×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
INTEREST: Convention Runner Ryan Kopf Banned from Anime Milwaukee Following Alleged Sexual Assault


Goto page Previous  1, 2

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Aresef



Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 909
Location: MD
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 3:06 pm Reply with quote
It's good that a convention finally took action against him. Like Vic Mignogna and Dylan Keilman, he has no place in our community. Unfortunately, however, nothing can stop him from running the conventions he runs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Stampeed Valkyrie



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
Posts: 826
Location: PA
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 3:23 pm Reply with quote
Tempest wrote:

We may have the right to link to the recording. But that also means we have the right to not link to it. Our editors exercised that right. One of the responsibilities of journalists is to weigh the potential harm in publishing material. Journalists who publish everything they are allowed to publish, consequences be damned, are unethical. This article went through an ethics check with an outside ethics advisor, they agreed with the decision not to link to the recording.


So this leads to 2 fundamental issues I have with news outlets and with Main Stream Media in general.

1.) Ethics.. News sites rush to report facts, or more commonly facts that appear to be correct at the time. Regardless of consequences and damage to the character of the individual in question. At the time of this post without due process, this guy is innocent until proven guilty. Is it Ethical to promote 1 side of information, and allow judgement by his peers via the internet without any burden of proof?

2.) Claimed Objectiveness.. Media or News sites have a job to inform the public. Not to filter or make judgements for the public. You report and let your readers build their own opinions. Nothing more and nothing less. The sad part of the current state of affairs is nobody seems to care about this anymore, this is very dangerous to a Democratic society.

Using this instance as an example, The victims do have rights, but the right for the accused to confront the accuser is equally valid. This along with due process are 2 very core concepts of the Justice System (in the US at least).


Just my .02
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AmpersandsUnited



Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 633
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 3:53 pm Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:

1.) Ethics.. News sites rush to report facts, or more commonly facts that appear to be correct at the time. Regardless of consequences and damage to the character of the individual in question. At the time of this post without due process, this guy is innocent until proven guilty. Is it Ethical to promote 1 side of information, and allow judgement by his peers via the internet without any burden of proof?

2.) Claimed Objectiveness.. Media or News sites have a job to inform the public. Not to filter or make judgements for the public. You report and let your readers build their own opinions. Nothing more and nothing less. The sad part of the current state of affairs is nobody seems to care about this anymore, this is very dangerous to a Democratic society


If the reporting is done based on actual documents like police reports, or when someone is actually fired from their position, then it's just reporting on actual, verifiable events and I say that's completely fine. Reporting based on anonymous, unverifiable rumors and claims however, does seem unethical and more akin to a tabloid looking to get clicks.

No news outlet is objective. They all have their own beliefs and agenda and why some news sources just simply won't report on certain events if it makes their people or politics look bad. That's why you should make it a habit of reading multiple sources from multiple perspectives in order to stay educated about everything.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
lossthief
ANN Reviewer


Joined: 14 Dec 2012
Posts: 1390
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 4:15 pm Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:


1.) Ethics.. News sites rush to report facts, or more commonly facts that appear to be correct at the time. Regardless of consequences and damage to the character of the individual in question. At the time of this post without due process, this guy is innocent until proven guilty. Is it Ethical to promote 1 side of information, and allow judgement by his peers via the internet without any burden of proof?


Did you read the part where they requested, received, and quoted Kopf's response to the allegations? They did give his side of the story as far as he's told it, which amounted to "no I didn't." If that defense doesn't stand up compared to the rest of the evidence in the article, that's not a failure of journalistic ethics to provide "balanced" coverage - it's that most of the information available points to it being true.

Quote:
2.) Claimed Objectiveness.. Media or News sites have a job to inform the public. Not to filter or make judgements for the public. You report and let your readers build their own opinions. Nothing more and nothing less. The sad part of the current state of affairs is nobody seems to care about this anymore, this is very dangerous to a Democratic society.


