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EP. REVIEW: A Certain Magical Index III


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killjoy_the



Joined: 30 May 2015
Posts: 2459
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 5:03 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
The shift of his black wings to angelic ones may be a little over-the-top in its symbolism, but it's also a reflection of his change in mindset


Black to white is fine by me, but they didn't have to go with giving it actual feathers if they're going for the 'dirty wind' look on the black ones.

Quote:
who are those two at the end who find Fiamma?


New characters. One of them just introduced himself

Quote:
I feel like I also should recognize the blonde girl who fishes Touma out of the sea at the very end, but I am having trouble placing her


Showed up in episode 25 and introduced herself.
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OH&S



Joined: 15 Jul 2013
Posts: 306
Location: Sydney, Australia
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 5:07 pm Reply with quote
jr240483 wrote:
uhhhhhhh.... you do know that their on a 26 ep limit right!?

i am not making excuses for them but if they had done what you did and completely adapted every single part of the light novel arcs for this season, the damn thing would be at least 50 eps ala SAO 3!

they are not studio pierot who is able to fiancially do eps over 25-50 and more ala one piece, boruto and black clover after all!


Not necessarily. As others have said, 26 episodes would have been perfect for just (Volumes 14 - 19) that would also roughly be in line with the pacing for Seasons 1 and 2. Then, a simple 1 cour (12-13 maybe an extra ep?) could have adapt World War Three. There's also the volume SS2 short side stories which they could have adapted one at a time maybe as a web short or something; but less priority on that.

Either way 'someone' , and I'm not quite sure who (Dengeki or JC Staff), decided that they must adapt all of the remaining Old Testament novels in one season; a foolish decision.

But pacing is only the first layer of problems that the anime has. Even if pacing and plot comprehension were sacrificed, there were some just baffling things that occurred in this season in terms of what was chosen to be adapted from the novels, how those scenes were adapted or modified, what was chosen to be omitted, and what anime-only scenes were added. In the context of limited episodes to work with, the screenwriters would have needed a super tight script for every episode. And yet, all you have to do is watch episode 1 and compare it to the light novel (volume 14) to realise that something was seriously wrong behind the scenes in terms of animation quality, production and the directors' interpretation of some fairly simple and straightforward scenes. It felt like no one gave critical thought about about how precious little episode time they had to work with and decided to waste a good portion of the episode with sub-par anime only scenes with Index).

JC Staff can be blamed for overloading their animators with too many bloody projects and not focusing on making a select few quality adaptations that they are more than capable of doing. But Nishikiori and the Project Index management staff can be blamed for the horrendous adaptation choices and vision for the series in spite of that. I don't want Nishikiori touching this series again.
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Stiles



Joined: 21 Oct 2014
Posts: 105
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:57 pm Reply with quote
Man they really abridged the scene with Fiamma and Aleister. Their conversation should be a bit longer and more tantalizing in terms of plot and foreshadowing. Same thing with the scene between the ITEM liaison and Hamazura's group. Mugino should've been shown with much more righteous anger at the reveal of the Parameter List.

I don't know why they stuck Fiamma and Touma on pillars. Pretty nonsensical.

Apart from the final scene which didn't need to be put in and this episode feeling like it was hurrying along to beat the clock, I'd say this was a good finish to what is otherwise a missed opportunity of a season.

If we do need staff changes to improve the quality, then I very much hope they can find the director and writers who can elevate Index to greater heights.
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SilverTalon01



Joined: 02 Apr 2012
Posts: 2401
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:17 pm Reply with quote
OH&S wrote:
Either way 'someone' , and I'm not quite sure who (Dengeki or JC Staff), decided that they must adapt all of the remaining Old Testament novels in one season; a foolish decision.


Yeah, and I'm afraid this would just happen again if they did NT forcing them to adapt the entire Othinus arc in 26 episodes. Forcing that kind of pace is just such a big starting deficit, and they'd need some truly talented individuals on board to get a good final product out.

