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INTEREST: NHK Macross Mega-Poll Crowns Macross F, Sheryl Nome


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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7810
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 1:35 pm Reply with quote
Who even remembers Macross Frontier? Even Yoko Kanno was kind of phoning it in.

Macross Plus was the peak of the franchise.


Last edited by penguintruth on Mon May 06, 2019 2:45 pm; edited 3 times in total
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meiam



Joined: 23 Jun 2013
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:09 pm Reply with quote
Yeah I'm kinda shocked at how low Plus scored, I could have blamed it being older (and not the first one) but then the YF-19 was top plane, so that's strange. Maybe cause it was a movie/OVA? I think it's phenomenal and being my first experienced of "macross" ruined the entire thing for me, nothing else came close. Frontier was decent but so meh compared to Plus (although I do agree Sheryl is an awesome character, but I'd still place her below Isamu). Maybe cause they split it into movie/OVA form that hurt it's standing, but then again frontier movie did decently well...

Bummed zero also didn't even make it top 10.
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Zeino



Joined: 19 May 2017
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:23 pm Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
Who even remembers Macross Frontier? Even Yoko Kanno was kind of phoning it in.

Macross Plus was the peak of the franchise.


I do for one as does lots of other people and it is honestly the best entry in the franchise since the original one. Better even as it doesn't have the original SDF's somewhat unfortunate political undercurrents: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RB3JQhghbrs

Watanabe's direction, the animation and the soundtrack aside, Plus really doesn't hold up. The characters are completely unlikable, and none of it makes much sense. Isamu might be one of my least favorite anime protagonists ever. He shows up, treats everyone terribly, keeps ignoring what he's supposed to do in a job he supposedly wants, but the anime frames everything as if you're supposed to be sympathetic to him. Guld is only slightly less of a dick, and he also does terrible things with little to no consequence.

Frontier also has a deeper plot with far better, more sympathetic characters that one cares about than Plus which can easily be summarized as just "Top Gun vs Yandere Hatsune Miku" But than you think Zeta Gundam is masterpiece.

Meanwhile, I'm just glad that best idol singer and Macross girl, Sheryl Nome is still beloved.


Last edited by Zeino on Mon May 06, 2019 3:42 pm; edited 4 times in total
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DRWii



Joined: 16 May 2007
Posts: 576
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:26 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
The voting tally found Macross Frontier (Macross F) and the most popular anime and its star Sheryl Nome won the most popular character category.

Best Girl wins, all's right with the world.
In all seriousness though, it's BS how the poll counts multiple versions of the same character (Sheryl in 1st and 4th, Minmay in 6th and 10th). Let some other characters in.

Quote:
1. Macross Frontier
2. The Super Dimension Fortress Macross: Do You Remember Love?
3. Macross 7
4. Macross Frontier: Sayonara no Tsubasa
5. The Super Dimension Fortress Macross
6. Macross Delta
7. Macross Plus

8. Macross Plus Movie Edition
9. Macross Delta: Gekijō no Walkūre
10. Macross Dynamite 7

Oof. I guess this answers why there's almost no Plus representation in Uta Macross.
Also, Dynamite 7 getting in over Zero? Come on...
EDIT: Wait, the first Frontier movie didn't get in? Are fans counting their Sayonara no Tsubasa votes for both movies, or is it just not well liked?


Last edited by DRWii on Mon May 06, 2019 4:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Psajdak



Joined: 12 Oct 2008
Posts: 224
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:30 pm Reply with quote
I can't believe the most iconic character, Minmay (both versions) isn't in top 3.

Also, Misa where?

First Macross series also deserved higher place...

But at least wonderful DYRL? movie, and its most iconic song Ai Oboeteimasu ka? are still so beloved.
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meiam



Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 2403
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 2:56 pm Reply with quote
Zeino wrote:

Watanabe's direction, the animation and the soundtrack aside, Plus really doesn't hold up. The characters are completely unlikable, and none of it makes much sense. Isamu might be one of my least favorite anime protagonists ever. He shows up, treats everyone terribly, keeps ignoring what he's supposed to do in a job he supposedly wants, but the anime frames everything as if you're supposed to be sympathetic to him. Guld is only slightly less of a dick, and he also does terrible things with little to no consequence.


