×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
INTEREST: JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Character Designer Expresses Disappointment in Anime Industry


Goto page Previous  1, 2

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
ChestPains



Joined: 05 Oct 2016
Posts: 101
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:48 am Reply with quote
They're just going for quantity over quality lately, the amount of shows per season has nearly tripled what it was in the 2000s and with how much they outsource or have "guest episodes" the shortage of people working there was always apparent.

It's not easy to make a good show but when you have more than 3-4months to do a whole 26ep show you can at least have a decent flow instead of "crunch from when it's announced to when the BDs are done." And more, the animators are well aware if they mess up the whole world will complain about it so they have absolutely no choice other than to suffer through it because of the lack of a union and lack of respect for them in their own industry.

It did always feel to me like expenses went up and to make up for that they just doubled the shows they do thinking they'll just double the income, and because of that I think a "flop" hits much harder.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MarshalBanana



Joined: 31 Aug 2014
Posts: 5296
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 9:27 am Reply with quote
ChestPains wrote:
They're just going for quantity over quality lately, the amount of shows per season has nearly tripled what it was in the 2000s and with how much they outsource or have "guest episodes" the shortage of people working there was always apparent.

It's not easy to make a good show but when you have more than 3-4months to do a whole 26ep show you can at least have a decent flow instead of "crunch from when it's announced to when the BDs are done." And more, the animators are well aware if they mess up the whole world will complain about it so they have absolutely no choice other than to suffer through it because of the lack of a union and lack of respect for them in their own industry.

It did always feel to me like expenses went up and to make up for that they just doubled the shows they do thinking they'll just double the income, and because of that I think a "flop" hits much harder.
The issue is that there is no 'they' deciding on how many shows to make a year. There have been a lot more studios pop up in the last ten years, so it does not matter how few shows a studio puts out in a year. The only real solution would be for a lot of studios to close, because even if a studio decides to do a low amount of shows, they still need to be putting out a minimum per year to keep the lights on.

Last year for example, both Bones and MAPPA only put out 2 new shows each, and even A-1 Pictures only put out four, which compared to what they usually put out is saying something.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 821
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:07 am Reply with quote
MarshalBanana wrote:
The issue is that there is no 'they' deciding on how many shows to make a year.


Yes, this. What I feel that a lot of people, especially us in the west, miss is that animation studios are CONTRACTORS. They're no different than plumbers, carpenters, or electricians. They don't decide how many shows to make or what those shows are like. Rather, they are paid by a production committee to do work-for-hire. The size and number of animation studios is entirely dependent on how much business they get from the production companies involved, not the other way around.

When ChestPains wrote "They're just going for quantity over quality lately", that it is a criticism of the producers, not the animation studios. It is the producers who choose to make more cheaper anime rather than a smaller amount of more costly anime.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdnation



Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 1994
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 11:29 am Reply with quote
I wonder if a large part of this is also due to concerns about a lack of talent and hire-able employees/contractors. No doubt with population decline and a bad workplace reputation, fewer people would be inclined to take it up. So with less people available to work, the existing people get overworked.


luisedgarf wrote:
Well, this is one of the reasons why western animation went from using traditional animation to CGI, as you don't have to deal with all of this. Sad


This is false. If anything, the old crugedy suits imagine CG folk need to work even harder because all they do is push buttons and a computer magically does all the work.

The VFX industry is having it's own problems, particularly with rushed schedules to put the films out faster, and another large reason is because there is outsourcing to places like India where they'll do work for far less money, so they need to be as competitive as possible.

The shift to CG was in large part because Western audiences find CG more impressive than hand drawn animation. And in the studio system, CG does have the benefit of being more easily editable and flexible with reusable assets.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Sheriru



Joined: 27 May 2016
Posts: 120
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:39 pm Reply with quote
As if its just the Animators, lol? Its Japans Industry in everything. 2019 they still work theirselves literally to death or die of alcoholism because of their work ethnics.
Its just not public enough for any changes to happen and probably never will be. It this case it was an "Animator" this time. What about the Death Rate of their regular Office Workers? Nobody talks about that, because they're not "important" enough.

Japan will not change, Japan will never changs. They love their traditions. One day it may just all explode.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Kadmos1



Joined: 08 May 2014
Posts: 13540
Location: In Phoenix but has an 85308 ZIP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 3:44 pm Reply with quote
MarshalBanana wrote:
ChestPains wrote:
They're just going for quantity over quality lately, the amount of shows per season has nearly tripled what it was in the 2000s and with how much they outsource or have "guest episodes" the shortage of people working there was always apparent.

