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EP. REVIEW: Ascendance of a Bookworm [2019-10-26]


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HannoX



Joined: 30 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:39 pm Reply with quote
thedarkemissary wrote:
, by this point, I had expected Myne to make progress towards the first printing press and Cheesecake factory, not saving orphans from the tyranny of the church and state.


She can't do it all at once. It's a step by step process and there are a number of steps she has to take before she can get to a printing press. Look at all the trouble she had just getting to the point of making inexpensive paper. And she needs capitol, lots of capitol to get a printing business underway and no one is going to give it to her since they can't even conceive of mass producing books. So she has to raise the money basically on her own with her inventions. spoiler[The orphans will form her printing workshop, and she needed to get that labor somewhere, so saving them ended up being a step to her goal.]

As for the Church, we know the high priest (high bishop in the LNs) hates her and you can be sure he'd do whatever he could to harm her. So she needs an ally in the Church to protect her. Ferdinand is mostly on her side, but he's not going to do it unless he decides she's worth it.
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Minos_Kurumada



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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 4:57 pm Reply with quote
thedarkemissary wrote:
Anyone else feel like this show has veered wildly off course? It used to be a fun slice of life about quirky Myne and her quest for literature, accompanied by friends and family.

But, since season 2, it feels more like a drama about Saint Myne and her army of followers leading a reform of the social economic culture.

Don't get me wrong. S1 had some deeper emotional stuff but, by this point, I had expected Myne to make progress towards the first printing press and Cheesecake factory, not saving orphans from the tyranny of the church and state.


The show begins with a flash forward, we already know what will happen.
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Kami-koto



Joined: 14 Feb 2019
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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 6:39 pm Reply with quote
thedarkemissary wrote:
Anyone else feel like this show has veered wildly off course? It used to be a fun slice of life about quirky Myne and her quest for literature, accompanied by friends and family.

But, since season 2, it feels more like a drama about Saint Myne and her army of followers leading a reform of the social economic culture.

Don't get me wrong. S1 had some deeper emotional stuff but, by this point, I had expected Myne to make progress towards the first printing press and Cheesecake factory, not saving orphans from the tyranny of the church and state.

Drama will always be a part of Bookworm, even more so in later parts. The problem with S2 is that it's focussing only on the drama, leaving out most of the fun and lighthearted stuff (e.g. Myne creating the tablet and the flash cards or Myne teaching the new cooks modern recipes). There's just not enough episodes to show both.
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TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2020 10:28 pm Reply with quote
Sadly you are right, they cut a lot out of the light novels. Though some fans will probably be happy about the turn to drama. Each to their own.
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Lord Vaultman



Joined: 03 Mar 2017
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 9:52 pm Reply with quote
Can someone maybe explain in better details how maybe got the ink thing to work exactly I get the shaped pieces she had an expert create. But they never showed the shapes on the board before applying the ink especially for the complicated church drawing.
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Hiroki not Takuya



Joined: 17 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 11:21 pm Reply with quote
Glad to, my dad was a printer and I helped! Ascendance is following the historical evolution of ink and what later became "offset printing". For the ink, soot is a mixture of mostly carbon, distillates of tree sap and in the case of cooking chimneys, various fats and oils partially oxidized or just condensed from the vapor (called "creosote"). The carbon imparts the black color but the other chemicals being generally minority constituents aren't present in enough quantity to make something semi-liquid. The trick is to solvate the sometimes powdery or chunky soot/creosote in an oil until the ratio is high enough to make a liquid thin enough to apply and "sticky" enough to stick to the paper and not run or "bleed".

The next trick is to get the ink to stick to the image-bearing surface only in areas that you want to have as black lines so when you gently press the paper down on the ink-coated surface, the ink sticks to the paper only in those areas. What they show is the process for making a "woodcut" which is taking a flat smooth plank of dense-grain wood and cutting into the surface between the lines in a drawn image to make raised lines that will contact the paper but with deep grooves or areas on either side that hold some of the ink away from contacting the paper.

When cut right and after being coated with the semi-runny ink, the ink on the raised surfaces will contact the paper and transfer to it. However, as they show, if the ink is not runny enough or if the grooves aren't deep enough or you apply too much ink and partially fill the grooves or if the pattern is too dense, the ink will contact the paper other than where intended and you get the big black mess that they show. This is why very old books made by woodcut had to use "coarse" patterns and simple drawings to increase the space between the lines. Also, I love the detail that images drawn on the wood as one would do on paper creates a mirror-image, so to make it appear as if drawn on the paper and text to "read right", one has to draw the images and text as a mirror reflection. Needless to say, there was much artistry and skill in printing this way and while faster to duplicate images than by hand, it wasn't what people would call fast.

