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Answerman - What's With The Tiny Trucks In Japan?


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WingKing



Joined: 27 Apr 2015
Posts: 617
PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:53 pm Reply with quote
Alan45 wrote:
Back in the late 1960s in Naples Italy and Saigon VN I saw really small trucks. They had three wheels and were based on a standard Lambretta Motor scooter. They had three wheels with the scooter's back wheel replaced by an axel and a small truck body. Inside the cab you could see the normal scooter front end with handle bars. It was amazing the loads they would put on them, especially in an area a hilly as Naples. In Saigon they were used as busses as well. I wonder if they are still sold.


Those were probably Apecars, made by Piaggio, and yes they still sell those (although globally Piaggio would be best known for their Vespa scooters). I used to play Cruis'n World all the time when that was an A-list arcade game in the mid-90s, and my car of choice to drive in that game was the "Gimpee," which was basically the game's version of an Apecar, albeit with a top speed over 100 mph faster than any real-life Apecar could ever manage. I just liked it because it was fun to drive, and it was even more fun to kick people's fannies using the smallest and squarest car in the game.
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#hiros7039



Joined: 09 Feb 2017
Posts: 31
PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:19 pm Reply with quote
Of course, Japanology has an episode of this.

Kei cars can put western automakers out of business if there weren't regulations protecting them. Far roomier than the Smart, but Japan has an exclusive kei converted Smart since it originally didn't meet the width and engine regulations. Four-seaters are typically boxy shaped making most use of space. You could fit a bicycle if you collapse the back seats.
Not to mention they make campers too.

This is one of those examples of Galapagos Syndrome use in Japan evolving technology its own way not spreading overseas.
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leafy sea dragon



Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:25 pm Reply with quote
What about the lack of walls or any other sort of protection on the back of those pickup trucks? Why are they absent? Would it have driven up the price too much?

KuroiEr wrote:
660cc?!! Wow my motorcycle is has an engine over twice that size (1500cc if you're wondering). No wonder they aren't sold here. They'd be completely impractical. Sure are cute tho. Closest thing we have in the states are those smart cars.


Indeed, that was a major reason Honda initially had problems selling their motorcycles in the United States. The small engines were fine with navigating the narrow, dense urban roads in Japan, especially as they turned quite well, but they didn't have the power to travel on the straighter, more open American roads. Honda motorcycles also tended to overheat in the desert areas, as the Honda people simply imported the motorcycles over without accounting for the different environment.

mangamuscle wrote:
They are also popular in Mexico. I guess they like there trucks big in the USA; I wonder if they are compensating for something. Cool


It was also mentioned in the article that most to all of these trucks do not meet safety standards in the United States, Canada, or most of Europe.

Kimiko_0 wrote:
Small cars with moped-class motors aren't exactly common here, but you do see them now and then. There's also the "smart"/"mini" car fad of about ten years which fall between moped and regular car engines. Moreover, the article image looks like a regular small truck to me, which are pretty common around the world. Parts of Europe are as crowded as Japan, so it makes sense that smaller/cleaner cars are more popular than big/inefficient ones. I guess only N-Americans and Australians drive those oversized SUV cars?


Trends in vehicle sizes, at least in the United States, fall into cyclical fads. Thse are reflected in the marketing car companies do, with them talking about power and engine purring one year and then fuel efficiency and easy parking the next.

That being said, remember that North Americans and Australians tend to travel for much longer distances than your typical European or East Asian. When you're driving 80 kilometers per day or more, you need a vehicle that can handle that and can go fast enough that you're not spending hours at a time in your car (assuming you don't have a driving-related job). Even more so with people who live in rural areas, who frequently have to drive long, straight, featureless roads to the next town over to get things or meet people (which, again, can be hours away even driving far above the speed limit).

Just as I hear stories of European tourists who think they can drive from New Orleans to San Francisco in a day, I also hear stories of American tourists who freak out the locals when they say they'll drive from Berlin to Paris like it's no big deal (and to someone living in North America, it really isn't, national borders notwithstanding).
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marshmallowpie



Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 300
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:23 pm Reply with quote
I'm surprised there'd be people who have never seen these in real life. You see them occasionally here, and this is the wrong side of the country for something so Japanese. I don't drive, but if I did, I think I'd like one of these, with some kind of subtle or not-so-subtle anime shoutout decoration.
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configspace



Joined: 16 Aug 2008
Posts: 3717
PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:58 pm Reply with quote
FYI the type of trucks with a plain flat bed without bedsides/rails do exist in the US, just not in the tiny kei form. You can buy flatbed variants of the regular consumer pickups (e.g. Ford F250, etc) usually through a regular truck dealer's fleet/commercial department and you can also convert your own pickup into a flatbed truck:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-SW-Aluminum-pickup-Flat-Bed-Truck-Body-Dodge-Ford-Chevy-GMC-/232552113621

The smallest I've seen with flatbed were the old compact toyota pickups, but I don't see them around anymore.
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ZakuAce



Joined: 06 Jan 2010
Posts: 525
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 12:37 am Reply with quote
#hiros7039 wrote:
Of course, Japanology has an episode of this.

Kei cars can put western automakers out of business if there weren't regulations protecting them.


