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NEWS: Anime Industry Takes in Record 2.0 Trillion Yen in 2016


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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23668
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:29 am Reply with quote
I'm glad to hear that the value of anime continues to increase. The one fact that did jump out at me from the article was the one noting that it took eleven years for the value of overseas sales to exceed the previous peak set in 2005. You really see the impact of China when it is noted that overseas value was was 19.5 billion yen in 2015 and then 34.9 billion yen a mere year later. Yeah, given the huge rise in a short period of time, fears of a bubble are well-founded.

Not surprised to see that live events are having an impact as well. When I first started reading here at ANN back in 2009, you very rarely saw an item about a live stage show based on an anime being mounted. Now you see those kinds of articles all the time.
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kiminobokuwa



Joined: 18 Sep 2015
Posts: 547
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:49 am Reply with quote
omiya wrote:
#861208 wrote:
Live events are so massive. If someone doesn't start streaming them to English sites, that's a problem.


As in Love Live! [Sunshine] live events? I have yet to attend anything in Tokyo Dome, but have attended several Animelo Summer Live concerts in Saitama Super Arena and a few Animax Musix concerts in Yokohama Arena, and solo concerts by Nana Mizuki, Minori Chihara, and others.

I've also been to a couple of lives where the artist performed one of their anime songs at my request and there were about 30 in the audience each time. I don't think those events would be captured in the statistics, maybe not even the talks given by Yuuho Iwasato despite how many anime songs' lyrics she wrote.


I don't kmow what you attended or where but the concerts are always a huge sale overseas
A lot of these concerts sell out over here too. (And i'm talking about a couple hundred people) i think the idol industry has helped in the Anime Sales. A lot of idol Anime are stoll coming out soon so, it's not so obscure.
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yuna49



Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 3804
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:06 am Reply with quote
I guess one indicator of growth in the industry is that this year's AJA report costs about ¥10,000 yen to download whereas prior year's reports were free!

I will repeat my usual observations about stories like this one. The ¥20 million figure represents a very broad definition of the anime industry. The figures that apply more closely to what we watch are called the "Japanese animation market in a limited sense" in prior reports. This definition excludes large ancillary sources of revenue like merchandising and Pachinko royalties and looks more at the revenues generated by domestic production instead. In 2016 this "market in a limited sense" earned just ¥201 billion compared to the "broad" figure of ¥1,826 billion. From 2013 to 2015 the limited market, which presumably more closely represents earnings to studios and animators, failed to keep pace with the growth of the broad market.


Last edited by yuna49 on Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:17 am; edited 3 times in total
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sputn1k



Joined: 29 Sep 2016
Posts: 52
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:11 am Reply with quote
Romuska wrote:
So how much of these record-breaking grossings are going to the animators?


Studios are usually hired to work on the titles, they don't hold an ownership stake in the projects. Means that they do not earn a percentage of the revenue like the financiers of the show. They have to bargain with the companies offering the work about their own pay, which they are usually not very good at.

Think of it like this:
A real estate company hires a construction company erect a residential building. That construction company will not receive a percentage of revenue coming in via the rent paid by the tenants after the building is completed, or if the company that had it built sells the building.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23668
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:26 am Reply with quote
@ yuna49 - you've edited your post three times now and still haven't gotten in quite right. I assume by "¥20 million figure" you actually mean 2.0009 trillion yen cited in ANN's article, correct?
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Moroboshi-san



Joined: 06 Apr 2015
Posts: 174
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 10:38 am Reply with quote
yuna49 wrote:
This definition excludes large ancillary sources of revenue like merchandising and Pachinko royalties and looks more at the revenues generated by domestic production instead.

I agree to this. Slapping manga characters on side of pachinko machine or merchandise has practically nothing to do with the revenue generated by anime based on the same manga. The numbers in this report do not represent "anime industry" as it claims but rather "revenue generated by entertainment franchises which happen to have anime in the media mix. This is actually random and almost meaningless figure.