So what part of resposting/linking to audio from Kopf's sex tape would be at all useful to the overall integrity of this article?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ranran-001



Joined: 25 Oct 2018
Posts: 537
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 5:26 pm Reply with quote
Pornographic or not, a video and audio is sketchy. At its best, it would be consensual AND the person on it knew she was being recorded. At worst, it would make Kopf look like an absolute scum bag for filming a sexual encounter without the partner's knowledge.

The thing to note is, it doesn't matter how many times someone has sex with a willing partner. It only takes one time when consent was not given for it to be a crime. An audio tape and recording, possibly done without the consenting partner's knowledge does nothing to exonerate Kopf from these accusations.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tempest
I Run this place.
ANN Publisher


Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 10420
Location: Do not message me for support.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 5:38 pm Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:
News sites rush to report facts, or more commonly facts that appear to be correct at the time. Regardless of consequences and damage to the character of the individual in question. At the time of this post without due process, this guy is innocent until proven guilty. Is it Ethical to promote 1 side of information, and allow judgement by his peers via the internet without any burden of proof?


Our reporters gave his side of the story.
There is a burden of evidense. Journalists have a lower burden than courts. Our level is similar to that of a prosecutors. "There's enough evidence here to warrant a trial/article." Of course, the standards are different. We're judging whether or not something is important and verifiable enough that the community should be informed. Prosecutors are determining the seriousness of an alleged crime and the likelihood of a conviction.

In neither case is the prosecutor or journalist looking at "beyond a reasonable doubt." That's for the court of law.

While there are similarities, the difference between the prosecutor's criteria and the journalists is important. We may report on activity that is inappropriate, but not necessarily illegal.

Additionally, Unlike the prosecutor, journalist usually aren't arguing a particular side in the case. We're just providing the public with information that we believe to be of public importance.

Our responsibility is to make the public aware of the case. People who may find themselves in the presence of a potentially dangerous individual have the right to know about it and to determine for themselves whether or not they need to change their plans. Our goal isn't to convince them that Mr. Kopf's (or anyone else) is or isn't a danger. They make that decision on their own, but they can only make that decision if they are aware that there is an issue.

As I previously mentioned, we run all this through an outside ethics advisor (who was referred to us by the SPJ and teaches university journalism ethics courses).

-t


Last edited by Tempest on Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime My Manga
Tempest
I Run this place.
ANN Publisher


Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 10420
Location: Do not message me for support.
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 6:59 pm Reply with quote
ranran-001 wrote:
Pornographic or not, a video and audio is sketchy. At its best, it would be consensual AND the person on it knew she was being recorded. At worst, it would make Kopf look like an absolute scum bag for filming a sexual encounter without the partner's knowledge.


Assuming the image he posted is real, she absolutely would have known that he was fillming her
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime My Manga
-SP-





PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 7:14 pm Reply with quote
AJ (LordNikon) wrote:
KyuuA4 wrote:
He needs to end up in jail.

AiddonValentine wrote:
Well, he can go straight to hell


No, what he needs is to be tried in a court of law and that of public opinion. Remember in American you can be accused, tried and convicted by public opinion whether something is true or not. It use to be innocent until proven guilty.

I neither know this man, nor have direct first hand knowledge of anything he has said or done, but it seems that Americans are so quick to assume the worst in everyone or anything.

If this guy is arrested, and brought before a trial by his peers and is convicted, then so-fore he is guilty of the crime he is accused of, until then, everything else is an accusation, reinforced by whatever emotional sense of empathy or sympathy one has for the accuser.

I can see both sides of the story as a grandparent who had a grand child who was actually sexually assaulted, and another one who was accused of sexually assaulting someone else, where both cases played out in the justice system, and both unrelated events were proven correct. I've also first hand in my journalism career seen the fall out of someone wrongly accused of a crime they did not commit, and the results of a victim of a crime who was found not-guilty.

My gut tells me Kopf is likely guilty, but until I am sitting in a jury bench, I'll still maintain my objectivity.

