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INTEREST: Evangelion Character Designer Yoshiyuki Sadamoto Attracts Criticism Over 'Dismissive' Twee


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AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 821
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:33 am Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Please, please tell me that you are not taking a position where admitting some atrocity happened and framing it as a positive thing is somehow a better moral position than denying the atrocity happened at all. The moment that you stoop to rationalizing wholesale slaughter of women, children, and civilians in general in war you've sunk to the lowest you can get and are in every way no better off than people who deny such things happened at all.


I never claimed the atomic bombings were a positive thing; I'm not sure how I gave that impression. I don't believe in sugar-coating it and framing it as "positive" either.
I know that some people claim that the bombings were a good thing because they supposedly "ended the war faster", but I do not agree with that viewpoint. (I have the same opinion about the British Operation Chastise, BTW)

To repeat myself in case I wasn't clear earlier:
Admitting what you did is the first step in moving forward. It's certainly not the only one, but if you can't even make that first step, the other steps will never happen.
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Meongantuk



Joined: 03 Jun 2016
Posts: 353
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:46 am Reply with quote
jl07045 wrote:
harminia wrote:
The fact that Japan continuously DENIES what they did means it stays relevant. If Japan had accepted they did that and apologised, people could've moved on a little and healed.

They apologise like every other year for it. What SK and China and others don't like is the wording.
But the truth is even if the wording is too ambiguous, this issue won't go away as long as Japan's rivals can use it as a political leverage internationally and, more importantly, back home.


Adding to this, Japan actually did compensated some of the victims multiple times through social organizations but never directly. I don't know how much they compensated though, all I know it wasn't continuous support. At least that what happened in my country.

At this point, this whole debacle is not as simple as "Give a heartfelt apology and compensation." especially towards Korea and China.
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VerQuality



Joined: 01 Oct 2016
Posts: 136
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:18 am Reply with quote
Meongantuk wrote:
Adding to this, Japan actually did compensated some of the victims multiple times through social organizations but never directly. I don't know how much they compensated though, all I know it wasn't continuous support. At least that what happened in my country.

At this point, this whole debacle is not as simple as "Give a heartfelt apology and compensation." especially towards Korea and China.


Yeah, this is a lot more of a political mess than it can seem at first glance. The Japanese government has apologized, multiple times, and there is a sense in Japan that Korea is really milking Japan's (appalling) war-time conduct for easy political points back home, beyond what is reasonable - hence the "propaganda" comment. Meanwhile, in Korea there's the sense that Japan has never fully admitted to its wrongdoing, and there's an element of truth to that as well, as there's a strong contingent of (voting) Japanese who like to downplay the scale of the problem, or deny it happened outright, and an even larger cohort that feels Japan has already done enough. Even worse, these dismissive attitudes are held and spoken by a number of Japanese politicians and officials, who keep throwing fuel onto the fire. At this point, it's become so ingrained in the political cultures of both nations that it's hard to see a resolution to the problem anytime soon.

Wikipedia seems to have a decently unbiased overview of the whole issue, of both the history of the horrific 'comfort women' system itself, and the political mess that's followed Japan and Korea attempting to come to a final agreement on how Japan should take responsibility for it. Either way, this is an issue with a ton of nuance to it, and twitter is definitely not the place for a discussion on it.
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar


Joined: 14 Aug 2006
Posts: 16935
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:44 pm Reply with quote
Did some clean up with trollish and/or off topic posts. Keep it on topic, not on other people, and stop the pointless off topic political trolling.
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reanimator





PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:55 pm Reply with quote
VerQuality wrote:
Meongantuk wrote:
Adding to this, Japan actually did compensated some of the victims multiple times through social organizations but never directly. I don't know how much they compensated though, all I know it wasn't continuous support. At least that what happened in my country.

At this point, this whole debacle is not as simple as "Give a heartfelt apology and compensation." especially towards Korea and China.


Yeah, this is a lot more of a political mess than it can seem at first glance. The Japanese government has apologized, multiple times, and there is a sense in Japan that Korea is really milking Japan's (appalling) war-time conduct for easy political points back home, beyond what is reasonable - hence the "propaganda" comment. Meanwhile, in Korea there's the sense that Japan has never fully admitted to its wrongdoing, and there's an element of truth to that as well, as there's a strong contingent of (voting) Japanese who like to downplay the scale of the problem, or deny it happened outright, and an even larger cohort that feels Japan has already done enough. Even worse, these dismissive attitudes are held and spoken by a number of Japanese politicians and officials, who keep throwing fuel onto the fire. At this point, it's become so ingrained in the political cultures of both nations that it's hard to see a resolution to the problem anytime soon.

