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phia_one
Joined: 15 Jan 2012
Posts: 1654
Location: Pennsylvania
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:00 pm
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Episode 4
Oh man, that scene with Mari's mom was great. It made it even better when Mari's dad just closes the door. The 'shut talking' scene was great as well.
I can't believe just how much these characters have grown on me after a short time.
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darkchibi07
Joined: 15 Oct 2003
Posts: 5459
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:35 pm
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If anyone has a chance to hang out with these girls, I'd imagine they will not get bored with them. Though I have to say that final scene where Mari's friend was looking at her smartphone was rather ominous. I wonder if she's going to get jealous over their exploits.
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Dian Z
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:16 pm
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Quote: | I almost want them to face some kind of crisis or setback next week, just to bring these key parts of the story into sharper focus. If the show could give us the sting of defeat, if only for a moment, I suspect that each little victory would carry more emotional weight. |
I think there could be more of it, but I hope not next week, that would be a bit too soon I think that it could be a repetitive and almost seen like 'toying' with the girls' guts and efforts when not much progress have even happened. I'd rather have them complete this stage and face another setback on later stage.
Either way, I think what the show need at this point is more of exploring some personal matter. We have seen Shirase and Shiraishi. And when Mari is the point of view of the fourth episode, but we're still not attached enough with her, then her resolution wouldn't be as relatable. I think if it is Shirase who says something of the sort, it'll resonate more with us.
On the other hand, Mari doesn't have to have some big personal problem, it's been interesting thus far that it's more of a simple but life-changing matter with her fear of going out of her comfort zone. Now it'll be interesting if we, at some point when they're going to broad the ship or something like that, will see Mari suddenly got her fear back and having a not-easily resolved (maybe a whole episode) second thought.
darkchibi07 wrote: | Though I have to say that final scene where Mari's friend was looking at her smartphone was rather ominous. I wonder if she's going to get jealous over their exploits. |
That came as a surprise for me, that the point of view in the very end minute of the episode, switch back to her. Mari's earliest/close enough friend, but now not part of the even seemingly closer 'journey/main story friend'. I've been noticing her part of kinda neither against nor support Mari's plan to Antarctica. If we get to see more of her, not only as Mari's plan-update pov, but with even a bit of emotional development (somekind of regret or jealousy, fomo) that would be interesting.
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navycherub
Joined: 26 Oct 2007
Posts: 233
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:46 am
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I felt like the show actually managed to avoid the "workmanlike approach" the episode 4 review describes by moving its humor to a more physical space than we're used to in these kind of slice-of-life shows. Stuff like figuring out the "dominant eye" and "which right is right?" was some of the funniest visual humor I've seen in TV anime in a long time. But maybe if that's not your bag you might not be into it.
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MJKS
Joined: 28 Jul 2017
Posts: 102
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:35 am
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Paul wrote: | They may have said that it's now or never, but they haven't made me feel it yet. |
Well, while I do also expect bigger setbacks in the next episode or two (in my mind, this could take the form of a public awakening to a civilian Antarctic expedition with four kids in tow, and the resulting backlash), I also don't think the dramatic objectives of the series are wholly reliant on meeting the plot beats of a conventional narrative arc.
Leaving aside the laugh-out-loud hilarity of Mari being ladled out some discipline by her mom, and the touching camaraderie the girls shared overnight in their tent, two of the big emotional moments of the episode were Gin and Kanae's conversation outside the lodge after the first day of lectures, and the parting shot of Megumi alone in the cafe looking at texts from Mari. These weren't "big" in the sense that they involved major outpourings of feelings; rather, heavy implications simmered in them both. Lots of things are cooking, and particularly in the case of Gin (and Shirase's relationship with her), I think we're only going to get the full taste of them once the story moves south--so to speak.
What I'm getting at is that, to your point Paul, the obstacles to plot advancement are mostly abstract in this show. And consequently, I think the dramatic load is weighted toward the later episodes. As is typically the case with ambitious scientific expeditions, it may end up taking a long time to get to the heart of the matter.
I should be clear that I interpret all this as good. I'm impressed with the direction the show is taking so far. I'd grade the episode a letter higher.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 6:41 am
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Quote: | The strange thing about this final scene is that it didn't hit me with the big wave of emotion I'd expect from such a moment. I mentioned in last week's review that A Place Further Than the Universe hadn't yet delivered any big dramatic high points, and that still hasn't changed. I'm starting to think that the issue stems from the obstacles Mari and friends are struggling against, as well as the stakes of the situation. The central challenge of going to Antarctica is still too big and abstract, and it's not something that the characters can struggle against on a personal level like they would with a more tangible antagonist. In a similar way, the price of failure feels relatively low; the series hasn't done enough to paint this expedition as the girls' only chance to achieve their goals. They may have said that it's now or never, but they haven't made me feel it yet. I almost want them to face some kind of crisis or setback next week, just to bring these key parts of the story into sharper focus. If the show could give us the sting of defeat, if only for a moment, I suspect that each little victory would carry more emotional weight. |
This is the super standard and conventional Western outlook on storytelling. Western storytelling puts a premium on conflict and obstacles. One of the things I love about anime is that it doesn't always hew to conventional Western storytelling and a change of pace is sometimes nice. Comedic SoL shows don't often conform to the Western storytelling model. I love the characters and humour of this show, that's what keeps me coming back every week. I don't need to see them struggle through some "dramatic" crisis or setback to engage my interest. I love the tone that has been established.