OH&S wrote:
But pacing is only the first layer of problems that the anime has. Even if pacing and plot comprehension were sacrificed, there were some just baffling things that occurred in this season in terms of what was chosen to be adapted from the novels, how those scenes were adapted or modified, what was chosen to be omitted, and what anime-only scenes were added. In the context of limited episodes to work with, the screenwriters would have needed a super tight script for every episode. And yet, all you have to do is watch episode 1 and compare it to the light novel (volume 14) to realise that something was seriously wrong behind the scenes in terms of animation quality, production and the directors' interpretation of some fairly simple and straightforward scenes. It felt like no one gave critical thought about about how precious little episode time they had to work with and decided to waste a good portion of the episode with sub-par anime only scenes with Index).


And that is the really disappointing thing. It was obvious going in that they'd be at break neck pace to finish the rest of OT, but we still could have ended up with something so much better.

killjoy_the wrote:
Black to white is fine by me, but they didn't have to go with giving it actual feathers if they're going for the 'dirty wind' look on the black ones.


I didn't mind the feather look. Actual feathers floating down was a bit much though.
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FilthyCasual



Joined: 01 Jun 2015
Posts: 2185
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:22 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
amma's ultimate fate, being struck down by Aleister Crowley in person with the strong suggestion that what's inside Touma is part of Crowley's bigger scheme, was another highlight scene, but who are those two at the end who find Fiamma? I feel like I also should recognize the blonde girl who fishes Touma out of the sea at the very end, but I am having trouble placing her.

All new people who matter and get explained in the surely coming Season 4, right Japan?
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Norm the genius



Joined: 07 Dec 2018
Posts: 91
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:43 pm Reply with quote
What has always bothered me about index is that their fans always cling to the original material to defend it and not listen to anyone who points out their shortcomings, because it is not right to motivate bad work, JC staff did a bad anime that's a fact, supporting these works simply perpetuates mediocrity.
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BodaciousSpacePirate
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Joined: 17 Apr 2015
Posts: 3017
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:45 pm Reply with quote
Norm the genius wrote:
What has always bothered me about index is that their fans always cling to the original material to defend it and not listen to anyone who points out their shortcomings, because it is not right to motivate bad work, JC staff did a bad anime that's a fact, supporting these works simply perpetuates mediocrity.


It's because some of us would rather have a bad adaptation than no adaptation at all.
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OH&S



Joined: 15 Jul 2013
Posts: 306
Location: Sydney, Australia
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:52 pm Reply with quote
SilverTalon01 wrote:
Yeah, and I'm afraid this would just happen again if they did NT forcing them to adapt the entire Othinus arc in 26 episodes. Forcing that kind of pace is just such a big starting deficit, and they'd need some truly talented individuals on board to get a good final product out.


I don't even know how a competent and talented anime studio would be able to properly adapt NT to anime; let alone JC Staff. If everyone thought what happened in Index III was convoluted, almost every single event/novel that happens in NT is not only longer on average than each novel in NT, it's also at least 2-3 times more convoluted (which is part of the series charm). There are things that occur that will never make sense to anime only viewers (like a certain plot twist regarding Aleister that was hidden in the novel's narration and repeated throughout the entirety of OT and NT like a sort of narrative quirk until it finally had plot relevance; it just doesn't exist in any form in the anime). It's just not possible.

SilverTalon01 wrote:
And that is the really disappointing thing. It was obvious going in that they'd be at break neck pace to finish the rest of OT, but we still could have ended up with something so much better.


The thing that bugs me the most isn't the choice to squeeze everything into one season; because there's at least at some rationale out there that makes sense in terms quickly getting to NT (albeit a poor one). Its every other production decision that was made that has no rationale that I can come up with; minus the obvious choices to deliberately make things as static as possible in order to avoid animating things as much as possible (goddammit Nishikiori and JC Staff).
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12skippy21



Joined: 25 Nov 2008
Posts: 785
Location: York, England
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 12:56 pm Reply with quote
A good adaptation is one where you rush to the source material after its completion, needless to say this did not fit the bill.

I have never really been commited to the series (I started watching it simply because the thought of Aleister Crowley being a character was amusing), but I enjoyed Railgun and found the previous Index seasons to be passable so was considering starting the novels. However how can a season show EVERYTHING happening while at the same time feel like NOTHING was happening at all? That is quite a skill in of itself.