To get to know how anime industry really performs you need to dig much deeper down into the numbers as suggested.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:05 am Reply with quote
I don't agree at all. Is the money generated from ancillary streams worth less than money generated by more direct means? That makes no sense. The makers of merchandise have to pay license fees and royalties to rights-holders. Take that money away and... there's less money.
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Jonny Mendes



Joined: 17 Oct 2014
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:06 am Reply with quote
Moroboshi-san wrote:

I agree to this. Slapping manga characters on side of pachinko machine or merchandise has practically nothing to do with the revenue generated by anime based on the same manga. The numbers in this report do not represent "anime industry" as it claims but rather "revenue generated by entertainment franchises which happen to have anime in the media mix. This is actually random and almost meaningless figure.

To get to know how anime industry really performs you need to dig much deeper down into the numbers as suggested.


This report is for Anime industry. And that means that if they talk about "pachinko machine or merchandise or live concerts" is the ones generated by anime originals and entertainment franchises that have anime as the source. Think about something like Yuri on Ice,

Also the figures include anime revenues that have manga/LN/games as the source, but only count the revenues from sales and licenses of the anime part of the franchise.
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Moroboshi-san



Joined: 06 Apr 2015
Posts: 174
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:11 am Reply with quote
Jonny Mendes wrote:
This report is for Anime industry. And that means that if they talk about "pachinko machine or merchandise or live concerts" is the ones generated by anime originals and entertainment franchises that have anime as the source.

No they don't. Report covers anime whatever the source.
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Jonny Mendes



Joined: 17 Oct 2014
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Location: Europe
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:27 am Reply with quote
Moroboshi-san wrote:
Jonny Mendes wrote:
This report is for Anime industry. And that means that if they talk about "pachinko machine or merchandise or live concerts" is the ones generated by anime originals and entertainment franchises that have anime as the source.

No they don't. Report covers anime whatever the source.


-Japanese animation market trends in a broad sense (i.e. market size based on estimated revenues in animation and animation‐related markets) is the part of the report you are talking about.

-Trends in Japanese animation market in a limited sense (i.e. market size based on the estimated revenues of all domestic commercial animation studios) is the part that of the report im talking about.

Is very easy to see difference of the numbers and to find what you are looking for.

But your are right in this article they don't say anything about the Trends in a limited sense and only in the broad sense. I really would like to see the numbers about domestic commercial animation studios because they reflect better the anime trends.
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anime_layer



Joined: 03 Apr 2004
Posts: 45
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 12:00 pm Reply with quote
Stuart Smith wrote:
There's so much disconnect with merchandise, events, stores, museums, collaborations, fanart, doujinshi, and trends that Westerners will never hear about or know exists unless they actively take part in the Japanese fandom. Honestly, the western fandoms are pretty neglegible when it comes to Japanese media. If one only sticks to English communities, they really do miss virtually everything.

Why does that matter? People have different ways to enjoy their hobbies, for some that might involve being very informed about the context in which the work was created, others are fine with just enjoying it on its own merits. I don't see how that is a «disconnect» or «negligent».

yuna49 wrote:
I guess one indicator of growth in the industry is that this year's AJA report costs about ¥10,000 yen to download whereas prior year's reports were free!

Those are the summaries, which are released later than the full report. The full report was never free.
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2658
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 12:24 pm Reply with quote
Jonny Mendes wrote:
Sometime in the near future, China will have their on Chinese animation industry in full throttle and foreign animation (Japanese anime) will have no place in China. Also the dominance on Chinese animation will extend to other countries even if is a copy of anime style (it will be allot cheaper to license than Japanese anime, im sure)


That is nothing but an opium dream. China has not a national or international "anime" series or movies that rivals any of the big hits done by japan. Overtaking anime is as close as overtaking hollywood or smartphone/console/computer gaming. The reason the japan anime market is cautious and talks about a possible bubble is because the chinese government can ban tomorrow any streaming of anime (this year the government has tightened their grip on the internet inside china) and there is nothing Japan can do to prevent it. Meanwhile in the USA the market is changing so fast as to seem unstable, no one can predict if next year or the year after that everything will continue as planed. Heck, it would take one tweet from the president to turn everything on its head.
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residentgrigo