Anyway, I won't bother reading any more of Paul's reviews. I care about the show that's actually presented onscreen as opposed to the one he wants in his head. No doubt he'll continue to score it at B because it's just not the kind of "dramatic" show that he obviously likes/wants.
It would never happen, but I would love it if ANN ever hired a Japanese reviewer who was fluent in English. I would love to read a person's outlook who grew up in the culture anime is created in and was familiar with its conventions and who wasn't infected with the notion that Western storytelling norms are "correct" and deviations from them are "wrong."
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Joshua Zarate
Joined: 12 Jan 2017
Posts: 2061
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:49 pm
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Count me in with the group that says there doesn’t need to be any immediate adversity for the girls to struggle through in order to “feel” dramatic and/or “great”. It’s already doing perfectly fine so far with it’s engaging and humorous chemistry of the four girls that are full of good old-fashioned heart.
Blood- wrote: | Anyway, I won't bother reading any more of Paul's reviews. I care about the show that's actually presented onscreen as opposed to the one he wants in his head. No doubt he'll continue to score it at B because it's just not the kind of "dramatic" show that he obviously likes/wants. |
I think that’s for the best since Mr. Jensen has a tendency to do this type of things in his reviews (*Tries to forget the WorldEnd reviews from Spring 2017*) and it looks like he intends to continue doing so for the reviews of this show as well. It’s always good to preserve one’s sanity no matter how minuscule they may be.
Blood- wrote: | It would never happen, but I would love it if ANN ever hired a Japanese reviewer who was fluent in English. I would love to read a person's outlook who grew up in the culture anime is created in and was familiar with its conventions and who wasn't infected with the notion that Western storytelling norms are "correct" and deviations from them are "wrong." |
Now that sounds very interesting. I also would like to see this happen at least once sometime in the future at ANN.
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Dardre
Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 166
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:28 am
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Joshua Zarate wrote: | Count me in with the group that says there doesn’t need to be any immediate adversity for the girls to struggle through in order to “feel” dramatic and/or “great”. It’s already doing perfectly fine so far with it’s engaging and humorous chemistry of the four girls that are full of good old-fashioned heart. |
It makes me wonder if he wants drama, or melodrama. There's plenty of drama, from their struggles to get into the expedition to the off-screen (and sometimes on-screen) mockery of their classmates.
Dropping yet another obstacle in front of the girls would be seen to be exactly what it is, a delaying tactic to enhance the drama. The obviousness of it would cause it to backfire, resulting in a 'get on with it already' sentiment.
Well, this comment is post-episode 5, so I'll just ask: Was THIS dramatic enough for you, Jensen?
Confession: Was saddened to have my suspicions of Megumi confirmed. I was hoping I was wrong and that she was just negging Mari, but nope. I wonder if they'll ever be able to fix this friendship.
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Punch Drunk Marc
Joined: 04 Oct 2013
Posts: 1742
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:05 am
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Blood- wrote: |
Quote: | The strange thing about this final scene is that it didn't hit me with the big wave of emotion I'd expect from such a moment. I mentioned in last week's review that A Place Further Than the Universe hadn't yet delivered any big dramatic high points, and that still hasn't changed. I'm starting to think that the issue stems from the obstacles Mari and friends are struggling against, as well as the stakes of the situation. The central challenge of going to Antarctica is still too big and abstract, and it's not something that the characters can struggle against on a personal level like they would with a more tangible antagonist. In a similar way, the price of failure feels relatively low; the series hasn't done enough to paint this expedition as the girls' only chance to achieve their goals. They may have said that it's now or never, but they haven't made me feel it yet. I almost want them to face some kind of crisis or setback next week, just to bring these key parts of the story into sharper focus. If the show could give us the sting of defeat, if only for a moment, I suspect that each little victory would carry more emotional weight. |
This is the super standard and conventional Western outlook on storytelling. Western storytelling puts a premium on conflict and obstacles. One of the things I love about anime is that it doesn't always hew to conventional Western storytelling and a change of pace is sometimes nice. Comedic SoL shows don't often conform to the Western storytelling model. I love the characters and humour of this show, that's what keeps me coming back every week. I don't need to see them struggle through some "dramatic" crisis or setback to engage my interest. I love the tone that has been established. |
I understand where Jensen is coming from in a sense, but I disagree about the weight it has for the show. The drama has always been more personal in scope for the girls instead of the journey to Antarctica itself being impossible. It really all stems from the reasons WHY each of them are going.
Shirase wants to find her mother deep down I'm sure she knows her mother is dead but she wants to see what she saw and experience what her mother experienced in Antarctica. It's been her dream for awhile.
