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Hal14
Joined: 01 Apr 2018
Posts: 667
Location: Heart of africa
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 Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:22 pm
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DavetheUsher
Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 505
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:23 pm
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| Somer-_- wrote: | | ^ What exactly disqualifies this from canon? Hell why does Pokemon canon even matter? |
Not being 1:1 with the games is what people usually mean when talking about "canon" in Pokemon... so a new professior and anime-original characters who aren't in the games maybe? In which case people should have figured that out around... the first episode where Pikachu was a starter Pokemon unlike in the original games 
I'm just hoping to see some meme fanart with Slam Dunk now with Sakuragi
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Super_M
Joined: 08 May 2018
Posts: 201
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:30 pm
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I don't want start off-topic because this is not right thread, key word is currently, not all life time gross.
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4823
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:54 pm
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| DavetheUsher wrote: |
Not being 1:1 with the games is what people usually mean when talking about "canon" in Pokemon... so a new professior and anime-original characters who aren't in the games maybe? In which case people should have figured that out around... the first episode where Pikachu was a starter Pokemon unlike in the original games
I'm just hoping to see some meme fanart with Slam Dunk now with Sakuragi |
This is why I think this will be a filler in arc that will set up the Sword & Shield anime and would explain why it's just being called Pokemon if it's not going to be bound by the games as it's source material.
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kotomikun
Joined: 06 May 2013
Posts: 1205
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 4:59 pm
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| Psajdak wrote: | | For some reason some people still don't know that Satoshi, Pikachu, and Team Rocket are insanely much more iconic, and popular than anything else Pokemon related, including games which started it all. |
Maybe... Numbers on that Wikipedia page have the vast majority of the Poke-profits--$64 billion!--coming from merchandise, and a large portion of that is probably Pikachus, so that checks out. Not a lot of merch of human characters, though, it's mostly critters. The video games and card games raked in $17 and $10 billion, with all the movies, manga, and TV show put together making up "only" about $4 billion. Seems like the games are still the main attraction, though the entire franchise is effectively just an ad for toys and plushies...
If they aren't going to get rid of Ash, I feel like they could have at least made the partner protagonist something other than a hyper-ambitious ten-year-old boy. Seems a bit redundant. But maybe his slightly tanned shin tone counts as representation?
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DRosencraft
Joined: 27 Apr 2010
Posts: 665
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:48 pm
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This is looking fairly interesting as a concept. I haven't kept very close tabs on the series since before Black and White, but who knows if I might be able to fit this one in.
To (hopefully) complete the earlier Disney analogy, having a Pokemon series without Ash at this point would be like having a Mickey Mouse cartoon without Mickey Mouse. Yes, Disney has other IPs that make them lots of money. But, those are, for the most part, unrelated to Mickey Mouse. The same with Captain America or Iron Man and the Avengers. In other words, Poekmon isn't Disney, Pokemon is Mickey Mouse. Pokemon is Iron Man. Nintendo/GameFreak would be the Disney counterpart. Comparing Pokemon to Disney is making the wrong comparison.
I think the "we need a new protagonist" murmur came from frankly older generation of fans who have been following the series from its early inception. And I honestly believe that, like increasingly much of the younger generations, they are relatively quick to want to move on from anything that's "been done before" or can come off as being "tradition."
If the Pokemon anime doesn't appeal to you anymore, that's fine, because it really isn't supposed to after a certain age. I don't think the anime has ever really made an attempt to appeal to a different age group, which is perfectly fine for it to do. Older fans may grow out of it, but they're not looking to retain older fans at a large clip - but continue that continuity of the franchise and bring in new youngsters. To ditch Ash for a new protag now would be a massive gamble on the idea that a) enough older fans would stick around beyond the "fresh" first few months of the novelty of a new protag, and b) new potential fans will gravitate towards and embrace whatever new main protag they bring in.
This isn't like Gundam where they can constantly churn out new series with different worlds and protags, and even Gundam has the baggage of being unable to leave behind UC and feeling forced to make Char clones all the time. Would folks still watch Detective Conan if you got rid of Conan and started following some new character even though you're still set in the same world and everything? Is it still Dragonball if we aren't following Goku training to beat some new enemy with a half dozen different forms? In the end there are just some series that don't work if you try to push in a new protagonist. Pokemon's just one of them.
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MajinAkuma
Joined: 15 Aug 2014
Posts: 1199
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:27 pm
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| Psajdak wrote: | | Kuchiba City - Vermilion City.
It would be cool to see Matis (Lt. Surge) again, I loved that Gym Leader in original anime.
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He was voiced by Tachiki Fumihiko back then. Yes, I would like to see him again.
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Hal14
Joined: 01 Apr 2018
Posts: 667
Location: Heart of africa
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:28 pm
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| DRosencraft wrote: | | Is it still Dragonball if we aren't following Goku training to beat some new enemy with a half dozen different forms? In the end there are just some series that don't work if you try to push in a new protagonist. Pokemon's just one of them. |
It's funny you bring up Dragon ball since during the cell games arc it looked like gohan would replace goku as the series protagonist. But the next arc came along and goku was back as the main character.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2386
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:42 pm
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| Cardcaptor Takato wrote: | | I'm not sure where the rumor they were going to reboot Pokemon even got started from. |
I'm not sure about a full reboot, but speculation that this is AU Satoshi (from the reboot films) has one admittedly major calling card: The logo is blue, which has only been used exclusively for the anime in the reboot films. The series' logo has always, always been green. Even with all the information we have now, this isn't out as a possibility yet. We simply don't have enough information to make a definitive conclusion yet.