Exactly. His reputation is utterly destroyed. At this point I hope he is guilty, because if he is somehow innocent, then there is no coming back from this.
Back to top
Aresef



Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 909
Location: MD
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:47 pm Reply with quote
These allegations are consistent with what people already know about his behavior. That’s also why, for example, the allegations against Vic Mignogna ring true—because they tracked with what many already knew about him, or they knew of something he did with a similar MO, but didn’t spread that through the wider community at the time for fear of rocking the boat.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tanteikingdomkey



Joined: 03 Sep 2008
Posts: 2346
PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2019 11:43 pm Reply with quote
I have worked many of the conventions that he has done as a vendor before....
I was shocked when Vic got hit by the #metoo train before ryan did.
Just because vic has tried to act/be a good person meanwhile almost every single person I have ever meet who has actually encountered ryan has ended up dispensing him. The guy has a true talent for making people hate him.
Now this is harsh but some people have interesting standards I think, because its a wonder to me that people would ever consider having an intimate relationship with the guy. This is I think the third sexual assault allegation in 10 years I have heard about the guy, in addition to the tax fraud, the acen ban, the mall near ACEN having problems with him, my personal favorite him hitting a bootleg vendor, possible extortion/threats , and just general being horrible to those around him or having staff that are horrible to deal with.

I still remember anime zing 2013 where my friend got sexually assaulted by a extremely creepy guy and the roof feel on a vendors booth....so why did I keep doing his cons long after that, simple his midwest can be popular, I was stupid, and this like all the other times affecting him in the slightest.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Commander Cluck



Joined: 02 May 2019
Posts: 123
PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:47 am Reply with quote
Aresef wrote:
These allegations are consistent with what people already know about his behavior. That’s also why, for example, the allegations against Vic Mignogna ring true—because they tracked with what many already knew about him, or they knew of something he did with a similar MO, but didn’t spread that through the wider community at the time for fear of rocking the boat.


It also doesn't hurt there's actual police reports here, unlike with the Vic hearsay.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mad_Scientist
Subscriber
Moderator


Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 3011
PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 2:25 am Reply with quote
Okay, we've already had, what, five different threads about Vic? At least five, probably more, and we'll certainly have more threads in the future whenever the lawsuit concludes. We don't need to turn this thread into another Vic thread. So let's back off on the Vic comparisons and contrasts and stuff, okay? It's kind of off topic anyways.

*Moderator mode off*

As for the actual topic, yikes. I just don't know what to say. I didn't know much about this guy till very recently, but every story I've heard about him since is absolutely horrifying. And yes, I believe he's guilty and that his denial was absurd. I can only hope that this time charges will be pressed and he'll go to jail, or at the very least that there won't be any further victims.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Furi-Yuri
Subscriber



Joined: 04 Jan 2012
Posts: 24
PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:13 pm Reply with quote
As a parent I would not allow my child to attend any Con right now. They've done a terrible job of protecting female convention goers from sex pests. You don't know who you can trust. Even if I accompanied I'd be hesitant. Going by my Twitter feed cons have known about and tried to "manage" this situation since the 2000's. Best way to manage them is to not let them in at all.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
KabaKabaFruit



Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Posts: 1871
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:15 am Reply with quote
AmepersandsUnited wrote:
No news outlet is objective. They all have their own beliefs and agenda and why some news sources just simply won't report on certain events if it makes their people or politics look bad. That's why you should make it a habit of reading multiple sources from multiple perspectives in order to stay educated about everything.
Reuters, Associated Press and PBS Newshour all say hello.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Sethimothy



Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 121
PostPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:55 am Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:
I'm curious why background checks are not being used for ALL staff at these cons.


Short answer - they're not cheap, and they can be faulty.

Long answer: they wouldn't have mattered in this case anyways. Either directly, or indirectly through shell companies, Mr Kopf *ran* these conventions, he was not *employed* by them. He wouldn't have ran a background check on himself.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group