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EP. REVIEW: Jūni Taisen: Zodiac War


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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 11:38 am Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
How ironic that you would make that comment mere hours after All Hallow's Eve, Gina. It's the same principle: we don the costumes of things we fear to ward off evil. Geez. Wink

People are afraid of cowboys and sexy nurses?
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 12:01 pm Reply with quote
Well... I'm afraid of sexy cowboys...
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 2:43 pm Reply with quote
I don’t really have any interest in learning anything more about the tournament or its consequences. I’m fully invested in seeing what happens to Monkey and Rat – anything else is at this point for me just an interesting diversion (the fates of Sheep and the rest of the warriors) or a mildly annoying distraction (the exposition of the tournament consequences at the beginning of the episode). The show locks you into the POV of a set of different characters, and so the only consequences of the tournament I really care about are the consequences for the characters I care about – namely Monkey. Of course I’m still interested in finding out more about the other warriors (especially Tiger’s actual threat level and Rat’s talent), but the show for me at this point is squarely about finding out how long Monkey is going to survive and how successful she will be at enforcing a non-violent outcome.

I imagine the next episode will cover Tiger's backstory, which I’m quite interested in now.


Last edited by 鏡 on Wed Nov 01, 2017 6:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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BodaciousSpacePirate
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 3:40 pm Reply with quote
Blood- wrote:
Well... I'm afraid of sexy cowboys...


We're probably one Hollywood blockbuster western film away from you having a really bad Halloween.
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JB_Gra



Joined: 15 Aug 2017
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2017 7:53 pm Reply with quote
鏡 wrote:
I imagine the next episode will cover Tiger's backstory, which I’m quite interested in now.


So far the backstory of the day have corresponded to the character featured on the preview, so I'm betting it's now Horse turn. If they mention something about Tiger's past then I don't think they will go into detail about it.

One thing I don't understand is why they would call Ram's grandson to fight. I mean, Juni Taisen is supposed to be a gathering of powerful warriors and it didn't seem to me that Ram's grandson would go the warrior route.
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SilverTalon01



Joined: 02 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:30 am Reply with quote
Ep 5 user reviews were a bit higher than I would have thought. I guess I'm of a minority opinion that the handling for the content was super shit.

We were left hanging last week with the tease of a great fight. I was willing to accept that we might not get it and instead get some world building and Ram's backstory. However, the constant brief teases of the fight during the episode between Ram's sections just felt really awful. Ram's scenes in the present were hardly animated, and every time he came back, all I could think of was 'I don't care about you, pan back to the fight'. They just kept teasing what I really wanted while at the same time trying to get me invested in something new, and it didn't work for me at all.
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Alexis.Anagram



Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 278
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:02 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
You can understand on an intellectual level who is winning or losing, and you might know a good game is being played based on the cheers of the crowd, but the experience remains an impersonal one.

This is a pretty good summary of how the show feels for me so far. I'm watching it for the pure entertainment value, but it doesn't even embrace that quality to the extent that it ought to: I feel like every time I start to find a reason to care about a particular thread of the plot it pulls away, either by killing off the focal character or shifting attention somewhere else. Every episode starts with a hook and ends with my interest piqued, which is effective in that it keeps me coming back, but OTOH everything in between feels like it got stretched to fill run time.

Gotta say, though, I felt an immediate sense of comradery with Tiger at the end of this episode. Which is to say I would definitely be the one dressed in an outfit that looks like it was picked out of a discount Halloween store knocking back a couple of bottles in the park while waiting for the chaos of war to descend upon me and surviving only by virtue of being so weak nobody even bothers to notice.
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James_Beckett
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Joined: 23 Nov 2015
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:38 pm Reply with quote
Alexis.Anagram wrote:

Gotta say, though, I felt an immediate sense of comradery with Tiger at the end of this episode. Which is to say I would definitely be the one dressed in an outfit that looks like it was picked out of a discount Halloween store knocking back a couple of bottles in the park while waiting for the chaos of war to descend upon me and surviving only by virtue of being so weak nobody even bothers to notice.


Look, I'm not saying that this spoke to me on a profoundly deep and personal level, but... Wink
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:15 pm Reply with quote
spoiler[RIP...best girl...we hardly knew ye...I guess Nisio was more interested in exploring Rat's perspective than Monkey's...I was hoping she'd transmute her body back together, but I guess I'm too naive for the Taisen. Really sucks that she had to die by falling for a trick like that - doesn't seem super in character to me that she would.]
Anime cry

Rat's power remains mysterious: the direction of his conversation with Horse made me think he was using telepathy at one point but I guess that's not it. I guess I'll "move my chips" from Monkey to Rat now...
Anime cry

The recurring theme in these battles is the presuppositions of what is relevant in a battle formed by a fighter's experience with battle leading to their undoing when their opponent relies on a variable that isn't included in those presuppositions. This has happened in pretty much every death so far (except Rooster's), spoiler[but Monkey didn't really strike me as someone vulnerable to that kind of myopia in the same way. I guess the show tried to establish that she was at the very end by having her focus solely on Rabbit's fighting style, which isn't really his central trait, but she already knew he was a necromantist, so why would she suddenly forget to consider that he had corpses around aiding him? ]
Anime cry
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JacobC
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:19 pm Reply with quote
I believe the answer to all those questions is spoiler[they're killing and profiling all the Zodiac members in reverse order, so the gimmick comes before all else in the writing.]

