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Answerman - Why Aren't There More Video Game-Based Anime?


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Xe4



Joined: 04 May 2015
Posts: 96
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:49 pm Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:
I find it hard to imagine a large mass of the fandom wanting a popular and long running western video game franchise turned into some schlocky anime series. World of Warcraft fared quite well in both its live action movie and high quality cinematic trailers Blizzard does for the game's many expansions. They're expensive to produce, but they work. There was an attempt to make a Warcraft animated TV series a long time ago, but it fell through. Maybe it could hypothetically work if they tried again with a much bigger budget, but I doubt anyone wants such a thing now.

As for Assassin's Creed and Doom, I really can't see an animated series working out for either one, considering their rather grim subject matter. There was that Dead Space: Aftermath animated movie made to bridge the gap between the first two games, but it was quite terrible and didn't do very well with fans at all.

Animated doesn't nessesarily equate to anime though. Just look at how popular something like Castlevania has become in only four episodes, and that's a nearly entirely western produced show.

Granted it's of a Japanese produced game series, albeit one popular in the west. Thus it's not a 1:1 comparison to something like Halo or whatever. But I honestly don't think that matters much when talking adaptations.


Last edited by Xe4 on Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 5920
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:50 pm Reply with quote
EricJ2 wrote:

Well, "Persona 5" is quite the hit, "Ace Attorney" still has its fans, and the latest Pokemon is unkillable with handheld fans...


None of those game's except probably Pokemon hit the kind of numbers that most Western AAA titles do.
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Chrono1000





PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:54 pm Reply with quote
While there are a good number of anime adaptations of games I think it depends a lot on the size of the Japanese game developer. The small to medium sized Japanese game developers are more willing to go with anime adaptations such as Angels of Death, Granblue Fantasy, Last Period, Monster Strike, and Rage of Bahamut. The major Japanese game developers tend to prefer the idea of movies which in my opinion is often a mistake.

belvadeer wrote:
As for Assassin's Creed and Doom, I really can't see an animated series working out for either one, considering their rather grim subject matter.
Considering what I have seen in Attack on Titan, Claymore, Hellsing, Kabaneri of the Iron Fortress, and Tokyo Ghoul I think that Doom could make for a great anime.
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belvadeer





PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:55 pm Reply with quote
Xe4 wrote:
Animated doesn't nessesarily equate to anime though. Just look at how popular something like Castlevania has become in only four episodes, and that's a nearly entirely western produced show.

Granted it's of a Japanese produced game series, albeit one popular in the west. Thus it's not a 1:1 comparison to something like Halo or whatever. But I honestly don't think that matters much when talking adaptations.


I know. When I was referring to the failed Warcraft animated series, I meant the one they were trying to make for Saturday morning TV. As for the other two examples, I was stating animation wouldn't be the best approach to those titles, not anime specifically.
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mbanu



Joined: 11 Jan 2010
Posts: 159
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:31 pm Reply with quote
The "average gamer is 35" bit is interesting; do kids not play video games anymore? Or is it just going by purchasing patterns? I imagine that the average game purchaser was also 35 in the 80s and 90s, since that would have been around the age their kids were excited about video games. Smile
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OjaruFan2



Joined: 09 Jul 2018
Posts: 661
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:56 am Reply with quote
Many AAA video games may not be well-suited for anime adaptations, but that certainly doesn't stop manga publishers from producing manga adaptations of AAA video games. There's a Splatoon manga, 3 The Legendary Starfy manga, a Jak & Daxter manga (yeah, really), a couple Puyo Puyo manga, no less than 5 Super Mario Bros. manga, the list goes on.

And speaking of Monster Hunter Stories Ride On, I’m honestly surprised that it never got a manga adaptation. I guess Capcom felt that the anime adaptation was enough.

Quote:
Other game genres didn't escape unscathed either. Final Fantasy: Unlimited, Panzer Dragoon, Salamander, Wizardry... even the rare Super Mario Brothers OVA are all barely remembered today, and for good reason.