Joined: 23 Dec 2007
Posts: 2404
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 1:07 pm Reply with quote
I would love to see a deeper financial breakdown, as how much the studios and license holders get back for example. Or how much is spend on making all the product that generated this revenue. Still, growth is good but it´s kinda hard to learn all that much from this.
The Life of Pi for example made 5,5 times it´s budget in cinemas alone and won major awards yet the people who made that CG tiger possible still lost their jobs. Films making sure is a fickle mistress and
Quote:
The report cautions that it is possible that this is a bubble; it mentions geopolitical tensions in the East Asian region and the potential online enforcement of a 2006 Chinese law (that prohibits foreign animation from airing during primetime) as possible reasons for future decline.

can´t be overlooked either. The sky ain´t falling but growth does not equal stability. Japan is kinda infamous for that actually. We´ll see.
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#861208



Joined: 07 Oct 2016
Posts: 423
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 1:43 pm Reply with quote
anime_layer wrote:
Stuart Smith wrote:
There's so much disconnect with merchandise, events, stores, museums, collaborations, fanart, doujinshi, and trends that Westerners will never hear about or know exists unless they actively take part in the Japanese fandom. Honestly, the western fandoms are pretty neglegible when it comes to Japanese media. If one only sticks to English communities, they really do miss virtually everything.

Why does that matter? People have different ways to enjoy their hobbies, for some that might involve being very informed about the context in which the work was created, others are fine with just enjoying it on its own merits. I don't see how that is a «disconnect» or «negligent».


There is a reason why this matters, and it's the same as the reason why this report covers more than just animated works.

There are a ton of works made in Japan, for anime fan (/otaku/fujoshi/whatever) audiences, that are not anime, and these works never get exported, unless they get an anime and the anime is popular without the source material.

I'm not saying these works should be shoved down Western fans' throats, just that everyone should have access to them, because they're interesting.

Tsukiuta is a good example. Last year, this series got an anime, that was pretty badly animated (except for the openings), and was mostly just the characters doing nothing. Western fans just saw that, and thought, "this thing is horrible, how could anyone like it?" But in Japan, it's massively popular, because the real center of the franchise is not the anime. But it's not a manga, novel, or game, either - it's the music and stage plays. The point of the series is to have seiyuu sing songs by popular vocaloid composers. If someone were to take a chance and release some of that here, a lot of people would probably like it.

(As for seiyuu being irrelevant for dub watchers, that's not true. I used to watch dubs exclusively until I could understand enough Japanese to basically not need subtitles. Even then, I loved character songs, and other seiyuu music (though, the seiyuu music now is way better than it was then).)

Also, I keep needing to clarify this - when I talk about live events being made available here, I'm talking about the filmed version of the live event that gets released on DVD in Japan. If you look at the DVD and BD sales charts that ANN posts, half the times they'll say that a Touken Ranbu stage play, or seiyuu concert, was #1 on the overall charts. Selling 30,000 copies. That's not all people who saw the musical live.

When I was in Japan last December, the Code Geass event and two of the Black Butler musicals aired on TV. The filmed versions are not just for people who have seen the live version - they're for people who couldn't make it to see the live version. This is also why the Met Opera simulcasts ~10 performances every season in movie theaters (I'm sure you've seen the Fathom Events ads for this. Go see them, they're good <3 See L'Elisir d'amore in January.)

Anime stage events also have live viewings, in Japan and internationally. I went to one for the Code Geass event. This would be harder to organize in America, to do in a movie theater, especially considering time differences, but it can be done online, or at a convention.

A convention in India also had a bunch of the Touken Ranbu musical actors as guests.
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2658
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 2:07 pm Reply with quote
#861208 wrote:
If someone were to take a chance and release some of that here, a lot of people would probably like it.


You are forgetting history. Thirty years ago fans did not shout at the clouds "anime is great, they should sell it over here". They had a the conviction that people should see them and they subtitled it. Before you start to say that it is hard, back then it was a lot harder, nowadays you have well crafted free programs that help you fabsub on your average computer, back then you had to buy a commodore amiga, buy a genlock and produce crappy VHS copies that required as much time to copy as the time required to watch the whole thing.

If truly there are fans of this things out there, they should put time and effort into translating it just like fans did decades ago with anime and manga. The other possibility is simple, there is a nice cloud over there that seems to need an earful.
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