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DavetheUsher
Joined: 19 May 2014
Posts: 505
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:54 pm
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People always say other shows change protagonists so Pocket Monsters should, but I mean, look at those other shows that did. Digimon hasn't had a proper TV anime in forever due to dwindling interest and it's only pumping out nostalgia movies these days.
First Tri, now Last Evolution is going right back to the Adventures cast because the later series didn't do too well.
Even Yu-Gi-Oh is slipping. The last series that performed well was Zexal. ARC-V and Vrains have been pretty middling and they're even taking a break before the next Yu-Gi-Oh series airs which is not a good sign. Although I'd say that's more because of how bad ARC-V and Vrains ended up being. Fans loved GX, 5Ds, and Zexals, but ever since Synchro Arc in ARC-V the franchise took a heavy hit. #BringBackKuwahara
Inaho pretty much killed Yokai Watch. Nobody liked her. So much so she got retconned to never exist ever again later on and Keito is riding solo again
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4823
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 7:24 pm
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| Juno016 wrote: | |
I'm not sure about a full reboot, but speculation that this is AU Satoshi (from the reboot films) has one admittedly major calling card: The logo is blue, which has only been used exclusively for the anime in the reboot films. The series' logo has always, always been green. Even with all the information we have now, this isn't out as a possibility yet. We simply don't have enough information to make a definitive conclusion yet. |
It seems like grasping at straws if the fandom is basing the rumors solely on the logo rather than official statements from the anime producers. And fans were definitely claiming before the Sun & Moon league that Ash was going to be booted out of the show so it seems like a moving of the goalposts if they're now saying it's going to be movie AU Ash. But in all honesty Ash has already had several "soft reboots" as a character already.
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Marimo0
Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Posts: 186
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 7:30 pm
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| Cardcaptor Takato wrote: |
| DavetheUsher wrote: |
Not being 1:1 with the games is what people usually mean when talking about "canon" in Pokemon... so a new professior and anime-original characters who aren't in the games maybe? In which case people should have figured that out around... the first episode where Pikachu was a starter Pokemon unlike in the original games
I'm just hoping to see some meme fanart with Slam Dunk now with Sakuragi |
This is why I think this will be a filler in arc that will set up the Sword & Shield anime and would explain why it's just being called Pokemon if it's not going to be bound by the games as it's source material. |
They do filler arcs during the months before a new game comes out, like the Orange Islands, the Battle Frontier, and the Decolore Islands, and have an anime that ties into it start at around the same time for maximum synergy. It's likely that if they do try and adapt things specifically from the Sword and Shield games, they'll come up later as part of this anime series, like how in the Sun and Moon anime it starts just focusing on Ash attending the Pokemon school in Alola, but gradually we get things like the Aether Foundation, Ultra Beasts, and the Alola League within the same series.
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Psajdak
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Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 9:16 pm
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| kotomikun wrote: |
| Psajdak wrote: | | For some reason some people still don't know that Satoshi, Pikachu, and Team Rocket are insanely much more iconic, and popular than anything else Pokemon related, including games which started it all. |
Maybe... Numbers on that Wikipedia page have the vast majority of the Poke-profits--$64 billion!--coming from merchandise, and a large portion of that is probably Pikachus, so that checks out. Not a lot of merch of human characters, though, it's mostly critters. The video games and card games raked in $17 and $10 billion, with all the movies, manga, and TV show put together making up "only" about $4 billion. Seems like the games are still the main attraction, though the entire franchise is effectively just an ad for toys and plushies...
If they aren't going to get rid of Ash, I feel like they could have at least made the partner protagonist something other than a hyper-ambitious ten-year-old boy. Seems a bit redundant. But maybe his slightly tanned shin tone counts as representation? |
I was really just talking about Satoshi, Pikachu, and Team Rocket simply being as recognizable in Japan as Doraemon, Sazae, Goku, Usagi Tsukino, or Gundam.
Japan's appreciation towards traditional shouldn't be underestimated.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2386
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Posted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:54 am
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| Cardcaptor Takato wrote: | | It seems like grasping at straws if the fandom is basing the rumors solely on the logo rather than official statements from the anime producers. And fans were definitely claiming before the Sun & Moon league that Ash was going to be booted out of the show so it seems like a moving of the goalposts if they're now saying it's going to be movie AU Ash. But in all honesty Ash has already had several "soft reboots" as a character already. |
"...grasping at straws if the fandom is basing the rumors solely on the logo..."
Erm, it's probably more convincing to see the comparison yourself:
https://media.pocketmonsters.net/imageboard/77/15697676080017.jpg
I don't like speaking in absolutes and there is a small handful of potential reasons why the logo might match the reboot films and nothing else (present-future branding consistency, they like how it looks, etc.), but "it's part of the reboot film saga" is probably not the greatest leap in logic here.
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