There's actually multiple Super Mario Bros. OVAs:

- Amanda Anime Series: Super Mario Bros.
- Super Mario's Traffic Safety
- Super Mario's Fire Brigade
- Super Mario World: Mario and Yoshi's Adventure Land
- Mario Kirby Masterpiece Video
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TheAnimeRevolutionizer



Joined: 03 Nov 2017
Posts: 329
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 2:15 am Reply with quote
thud

Quote:
I mean, say what you will about the OVAs and how awful they were, but as someone who likes to gather developer and conceptual insight to the video games and anime ova unison back in these times, I've had a lot of wealth of knowledge from gathering dev books and translating them, especially for cult classics like Toshinden and Gowcaizer. And as how Tekken the Motion Picture is hyped to be the most awful OVA to ever exist, having played the games, the Motion Picture is more of an accessory than an actual show. It's a fun watch when you've got the lore down, but it does do things un canon. Even for something like Psychic Force, which also had an OVA, it seemed wayyyy too rushed and had a lot of logic and plot holes despite its excellent production values. This taught me a valuable lesson regarding not just adapting video games into anime, but also their core contents: just make a show, and don't think you'll ever outdo the Street Fighter II The Animated Movie by making shortcut OVA movies. Seriously, the ideas and creative contents for all of those series were brimming with potential more than even Street Fighter, and could have made a goldmine of anime for the 90s. Voltage Fighter Gowcaizer was My Hero Academia before My Hero Academia, Fatal Fury could have been a martial arts anime done like a 1990s US primetime like Xena and Walker, Texas Ranger, Psychic Force was the true X Men the Anime, Tekken could have been a mystery martial arts thriller with elements of crime and drama, and Toshinden could have been an alternate history historic fiction 1990s world with strong themes of tackling social issues, sociopolitical commentary, mysticism, divine transcendence, and real world historic and religious allusions and references, but c'est la vie.


Overall, it takes a lot of admìration, inspiration, and effort to properly adapt a video game into an anime show or an OVA. I'm using older examples but as I've stated before, these were some very prime examples of what not so great ovas look like. Saying it now, Gungrave was extremely popular because it had some real talent on its team, and as I could see, the anime took liberties bevause it looked like they played the games and went through dev material to have a great foundation. Street Fighter II had also hired some big names from MMA and martial arts, and it also looked like the team went through Gamest issues and SFII mooks religiously to score that right inspiration. Galerians cut the fat right and presented itself as a cinematic movie. Great adaptations tend to know what material they are dealing with and know how to serve it as an anime. It is not a chance of gambling odds to get a "right outcome". Anyone who says or thinks this is just being lazy. Japanese video games back in the day and even now usually come with mooks and lore to flesh out things for diehard fans, being also essentially a potential key to success for any studio that aimed to make an anime off of a video game series.

[Edit]: removed uncalled for snark. Errinundra.
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HK16



Joined: 31 May 2018
Posts: 496
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 3:10 am Reply with quote
Been waiting for a Kingdom Hearts anime for years by a great studio because it deserves no less. Still waiting.
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Sahmbahdeh



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 712
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 3:15 am Reply with quote
mbanu wrote:
The "average gamer is 35" bit is interesting; do kids not play video games anymore? Or is it just going by purchasing patterns? I imagine that the average game purchaser was also 35 in the 80s and 90s, since that would have been around the age their kids were excited about video games. Smile


Yeah, I'd be curious to see a citation for that claim.
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Shiflan



Joined: 29 Jul 2015
Posts: 418
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:42 am Reply with quote
Chester McCool wrote:
Most AAA western games aren't popular in Japan. Unless a western company pays a Japanese company to make an anime, don't count on Japan caring enough to do so. I also imagine western companies would want some degree of control over the production. and that never turns out well.


Paying a Japanese company to make the anime is exactly what they could do. I am not really into gaming myself but many of my friends are serious gamers, mainly western MMOs like Warcraft, etc. They eat up anything having to do with their favorite game franchise. If there was a Warcraft (for example) anime they'd be all over it. It's no different than how we anime fans often like to buy merch or follow the spinoffs of our favorite shows. These gamers, while not anime fans in general, ARE fans of game-themed anime like Sword Art Online, so I'd think that an anime based on their favorite game franchise would be even more up their alley.