I am sure I will watch Railgun but I am now much more worried about Season 2 of One Punch Man. Crying or Very sad
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ultimatehaki



Joined: 27 Oct 2012
Posts: 1090
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 1:15 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Fiamma's ultimate fate, being struck down by Aleister Crowley in person with the strong suggestion that what's inside Touma is part of Crowley's bigger scheme, was another highlight scene, but who are those two at the end who find Fiamma? I feel like I also should recognize the blonde girl who fishes Touma out of the sea at the very end, but I am having trouble placing her.


Nah those three are new the only way you'd know who they are right now is if you read the side stories.
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Kamijou Touma



Joined: 01 Oct 2017
Posts: 139
Location: Gakuen Toshi
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 2:46 pm Reply with quote
I am enjoyed it, but I felt is could have easily been 52 episodes. Too much Misaka stuff missing.
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Ushio



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 630
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:45 pm Reply with quote
OH&S wrote:
jr240483 wrote:
uhhhhhhh.... you do know that their on a 26 ep limit right!?

i am not making excuses for them but if they had done what you did and completely adapted every single part of the light novel arcs for this season, the damn thing would be at least 50 eps ala SAO 3!

they are not studio pierot who is able to fiancially do eps over 25-50 and more ala one piece, boruto and black clover after all!


Not necessarily. As others have said, 26 episodes would have been perfect for just (Volumes 14 - 19) that would also roughly be in line with the pacing for Seasons 1 and 2. Then, a simple 1 cour (12-13 maybe an extra ep?) could have adapt World War Three. There's also the volume SS2 short side stories which they could have adapted one at a time maybe as a web short or something; but less priority on that.

Either way 'someone' , and I'm not quite sure who (Dengeki or JC Staff), decided that they must adapt all of the remaining Old Testament novels in one season; a foolish decision.

But pacing is only the first layer of problems that the anime has. Even if pacing and plot comprehension were sacrificed, there were some just baffling things that occurred in this season in terms of what was chosen to be adapted from the novels, how those scenes were adapted or modified, what was chosen to be omitted, and what anime-only scenes were added. In the context of limited episodes to work with, the screenwriters would have needed a super tight script for every episode. And yet, all you have to do is watch episode 1 and compare it to the light novel (volume 14) to realise that something was seriously wrong behind the scenes in terms of animation quality, production and the directors' interpretation of some fairly simple and straightforward scenes. It felt like no one gave critical thought about about how precious little episode time they had to work with and decided to waste a good portion of the episode with sub-par anime only scenes with Index).

JC Staff can be blamed for overloading their animators with too many bloody projects and not focusing on making a select few quality adaptations that they are more than capable of doing. But Nishikiori and the Project Index management staff can be blamed for the horrendous adaptation choices and vision for the series in spite of that. I don't want Nishikiori touching this series again.



The issue is they are buggered coming and going the anime is a late night infomercial (they pay the channel to air it like it's an ad rather than selling it to a channel like normal scheduled TV programming) and the way's to make money selling physical disc's is a dying business.

The only way this will break even is if either the light novel sales shoot up or the US streamers paid loads for the privilege.
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Squidslinger



Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 76
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 2:35 am Reply with quote
Norm the genius wrote:
What has always bothered me about index is that their fans always cling to the original material to defend it and not listen to anyone who points out their shortcomings, because it is not right to motivate bad work, JC staff did a bad anime that's a fact, supporting these works simply perpetuates mediocrity.


Well the fact you had to be diehard fans who watch anything and everything related, all the spinoffs/etc, definitely didn't help. It was a bad work but I don't know how they could have resolved it with such a huge cast.
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Norm the genius



Joined: 07 Dec 2018
Posts: 91
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:06 am Reply with quote
@OH&S @jr240483 I believe that a decent adaptation can be made even with the little time, just knowing how to adapt, it would be a serious thing to sacrifice certain elements such as eliminating the ITEM group from the equation because, in general terms, it did nothing relevant this season, everything that did not work to develop the final arc simply make it disappear and concentrate on at least one story and also eliminate hamazura the "third protagonist" that did not contribute to the plot of Russia vs. Academy City
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18178
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:00 am Reply with quote
^
They couldn't have eliminated ITEM because what goes on with ITEM is directly relevant to establishing Hamazura as one of the franchise's main protagonists - and that was one of the major overall points of this part of the story.
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