Wikipedia seems to have a decently unbiased overview of the whole issue, of both the history of the horrific 'comfort women' system itself, and the political mess that's followed Japan and Korea attempting to come to a final agreement on how Japan should take responsibility for it. Either way, this is an issue with a ton of nuance to it, and twitter is definitely not the place for a discussion on it.


You're right. This is a political mess beyond average people like us.
From Korean-American's point of view, I do think that both countries have a chip on their shoulders which they'll never admit. Even if both governments find a suitable resolution, there are people who'll be never satisfied.

For me, I'm going to forgive Sadamoto's remark because no one is perfect and he's a product of his nation's education system just like many other older generation of Japanese people.
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Cutiebunny



Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 1747
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:33 pm Reply with quote
reanimator wrote:
..he's a product of his nation's education system just like many other older generation of Japanese people.


I've always found the "they're old and that's why they're that way" excuse to be simply that, an excuse. When the opposite was applied to me as a child, it upset me that someone could equate youth to naivete when it came to heavier topics.

People should continuously try to educate themselves on all sorts of matters to ensure they have a continuously evolving viewpoint. This doesn't mean that they have to radically change their political, moral and/or religious views, but simply to be aware that there are multiple sides to every story and these are often not covered in school or on national news.

I do not agree with Sadamoto's refusal to acknowledge these transgressions that occurred during WWII. However, when I watch Evangelion or purchase Evangelion merchandise, it's because I enjoy the series and am paying Sadamoto (as well as everyone else who worked on these projects) for their involvement. If Sadamoto's opinion bothers me so much, I always have the option of no longer continuing my financial support of the franchise. The same goes for everyone who is troubled by Sadamoto's views.
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CrowLia



Joined: 24 Feb 2012
Posts: 5505
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 12:55 am Reply with quote
VerQuality wrote:
Meongantuk wrote:
Adding to this, Japan actually did compensated some of the victims multiple times through social organizations but never directly. I don't know how much they compensated though, all I know it wasn't continuous support. At least that what happened in my country.

At this point, this whole debacle is not as simple as "Give a heartfelt apology and compensation." especially towards Korea and China.


Yeah, this is a lot more of a political mess than it can seem at first glance. The Japanese government has apologized, multiple times, and there is a sense in Japan that Korea is really milking Japan's (appalling) war-time conduct for easy political points back home, beyond what is reasonable - hence the "propaganda" comment. Meanwhile, in Korea there's the sense that Japan has never fully admitted to its wrongdoing, and there's an element of truth to that as well, as there's a strong contingent of (voting) Japanese who like to downplay the scale of the problem, or deny it happened outright, and an even larger cohort that feels Japan has already done enough. Even worse, these dismissive attitudes are held and spoken by a number of Japanese politicians and officials, who keep throwing fuel onto the fire. At this point, it's become so ingrained in the political cultures of both nations that it's hard to see a resolution to the problem anytime soon.



I think a bigger issue, regardless of whether Japan has paid compensations or made "heartfelt apologies" is the attitude Japan takes regarding remembrance of their war crimes and the pain of their victims. Abe's official position seems to be "we already paid money so you can't ever talk about it again", which is not only disingenuous but also hypocritical. Japanese conservatives want to defend their right to commemorate their war criminals at Yasukuni shrine, but will start yelling when Korean people commemorate the victims of the Japanese empire. Just last year, Osaka and San Francisco broke their "sister cities" relationships because SF wouldn't comply to Osaka's demands to remove a statue of comfort women.

To bring back the comparison to the A-Bombs, Japan's attitude towards this problem would be the same as if the US government demanded that Japanese authorities took down the A-Bomb monuments in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, or that the German government protested the establishment of Holocaust Remembrance museums all over the world. It's not just about owning up to their past crimes or whether you want to make present day Japanese people responsible to them, it's the insistence that this part of history be buried and forgotten.


Of course the fact that other government officials keep retracting on the apologies and the everlasting controversy about Yasukuni Shrine don't help, but I find Japan's absurd and insensitive position of "it's a settled issue so it shouldn't be remembered anymore" to be the most appalling and offensive.
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Cardcaptor Takato



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4824
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:00 am Reply with quote
Even putting aside the historical controversies which Japan should just apologize for already and work to repair their relationship with South Korea,, the shutting down of the event is a clear act of censorship of freedom of expression, and Sadamoto's offensive remarks helped contribute to that censorship, which is a huge letdown for such a once respected figure in the anime industry.
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