And let's not forget that paying a studio to make Anime is exactly how it works in Japan right now. The only difference would be that the video game companies like Square Enix or Blizzard would foot the bill instead of the production committee. Simple.

I used to be seriously into the Final Fantasy series before they turned into action games. I was very interested in the Final Fantasy anime at the time, and I even went and bought it despite it being awful (something I didn't find out until afterward). I don't think the situation with today's gamers would be much different.
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Shiflan



Joined: 29 Jul 2015
Posts: 418
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:51 am Reply with quote
Primus wrote:
It's important to remember most animated adaptations of video games are meant as little more than advertisements. Games that have sold 10+ million units aren't really going to be introduced to new audiences through animation. It's likely a person interested in video games would've already heard of the property by then.


You're certainly correct that a lot of anime is created in order to advertise games. But that doesn't mean that is the only viable business model that could work. It can also work the other way around. A fan who likes a given game series might want to buy all sorts of things related to it. I know my gamer friends own various kinds of game-inspired merch. An anime series related to someone's favorite game could simply fit that role: fans who like the game would want to watch the anime. The purpose does not need to be "advertising".

Even in the anime world things can work both ways. Consider Justin's recent column regarding how manga spinoffs of original Anime get made: the manga and the anime go hand-in-hand. One can advertise the other, and vice-versa. A fan of a given manga might buy the anime version. And likewise a fan of the anime might go so far as to buy the manga. The same principle can apply here.
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Gemnist



Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 1758
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:12 pm Reply with quote
There are two things about video game adaptations in the modern age that I think are damning for film adaptations, at least when directly adapting them. First, games that tend to lack a consistent story (most notably Mario) often only make up for it in gameplay to the point of reliance. The interactive nature of gameplay is always lost in translation, and trying to replicate it results in poorly executed sequences that appear to be fanservice rather than part of the plot. Second, it could be argued that games that DO have a focus on story have actually superseded film and television in telling a narrative. Unlike film, you can tell a single narrative over several hours; unlike television, there’s a far greater ability to really go above and beyond with the production without having to worry about budget; and unlike comics, there’s a sense of interactivity that allows a consumer to create their own narrative.

In regards to anime, I think the bigger question is why we haven’t gotten AAA video games based on anime, not the other way around, and the simple reason is that there’s a lack of demand. It is an interesting question to think about in the wake of Spider-Man PS4, but anime characters will never be as popular internationally as Spider-Man. I would love for AAA titles based on anime, but it’s going to take a while, to say the least.
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I_Drive_DSM



Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 217
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:13 pm Reply with quote
The individual that asked the question noting a lot of the classic OVAs from the 80s and 90s is interesting because that entire time period was a very strong point of OVA production. Nowadays OVAs - not always but heavily - are created as product tie-ins or similar extensions of series. OVAs lent themselves well to the video games during that time because they needed to tell a story quickly with characters that already had established back grounds and personas; there was expectancy already established for the viewer. OVAs also by nature had higher production values, lending themselves well to established IPs where using lower quality animation (like most TV productions) may have reflected negatively on the product. That's not much of an issue nowadays since most all TV broadcast animation is touched up and boosted for physical release thanks to digital animation techniques.

I also feel complete tie-ins for OVAs in modern gaming titles can be dangerous. Take FFXV for example. The game's story expects you to have some familiarity with an OVA prequel prior to playing the main game, which having not seen it will not completely leave you in the dark but will give you an initial negative experience until you catch up. Another example is the Senran Kagura series which has quite a few OVAs between titles that are, effectively, supposed to serve as "bridges" between games.

There's also a basic question of does a video game really NEED an anime at all? It has arguments both ways. On one hand the product is already established with the game itself and animated series can possibly affect negatively (I know a lot of people were initially upset at the Persona 5 animation, which after playing the game it was hard to imagine how all of that would get packed into a broadcast series). On the other hand visual novels receive so many animated series because you already have a set of characters and a narrative developed, and instead of static narration you get moving picture. The effect of that cannot be stated enough on subsequent character goods and eventual spin-offs or one-offs.