Enter Herr Gutenberg who realized that letters as shapes didn't change so if one made partially interchangeable pieces that had the raised shapes of single alphabet letters and hold them on a flat plate so they wouldn't move when you pressed the paper onto them, one wouldn't have to repeatedly carve the letters in single large wood planks. If one wanted an image, one could make small ones the old way on a block that would fit in the holder. Making a page of text was as simple as lining up the blocks in the holder to spell out words (in reverse letter order of course), with shorter blocks that wouldn't touch the paper in between to make spaces. Gutenberg also pioneered using a lead alloy to make the letters from instead of wood so that one only had to make molds for the individual letter pieces and one could pour-cast the metal to make letters by the score. He also experimented with ink formulation that would stick better to the lead.

Sorry this was so long but there it is. To Mr. Martin's last musing, it will indeed be interesting to see what Ferdinand does when confronted with the knowledge that there are other worlds and something called "reincarnation" that the Church knows nothing of. Or better yet, that some of their "gods" may be people like Myne, Great show...


Last edited by Hiroki not Takuya on Tue May 26, 2020 12:04 am; edited 2 times in total
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2020 12:01 am Reply with quote
Quote:
I am getting increasingly curious to see how Ferdinand will react when (if?) he learns the truth.

As am I, but there's no "if" about it. Isn't all of this what he's learning from the magic headband from the first episode, including her narration?

It was really nice to see everyone from the orphans and Lutz to Turi and Wilma all thoroughly enjoying the process for once, instead of just looking at her like she's crazy but shrugging and going along with it.

But yay! Main has acquired "Book"! And a lovely one it is.
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Gina Szanboti



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:04 pm Reply with quote
It was interesting comparing the Dewey system to the Nippon version. Some are the same, some have been rearranged for no apparent reason, and there's no religion category at all (I wonder what books dealing with religions are categorized under? Philosophy? Literature? Social science?).

Dewey:
000 General, computer sci, information
100 Philosophy & psychology
200 Religion
300 Social sciences
400 Language
500 Pure science
600 Technology
700 Arts & recreation
800 Literature
900 History & geography

Nippon:
000 General
100 Philosophy
200 History
300 Social sciences
400 Natural science
500 Technology & engineering
600 Industry & commerce
700 Arts
800 Language
900 Literature

Tech/engineering and Industry/commerce seem like the same things to me, in a general classification sense. But I'm not sure where Dewey would put commerce books. I know we have some librarians among us, so if they're in this thread, maybe they can shed some light.

This sure was a tour de force episode for Main faces. Very Happy
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Spastic Minnow
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 2:24 pm Reply with quote
^^^^^
I'm Looking a bit more closely at the subdivisions in the Nippon Classification system.

Religion, as I think is natural, is fitted into Philosophy. Also all of the books in a CHURCH library would be between 160-199 and most likely Myne would have to GREATLY specialize it. When I headed a library that contained information on international education, mostly course catalogs, we used the Dewey system but we had to expand it immensely to fit all the countries into the usually narrow 900's sections they'd normally be put. And because our company had so many students from India use our service, India had to be separated into provinces.
I'm now in a library that houses one of the most specialized collections on Entomology in the country and although we use the highly adaptable Library of Congress system, when the library was organized in the 1960's the LoC did not have enough subdivisions for all of the classifications of insects. So the librarians here had to make their own.
...Now there's a slight problem with our library in that the LoC has since made the expansion to include the subdivisions they didn't use to have, but put them in a very different spot, and our old beetle books are all in the wrong area of the official LoC.

but back to another interesting section.

Psychology...
In Dewey, HALF of the 100's-where Nippon puts religion, is dedicated to psychology. BUT.
Have you ever noticed how little Japanese culture seems to think about psychology?
Well... in the Nippon system. the entirety of Psychology is placed in between 140-149.
In the Nippon system all that space saved by not having twice the room for religion and barely any space for psychology means that it was able to spread out what Dewey puts in "technology"/600- into 500 AND 600.
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ThrowMeOut



Joined: 10 Oct 2018
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 3:12 pm Reply with quote
This episode looked way nicer than usual. As much as I love Bookworm I'm used to the show looking like mush so it was kind of nice.
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HannoX



Joined: 30 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:26 pm Reply with quote
The introduction of the Knights Order means spoiler[we'll get some action and we'll also get a better idea of just where Ferdinand fits into noble society in general.]
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Catseyetiger



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:34 pm Reply with quote
OMG I read plenty of books, putting that knowledge into effect without a reference book would be. I may know what I read coding and such but would need the parts! The OS! Knowing how solar cells work and putting it back in practice without the manufacturing is pointless! So you have all past knowledge everything you read putting into reality is a whole new concept! This is why we have People who specialize in fields! Without the full manufacturing and support of a fully aware team someone who reads simply could not complete or rebuild it alone! Fact!
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Hiroki not Takuya