Not a chance, they don't go fast enough and don't have enough room. There are those of us who still don't live in the big city.
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2658
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:00 am Reply with quote
CrazyCanuck wrote:
Also, 100 kph =/= 87 mph. Not even close.


TBT, the i-MiEV (which is an electric Kei car) has been reported as having a maximum speed of 87 mph (so no time travel, but above even of the 85 mph highway speed limit) so I do not think it is farfetched to think future electric kei trucks will have that speed. Now, about range that all depends in advances in battery and popularization of charge stations.

So, do I get a no prize? *wags tail*
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Animegomaniac



Joined: 16 Feb 2012
Posts: 4070
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 1:56 am Reply with quote
DerekL1963 wrote:
mangamuscle wrote:
They are also popular in Mexico. I guess they like there trucks big in the USA; I wonder if they are compensating for something. Cool


While there's nothing as small as Kei trucks, trucks in a America come in a wide variety of sizes. The "compensating for something" idea is nothing but stupidity.


... mostly "powerful" and "more powerful" when it comes to private use. Take a large load without shifting an inch, we're still talking about pick ups right? Traction that will dig in so the truck won't quit until the job's done, still trucks, totally. Look at all this power towing my truck has... its... They're compensating for lack of power... which is something they lack.

Yeah, commercial use is all over the place but personal use? Buyers would just laugh and laugh at these toys. Man, I miss Hummers. With those behemoths, people couldn't hide anything.
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Tenchi



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
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Location: Ottawa... now I'm an ex-Anglo Montrealer.
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 2:19 am Reply with quote
Someone in the Ottawa area has a Honda Acty and sometimes brings it to Kanata Cruise Night classic car meetups on Tuesday evenings in summer.

My own photos of it.

It's not the exact same kind of Kei pickup truck seen in Non Non Biyori (which is either a Suzuki Carry or Mazda Scrum, which is essentially the same design that Suzuki and Mazda co-developed) but it's close enough to make me happy seeing it.
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DerekL1963
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Joined: 14 Jan 2015
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Location: Puget Sound
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:09 am Reply with quote
Animegomaniac wrote:
DerekL1963 wrote:
mangamuscle wrote:
They are also popular in Mexico. I guess they like there trucks big in the USA; I wonder if they are compensating for something. Cool


While there's nothing as small as Kei trucks, trucks in a America come in a wide variety of sizes. The "compensating for something" idea is nothing but stupidity.


... mostly "powerful" and "more powerful" when it comes to private use. Take a large load without shifting an inch, we're still talking about pick ups right? Traction that will dig in so the truck won't quit until the job's done, still trucks, totally. Look at all this power towing my truck has... its... They're compensating for lack of power... which is something they lack.


Thank you for so eloquently proving my point.
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aifhak



Joined: 06 Jan 2016
Posts: 57
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:32 am Reply with quote
ZakuAce wrote:
#hiros7039 wrote:
Of course, Japanology has an episode of this.

Kei cars can put western automakers out of business if there weren't regulations protecting them.


Not a chance, they don't go fast enough and don't have enough room. There are those of us who still don't live in the big city.

exactly. And I'm saying that as someone from Europe as well. We have smaller roads than you guys have in the US but there's another difference like that between European roads and small streets on the side in every single town in Japan.

I honestly can't imagine people driving those for work either and that's already the closest I could imagine: Some guy having a car like this for his delivery job or something along those lines.
But even that is super sketchy and I can only imagine people being really scared to get in an accident with them while they have to take one larger road to get from one part of the city to another part of the city.
If you're driving through the streets of Tokyo because you have to deliver something you kind of have to go for this though
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Zin5ki



Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 6680
Location: London, UK
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 3:40 am Reply with quote
marshmallowpie wrote:
I'm surprised there'd be people who have never seen these in real life. You see them occasionally here, and this is the wrong side of the country for something so Japanese.

When petrol prices and road dimensions favour more cumbersome modes of haulage, the adage that "bigger is better" might leave these useful but limited machines with a rather diminished audience.
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Kadmos1



Joined: 08 May 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:56 am Reply with quote
As a SQ fan, I thank the questioner bringing that series up and for Justin including an SQ picture for the thumbnail.
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4410
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:21 am Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:
What about the lack of walls or any other sort of protection on the back of those pickup trucks? Why are they absent? Would it have driven up the price too much?


That is the thing I've wondered about with those trucks. The limited power and cheaply made cab aren't much of an issue for something designed for short trips on side streets, but I would guess the drivers have to get pretty good and driving in a way that keeps the cargo from shifting. That and maybe a reliance on cargo ties.
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Scalfin



Joined: 18 May 2008
Posts: 249
PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:38 am Reply with quote
Greed1914 wrote:
leafy sea dragon wrote:
What about the lack of walls or any other sort of protection on the back of those pickup trucks? Why are they absent? Would it have driven up the price too much?


That is the thing I've wondered about with those trucks. The limited power and cheaply made cab aren't much of an issue for something designed for short trips on side streets, but I would guess the drivers have to get pretty good and driving in a way that keeps the cargo from shifting. That and maybe a reliance on cargo ties.


They're likely omitted to yield greater flexibility on cargo dimensions.
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