Seriously, people called this in episode two and the pattern has held true through six episodes, this is the most predictable battle royale ever. I have no idea why NisiOisin thought it was a good idea.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:38 pm Reply with quote
Seems you're right. When I read that theory I avoided looking up the order and was hoping it would prove untrue. spoiler[Now that I have looked it up I see my guess about Rat was right, but seeing as how he's now been established as the central philosophical perspective in the show, I guess it's not surprising anyway.]

It's really a shame though if sticking to that order means he has to contort established characters into positions which will enable that order to occur. If making sure his characters die in that order means betraying their traits in order to manufacture a weakness, or if it means ditching characters with thematically interesting perspectives, or if it means...spoiler[killing Monkey.]

Like, it makes a lot of sense that spoiler[Boar would go that way, given her explicit reliance on a very strategically inflexible tactic, her arrogance, and her extreme condescension to the abilities of the other competitors. Monkey was written as Boar's nearly dialectical opposite though, so it's pretty strange and extremely sad to see her go the same way.]

I guess Nisio has something he wants to say with Rat's "violence is good, actually" theory, so I guess that's what I'll be looking forward to. It is a bit strange to position him as the central voice of the show and have him still basically concur with Monkey that he's too ignorant to understand the value of her pacifism - he's being proven right by the simple fact that he's alive.

Anime cry
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James_Beckett
ANN Reviewer


Joined: 23 Nov 2015
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Location: USA
PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:12 pm Reply with quote
JacobC wrote:
I believe the answer to all those questions is spoiler[they're killing and profiling all the Zodiac members in reverse order, so the gimmick comes before all else in the writing.]

Seriously, people called this in episode two and the pattern has held true through six episodes, this is the most predictable battle royale ever. I have no idea why NisiOisin thought it was a good idea.


One would imagine that the thrill is *supposed* to come from seeing the how and why of the deaths, but even that has proven sporadic and underwhelming so far. I haven't seen the newest episode yet, granted, but still. Save maybe for Rooster, all of the deaths and conflicts we have gotten so far have been surprisingly haphazard and undercooked.
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kenatsu



Joined: 25 Jun 2013
Posts: 30
Location: LA
PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 5:05 pm Reply with quote
鏡 wrote:
Seems you're right. When I read that theory I avoided looking up the order and was hoping it would prove untrue. spoiler[Now that I have looked it up I see my guess about Rat was right, but seeing as how he's now been established as the central philosophical perspective in the show, I guess it's not surprising anyway.]

It's really a shame though if sticking to that order means he has to contort established characters into positions which will enable that order to occur. If making sure his characters die in that order means betraying their traits in order to manufacture a weakness, or if it means ditching characters with thematically interesting perspectives, or if it means...spoiler[killing Monkey.]

Like, it makes a lot of sense that spoiler[Boar would go that way, given her explicit reliance on a very strategically inflexible tactic, her arrogance, and her extreme condescension to the abilities of the other competitors. Monkey was written as Boar's nearly dialectical opposite though, so it's pretty strange and extremely sad to see her go the same way.]

I guess Nisio has something he wants to say with Rat's "violence is good, actually" theory, so I guess that's what I'll be looking forward to. It is a bit strange to position him as the central voice of the show and have him still basically concur with Monkey that he's too ignorant to understand the value of her pacifism - he's being proven right by the simple fact that he's alive.

Anime cry

It is pretty obvious. One thing I have noticed is if any character gets a backstory, they become the next character that dies. That's kind of lame and too predictable in my opinion. I'm starting to lose interest in this series.
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Joshua Zarate



Joined: 12 Jan 2017
Posts: 2061
PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 7:44 pm Reply with quote
Well, we got 3 deaths in episode 6, so that’s a bit different at least. Also, I‘m wondering why I’m now seeing spoiler tags in this thread. Isn’t episode review threads here for certain anime fair game for not putting spoiler tags relating to what happened in their most recent episode or am I wrong? I think anybody would know that these threads contain spoilers galore for their specific anime, so I’m curious as to why people are starting to put spoiler tags here just now.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:03 pm Reply with quote
JacobC wrote:
I believe the answer to all those questions is spoiler[they're killing and profiling all the Zodiac members in reverse order, so the gimmick comes before all else in the writing.]

Seriously, people called this in episode two and the pattern has held true through six episodes, this is the most predictable battle royale ever. I have no idea why NisiOisin thought it was a good idea.


I agree. Clearly, the underlying message of sacrificing plot interest this way is, "it's not the destination that's important, it's the journey." Which is all fine and well IF you replace plot suspense with something else of value. In my opinion, that has not been done. Seeing flashbacks of the warriors' lives before the Battle Royale is... okay... but that in itself is no compensation for dispensing with, "hey, who's gonna win this thing? who's gonna die next???"


Last edited by Blood- on Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
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