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 9:24 am Reply with quote
In case you didn't see this, the Knight Order was in the trailer for S2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BQs59MW7tA
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Spastic Minnow
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 8:28 pm Reply with quote
Catseyetiger wrote:
OMG I read plenty of books, putting that knowledge into effect without a reference book would be. I may know what I read coding and such but would need the parts! The OS! Knowing how solar cells work and putting it back in practice without the manufacturing is pointless! So you have all past knowledge everything you read putting into reality is a whole new concept! This is why we have People who specialize in fields! Without the full manufacturing and support of a fully aware team someone who reads simply could not complete or rebuild it alone! Fact!


Had to look back to make sure I wasn't remembering it wrong.
episode 1
"My mother had been just as happy as I was when I landed my librarian job"

The way things have gone since I guess I was mistaken in thinking she was already a librarian but it looks like she was at least about to start. She wasn't just a bookworm, she was studying specifically to be a librarian.

When I compared the systems above I also looked a little into Librarian accreditation in Japan. It's not as tough in Japan as it is in the U.S. to become a regular public librarian and almost an "ask and you got it" situation to be a school librarian. There is not a specific university degree let alone a five year Masters (except for specialization). But she was specifically studying to be one- it was her desire in life. She was also extremely well-read in universal subjects, meaning she was not just a regular bookworm but a person familiar with every section of one. It is not such a feat to remember at least the 10 broad categories in this case. I could tell you the areas of every section of my library, granted, I have always specialized. So I can't tell you the sections of every dewey or LoC classification... but if you want bug books... QL 391 is Nematology, QL 453 is all about mites, QL 461 is general entomology, 527- Hymenoptera, 533- Lepidoptera... and so on.
You know your library.
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Gray Lensman



Joined: 17 Mar 2019
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 8:51 pm Reply with quote
Spastic Minnow wrote:
Catseyetiger wrote:
OMG I read plenty of books, putting that knowledge into effect without a reference book would be. I may know what I read coding and such but would need the parts! The OS! Knowing how solar cells work and putting it back in practice without the manufacturing is pointless! So you have all past knowledge everything you read putting into reality is a whole new concept! This is why we have People who specialize in fields! Without the full manufacturing and support of a fully aware team someone who reads simply could not complete or rebuild it alone! Fact!


Had to look back to make sure I wasn't remembering it wrong.
episode 1
"My mother had been just as happy as I was when I landed my librarian job"

The way things have gone since I guess I was mistaken in thinking she was already a librarian but it looks like she was at least about to start. She wasn't just a bookworm, she was studying specifically to be a librarian.

When I compared the systems above I also looked a little into Librarian accreditation in Japan. It's not as tough in Japan as it is in the U.S. to become a regular public librarian and almost an "ask and you got it" situation to be a school librarian. There is not a specific university degree let alone a five year Masters (except for specialization). But she was specifically studying to be one- it was her desire in life. She was also extremely well-read in universal subjects, meaning she was not just a regular bookworm but a person familiar with every section of one. It is not such a feat to remember at least the 10 broad categories in this case. I could tell you the areas of every section of my library, granted, I have always specialized. So I can't tell you the sections of every dewey or LoC classification... but if you want bug books... QL 391 is Nematology, QL 453 is all about mites, QL 461 is general entomology, 527- Hymenoptera, 533- Lepidoptera... and so on.
You know your library.


Plus the majority of all the other stuff she has been doing is just applying arts and crafts (which she has some background in as well IIRC) - the stuff she really only has theoretical knowledge about has involved some level of trial and error in order to get right - often a great deal of it. The basics of woodblock printing is easy, but she didn't think about simplifying the art until after the first attempt. It also won't be a huge jump from that to a printing press. While woodblock printing (of cloth, anyways) dates back to at least the third century in China, it didn't reach Europe until around the year 1400 - and Gutenberg was using his movable type by 1450. If 50 years is enough to come up with the idea mostly from scratch, it will likely be faster for someone who knows the destination. She isn't coming across as Senku here.

That isn't getting into the fact that China was using ceramic and wooden movable type before wood blocks were being used in Europe, although the much, much smaller number of characters in the Latin alphabet made it much more efficient. I'm not sure what the written word looks like in this fictional world as I'm reading the subtitles instead of focusing on stuff I can't read anyways in her books.

Basically, most of what she is doing seems reasonably believable from my perspective. But I don't typically go nitpicking for plot holes, I only care when they are staring me in the face.
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