??? When did Isamu ever ignore what he's supposed to do? He fly the plane every time he can, and does all the test very seriously, it's clearly stated that the YF-19 was almost certain to lose the competition before Isamu showed up. He does goes against order at the end but that's because they're about to mothball him and every pilot by replacing them with AI. Yeah he's a jerk (and the anime make no attempt at hiding that) but you really can't say he wasn't doing his job.

And what makes no sense? I mean yeah the song = mind control doesn't make much sense, but that's in every Macross... Otherwise I can't think of anything that doesn't particularly hold up, definitely not if one was to consider anything else in other macross more consistent.
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H. Guderian



Joined: 29 Jan 2014
Posts: 1144
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 5:40 pm Reply with quote
I am shocked Delta scored so high and Plus so low. Everything about the lists are good though. Basara, still the best.
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Kougeru



Joined: 13 May 2008
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 6:19 pm Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
Who even remembers Macross Frontier? Even Yoko Kanno was kind of phoning it in.

Macross Plus was the peak of the franchise.


I wanna assume this is sarcasm since I tend to agree with a large % of your posts lol. Frontier is easily the best since the original. I loved FIGHTS and music in Plus but everything else is meh. Frontier's OST is just as good, with top-tier vocal pop songs from May'n and Megumi.

I agree with @H. Guderian , Delta should've been lower and Plus higher but everything else is pretty spot on. Though I would personally put Ranka on top >.>
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BlueAlf



Joined: 02 Jan 2017
Posts: 705
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 6:44 pm Reply with quote
No mention of Sharon Apple. Maybe that's indication of Macross Plus's low score?

On the other hand, despite glaring flaws and downsides, I remember numerous instances when the original TV series of Macross Frontier simply blew away expectations. The final battle sequence especially was magnificently done. One of the best final battles in mecha anime IMO.
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JWagnesh8



Joined: 27 Sep 2015
Posts: 26
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 6:52 pm Reply with quote
Chalk it up to generational differences, I guess. I am pleased that Ai Oboete Imasu Ka and Tenshi No Enogu are still remembered, in light of the fates of real-life and fictional people associated with them.

But yeah, where's Misa?
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jdnation



Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 1126
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 7:11 pm Reply with quote
Zeino wrote:
Watanabe's direction, the animation and the soundtrack aside, Plus really doesn't hold up. The characters are completely unlikable, and none of it makes much sense. Isamu might be one of my least favorite anime protagonists ever. He shows up, treats everyone terribly, keeps ignoring what he's supposed to do in a job he supposedly wants, but the anime frames everything as if you're supposed to be sympathetic to him. Guld is only slightly less of a dick, and he also does terrible things with little to no consequence.


Wha?

Son, Macross Plus is still one of the all time great OVAs. I always recommend that over the movie version. Top notch classic animation, and the characters are all great.

Isamu isn't mean to be 'likable', he's a stereotype of the proud fly-boy fighter pilots in the Top-Gun military who consider themselves hot shit.

He doesn't treat everybody 'terribly', this is a portrayal of what is commonly called an extrovert. As someone else already explained, he does his job. He does try to push the limits of his test plane, which comes with a risk/reward scenario, which is what actual test pilots actually do and how historic breakthroughs are usually made in this field. The YF-19 is in competition with the YF-21. Isamu can get over his head and this also bites him in the ass. But that's part of his character, and part of the theme.

Guld did do something bad, but this is in keeping with the whole Zentradi blood warrior thing that makes them more antagonistic and thus has biological anger issues. His jealousy got the better of him and he psychologically repressed this from his mind and rearranged history, but unfortunately this also fed itself into the neural system making him lose control. His friends, Isamu and Myung were too kind to confront him with the truth. Guld does suffer consequences, he almost screwed up the YF-21 demonstration, and in hindsight he destroyed his entire relationship with his only friends. He did try to frame Isamu for one thing, intending himself to be the recepient of the hurt, but it went awry, and the only reason he didn't receive punishment is because the military, in true political fashion, wanted to hush up the incident. At the end of the day, both Isamu and Guld lose to the A.I. X-9 Ghost that was developed in secret, so all their efforts were in vain.

