. Doubly so in public, triply so if you have anxiety, quadruply so if you're a woman - because women pushing back against men socially even a little is on the whole much more harshly condemned than the reverse. (Just telling someone who's mostly a stranger to you "I'm not really comfortable meeting you alone in a situation with alcohol" is "being a bitch" if you're a woman.) The fact that there was someone watching (Fujimoto, who she didn't know was someone she was already friends with online at the time) makes it even harder.

I will give you this much - I don't think Koiwai had malicious intentions here. He's simply naturally obnoxious and pushy, and has never been given reason to think about this sort of thing, because as a guy he's much less likely to be put in a similar situation. That being said, just because he didn't have active intent to do Moriko harm doesn't change the fact that his behavior was extremely bad. This sort of social manipulation is used by pick-up artists in real life, and puts real women in very real danger. Acting like that, even without any intention to do harm, perpetuates its social acceptability - it actively makes women less safe.

The fact that he considered bringing a man she had politely rejected is even worse - this is essentially bypassing Moriko's consent by trying to circumvent her previous rejection. Just because Yuta is smitten with her, she is in no way obligated to spend any amount of time with him.

DuskyPredator wrote:

Blood- wrote:

He doesn't tell her that his real agenda is to set up a situation where she will be forced to meet in person a man she has already politely turned down.

And that is also up to dispute, because while he has somewhat invited Yuta, that he went there because Yuta has been a little lovesick, he actually has not made it yet a case that it is a bait and switch. I don't think Yuta has even made it a case that he will go yet based on his conversations.

And at the end of the day, it is just a few drinks, it is not like he is taking her on intimate romantic dinner, forcing such a situation on her or Yuta.

No. It's not just a few drinks. It's drinking alone with someone she barely knows because a man felt obligated to her time and forced her into a situation where she felt she couldn't refuse.

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