Personally with nostalgia boiling there's quite a few games that I think could lend themselves well to having some sort of anime produced, TV or OVA, and doubly because companies could establish a modern fan base to build or rejuvenate interest. I've always wanted an animated LUNAR series (Toshiyuki Kubooka's designs would give it a Giant Robo feel) and there was a lot of potential there wasted in remakes. I could name probably a dozen other RPG games or series that sold relatively well in Japan that I wish would be animated in some separate form.
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Stuart Smith



Joined: 13 Jan 2013
Posts: 1298
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:19 pm Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:
I find it hard to imagine a large mass of the fandom wanting a popular and long running western video game franchise turned into some schlocky anime series.


While I'm sure the majority of American AAA gamers don't care about anime or animation in general, when I was in high-school my friend was both an anime fan and played WoW. He actually planned out and imagined what it would be like as a anime. All I remember was it starred a human Paladin and his childhood friend/romance interest a human Priest in Stormwind and basically followed their journey through the game, the first arc being the Defias Brotherhood questline and concluding with some 'epic anime battle' in the Deadmines and then everything beyond that. I could see it, but it's pretty much impossible since Blizzard games aren't popular in Japan and World of Warcraft was ever even released there.

Some of my favorite video game anime over the years has been Pocket Monsters, Rockman.exe, and the Persona adaptions. Tales had a number of decent adaptions like Abyss, and Vesperia had a nice OVA. Tales of Eternia had a weird one-cour spin off that had nothing to do with the game plot, but I suppose it was harmless enough. I felt the Ryusei no Rockman adaption was a huge step down from Rockman.exe, but the first game adaption was good, and did some things better than the game did (Wolf Forest and Bubble Cancer, two throwaway characters from the game actually given backstories and character focus) but other things worse (Tsukasa/Gemini Spark, a main antagonist, having most of his backstory omitted). The second game adaption was extremely rushed and I presumed it was cut short due to low ratings, especially since the third game never got an adaption.

Star Ocean EX is another adaption that only covered half the game. I liked the way it incorporated all the characters, compared to the game where some of them are exclusive to one another. The manga/anime is the only place you'll see both Ashton and Opera interact with each other.

Of course, if we're including visual novels, then there's way too many to count.

-Stuart Smith
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Shiflan



Joined: 29 Jul 2015
Posts: 418
PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:29 pm Reply with quote
Gemnist wrote:
There are two things about video game adaptations in the modern age that I think are damning for film adaptations, at least when directly adapting them. First, games that tend to lack a consistent story (most notably Mario) often only make up for it in gameplay to the point of reliance. The interactive nature of gameplay is always lost in translation, and trying to replicate it results in poorly executed sequences that appear to be fanservice rather than part of the plot.


You're right that games which don't have a consistent story might be difficult to animate well, but I don't think that's really stopping anyone. Consider Pokemon for example. I'll admit my knowledge of Pokemon is limited, but it seems to me that it's a lot like Mario in that there isn't a big overriding narrative being told by the games yet that hasn't been a problem for hundreds of anime episodes. Furthermore, our discussion isn't limited to games with lacking or inconsistent backstories. There are plenty of big-name games with established stories and well-known characters that could be excellent fodder for anime. Devil May Cry or God of War, for example.

Quote:
Second, it could be argued that games that DO have a focus on story have actually superseded film and television in telling a narrative. Unlike film, you can tell a single narrative over several hours; unlike television, there’s a far greater ability to really go above and beyond with the production without having to worry about budget; and unlike comics, there’s a sense of interactivity that allows a consumer to create their own narrative.

That is absolutely right. But just because a big-budget game offers a more indepth experience than an anime doesn't mean the anime can't exist to tell side-stories, background etc, like the FFXV OVA you mentioned later.

Quote:
In regards to anime, I think the bigger question is why we haven’t gotten AAA video games based on anime, not the other way around, and the simple reason is that there’s a lack of demand.

You're right in the sense that nobody is passing around petitions demanding anime from their favorite game be made, but just like any other merch: put a product out there and fans will buy it. It is commonly stated that products are made to fill a demand, but many products create demand. There is no doubt in my mind that if a big-name game studio released an anime based on a popular title that there would be lots of people lining up to watch it. Now whether or not that is enough people to justify its production costs I couldn't say, but I don't think we can discount the idea either.
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