Mari's intentions were illustrated even more plainly in this episode than before. Earlier she said she wanted to go because she wanted to do something menaningful with her life in High School, and that is true, but this episode added a deeper layer to that with her confession that she hated herself for always depending on/worrying Megumi and she wanted to stand on her own two feet. I really sympathized with that, and the final scene really got to me because of it. I really wish Megumi was going because I like her character, but that would only bring the problem back up.
Yuzuki's big hang up was that she never had any friends that liked her for her instead of her status as a celebrity. With Mari and the others she has that and can come out of her shell more. This was illustrated very well when she deleted those other girls' numbers.
Really the person with the least stake in this is, my personal favorite girl, Hinata. Her thinking is more like Mari's in that she wants to do something meaningful since she's not in school and possibly won't go to college. But I think we will learn much more about her as the show progresses.
All in all I think the show has plenty of weighted drama, but it's not the main focus. As Blood said I love the show for what it is and the characters in it which is the main draw.
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catstigereye
Joined: 25 Oct 2009
Posts: 341
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:42 am
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I have enjoyed this anime so far. Slice of life anime’s with interesting premise seem to attract me.
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meiam
Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 3442
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:56 am
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Yeah the drama was unnecessary this week and I wish they'd hadn't bothered putting it in. It just detracted from the story and the flow. And I don't particularly care about the other friend since she kinda faded into the background after the first week.
I really hope they won't try to keep injecting more, like the girl getting lost in Antarctica or something dumb like that.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:02 pm
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Count me in as another fan who could have done without the confrontation between Mari and Megumi. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the way it was handled, but it just bummed me out. Mari is going off on the adventure of a lifetime and her "friend" decides to use THE MORNING OF MARI'S DEPARTURE to lay all this crap on her. Nice.
I understand Megumi's feelings and as I said before I think the whole thing was well-handled. But it's not the emotion I wanted to be experiencing at that particular moment.
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Joshua Zarate
Joined: 12 Jan 2017
Posts: 2061
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:19 pm
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I don’t get those saying the drama was unnecessary. It felt like it fit in nicely with the themes the show’s going for, and it looked like the show didn’t want us to forget about Megumi as a character as well (and not simply a background piece) because she too is part of the reason Mari is going on this trip. Her drama felt relatable and human to me. It surely affected the story flow, but not necessarily in a way that’s to the detriment of the show because reality also doesn’t go the way we think it does. Also, saying that girls being lost in Antarctica is dumb is a bit obtuse in of itself because it’s not like it never happens in real life. Even if it doesn’t, it’s not like the show is not going to at least execute it in an interesting, engaging way that also comes off as human. The way this show does its thing is still quite good and is the main reason why it’s one of my favorites of the season so far.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
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I can't speak for meiam, but why I found the drama... I wouldn't use the word unnecessary, I would use the word, "unwelcome"... is because the emotions it inflicted on me are not why I am attracted to this show. I like the show's humour and how the main characters interact with each other. That's what makes it fun for me. Mari and Megumi's conflict was not in any way "fun" (nor was it intended to be). It left my emotions on a sour note because even though the two, in a sense, "resolved" the problem, it left a bad taste in my mouth. Instead of feeling, "yay, the girls are finally on their way!" I was forced to confront what an awful thing Megumi had done (even as I intellectually understood what had caused her to act that way).
In a case like this, there is no right or wrong, only personal preference. My personal preference would have been to stick with humour and fun character interaction, but that's just me.
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meiam
Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 3442
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Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:49 pm
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Joshua Zarate wrote: | I don’t get those saying the drama was unnecessary. It felt like it fit in nicely with the themes the show’s going for, and it looked like the show didn’t want us to forget about Megumi as a character as well (and not simply a background piece) because she too is part of the reason Mari is going on this trip. Her drama felt relatable and human to me. It surely affected the story flow, but not necessarily in a way that’s to the detriment of the show because reality also doesn’t go the way we think it does. Also, saying that girls being lost in Antarctica is dumb is a bit obtuse in of itself because it’s not like it never happens in real life. Even if it doesn’t, it’s not like the show is not going to at least execute it in an interesting, engaging way that also comes off as human. The way this show does its thing is still quite good and is the main reason why it’s one of my favorites of the season so far. |
It just didn't bring anything to the show, and it detracted from it by taking up valuable time that could have been spend doing something more interesting, even if that was just a light hearted humor segment, it would have been more interesting and in line with what the show was up to that point. By just throwing it in there willy nilly they couldn't really build up to it (like I said the friend practically disappeared from the show after ep 1) and they won't really use it up for anything since the focus is clearly shifting away from high school. It just felt like it was in there to fulfill some drama quota.
As far as getting lost in Antarctica, I'm guessing it would happen something like so: the girl will think she see her mother in the distant and run to it, and then the show will have to distort itself in all kinds of way to explain how they manage to get lost for a long time close to the base camp and yet somehow manage to survive. I'll just come out of the situation with a feeling of "yup those girl sure shouldn't have been allowed to go to Antarctica".
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