The same tech of the YF-21 was also used in Sharon Apple's system which was likewise feeding off of Myung's emotions. This system was then implemented on a larger scale and hypnotized the entire audience on Earth as well as taking over its defence systems and Macross, and the X-9. The whole plot plays into this and makes absolute sense both plot wise and thematically of how our emotions get the better of us - whether in Isamu, or Guld or Myung's case.


Anyway, other than the original Macross (due solely to nostalgia for Robotech) and Macross Plus which is a masterpiece as far as I'm concerned, the only other one I dug was Macross Zero, which sadly I don't know if we'll ever get a proper local release due to the whole rights fiasco. Everything outside of those 3 doesn't click with me, even though I'd agree that the popular stuff is essentially what Macross is all about, and that it's the likes of Plus and Zero that are the deviational spin-offs.

But I'd gladly take more of those spin-offs. Sharon Apple and Sara Nome and how music was incorporated into those shows was also more my kind of thing than the typical J-Pop.

It's likely that the poll is more skewed to younger audiences and that's why we get the results, though it is strange that the YF-19 came out on top of the mech poll, but you don't have to like the show to like the mechanical design. The YF-19 is one sleek sexy aircraft.

Also it's likely because stuff like Plus and Zero are shorter form, and naturally lengthier episodic shows spanning 26 or more episodes can make the storyline or characters more endearing to fans. So that might naturally explain the results.
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 7:30 pm Reply with quote
Kougeru wrote:

I wanna assume this is sarcasm since I tend to agree with a large % of your posts lol. Frontier is easily the best since the original. I loved FIGHTS and music in Plus but everything else is meh. Frontier's OST is just as good, with top-tier vocal pop songs from May'n and Megumi.

I agree with @H. Guderian , Delta should've been lower and Plus higher but everything else is pretty spot on. Though I would personally put Ranka on top >.>


I honestly have difficulty remembering anything about Frontier, except that extremely bland main lead (to be fair, that's 90% of Macross leads, Hikaru was boring asf), that song about carrots, and way too many Macross Zero references for my liking (which is to say, any references, because I actively loathe Zero). I didn't hate Frontier, I didn't feel it was insulting, like the little I watched of Delta, but it just didn't have much of an impact on me. Plus has it all, gorgeous art and animation, solid action, a genius OST, and some great drama. It had a huge impact on my anime fandom and continues to hold up. Frontier was just another show to me.
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Beltane70



Joined: 07 May 2007
Posts: 2248
PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 7:51 pm Reply with quote
DRWii wrote:

EDIT: Wait, the first Frontier movie didn't get in? Are fans counting their Sayonara no Tsubasa votes for both movies, or is it just not well liked?


I think that the reason that the first Frontier movie didn't get in was most likely because it followed the first half of the TV series with relatively few changes while the second movie was mostly all-new material.
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Covnam



Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 1383
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 1:08 am Reply with quote
Having semi-recently watched Delta and Frontier I'm glad to see results for Frontier, though it seems there isn't as much love for Delta. Maybe the idol group aspect isn't what people were looking for...

I didn't expect to see Macross 7 so high, but then again, I haven't seen it. Maybe I should get around to doing that...

After that I'd just have II, Zero and the Delta & Frontier movies left to watch
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Kaori Makimura



Joined: 18 Apr 2018
Posts: 108
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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2019 8:42 am Reply with quote
Delta beat out Plus? In what universe???
Actually, 7 beating out Plus also is mind boggling but okay.

Misa wasn't even on the list... which made me sad. But seeing God awful heart testicles Freyja on there stung more... just no. Delta was terrible and she made it worse.

Diamond Crevasse should be higher on the list, and again, for all of the great music the macross franchise has given us, for there to be TWO delta songs on there... just insults me as a fan.
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