It's not easy to make a good show but when you have more than 3-4months to do a whole 26ep show you can at least have a decent flow instead of "crunch from when it's announced to when the BDs are done." And more, the animators are well aware if they mess up the whole world will complain about it so they have absolutely no choice other than to suffer through it because of the lack of a union and lack of respect for them in their own industry.

It did always feel to me like expenses went up and to make up for that they just doubled the shows they do thinking they'll just double the income, and because of that I think a "flop" hits much harder.
The issue is that there is no 'they' deciding on how many shows to make a year. There have been a lot more studios pop up in the last ten years, so it does not matter how few shows a studio puts out in a year. The only real solution would be for a lot of studios to close, because even if a studio decides to do a low amount of shows, they still need to be putting out a minimum per year to keep the lights on.

Last year for example, both Bones and MAPPA only put out 2 new shows each, and even A-1 Pictures only put out four, which compared to what they usually put out is saying something.

If having fewer anime titles debuting each season meant the animators of any country had to work less hours, got paid a bit better, and there was better QC, I am for it. If that meant 25 new titles each season (this counts TV series, OVA epi., movies, and web series), so be it. That is the supply part. However, the demand side is what is hard to keep up with. The output of anime that we currently have each season does help to somewhat satisfy that demand for more at the cost of what I described in the first sentence.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kotomikun



Joined: 06 May 2013
Posts: 1205
PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 4:45 pm Reply with quote
jdnation wrote:
The shift to CG was in large part because Western audiences find CG more impressive than hand drawn animation.


The knee-jerk hate most English-speaking anime fans have for CG indicates otherwise. Though that's mainly because Japan has a reputation for inserting awful-looking digital animation for stuff that would be difficult or time-consuming to animate by hand. It's not as easy as the executives probably believe--if it was trivial, they wouldn't only just now be reaching the point where it looks almost as good as hand-drawn--but in many cases it saves a ton of labor just because you don't literally have to draw every square inch of every frame by hand.

They also make the job even harder by trying to make CG that looks hand-drawn, to avoid losing the recognizable style. But they kinda have to. If all the anime next season looked like Pixar made it, there'd probably be a mass exodus from the fandom, both locally and overseas. It's not just Japan that's resistant to change.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Sailor Sedna





PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2019 5:19 pm Reply with quote
$25 a paycheck? That's criminally insane. Shocked

There's gotta be something done to fix this, like what some people said, don't go for quantity over quality, that would work. I don't know if unionization exists in Japan or how it works, but that could happen...

And I do NOT want there to be a sudden shift to entirely CGI, if that happens, I am out. That animation medium has just become "eh" and nothing exciting to me nowadays, even if there are some good movies that use it, and with some exceptions (Death Billiards, Cure Miracle and Moforun's Magic Lesson!, and Saint Seiya: Legend of Sanctuary) I have never seen any CGI animation in anime that ever comes close to looking satisfactory in a pleasing format, half the time the characters just move at like, 5 frames per second, looking like a laggy PS3 video game.
Back to top
Xiximaro



Joined: 03 Feb 2017
Posts: 151
PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 4:05 pm Reply with quote
Regarding the article, the author could start adding the cost of living monthly of a animator.
I say this because, well when I hear about 1,103$ I wrongly assume it's a good pay. Because in my country the minimum wage is 600€, I'm from a developed country in Europe btw.
This article probably assumes the reader has a minium wage off 2.000$-3.000$ or something, that's why the people are outraged by the low income and here I am the stupid thinking that Japanese animators receive a average pay...
I had to research that the animators pay on average 800$ on rent of a "cubicle" to be working in Tokyo and now I get why they are exploited.
The article is good, but it's below average if it's meant to be read by an international audience, cause I know the majority of people will assume what I assumed without even researching after reading it. Which is a shame, since this is a issue that deserves worldwide recognition... it'll fall flat by a good amount of readers I think.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 821
PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:12 pm Reply with quote
Sailor Sedna wrote:
$25 a paycheck? That's criminally insane. Shocked

There's gotta be something done to fix this, like what some people said, don't go for quantity over quality, that would work. I don't know if unionization exists in Japan or how it works, but that could happen...


I do agree with you that it sounds criminally insane on the surface. But I'm sure there is more to it than we know. The comment states "first paycheck". Not "the first year" or the "first several months" or something like that. The implication is that there was something special about the first check as opposed to his ongoing salary. My guess is that there were various one-time deductions from his first paycheck. That is common in a variety of jobs where the employee is expected to pay for tools, training, uniforms, or the like out of their pay.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group