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EP. REVIEW: Sword Art Online: Alicization - War of Underworld


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Hiroki not Takuya



Joined: 17 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:47 pm Reply with quote
^ Our posts crossed, but having caught up has filled in some things. I admit "dumb things happening because reasons..." does not a plot hole make.
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Kisuke525



Joined: 05 Nov 2019
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:16 am Reply with quote
Hiroki not Takuya wrote:
^Well, after talking to an aspiring writer, it seems most of what I have been considering plot holes may be symptoms of writing problems. I also got caught up on the season, which explained a few things.

Why they use amateur tactics or exhibit little in-depth planning I think a plot hole but it can be attributed as a writing problem. Also, since the "caves" through the mountains are seeming very far away from Human settlements, you would think the Dark Forces would/could have been quietly sneaking in and setting up in the forest. Lady Fanatio seems not to have problems being known as a woman now but as always "because:Kirito!". Again, writing (seriously, all women love Kirito ,must be Kawahara's self-insert). Maybe there aren't true plot holes?


I think the dark territory is actually doing pretty decent tactics wise when you consider a few things. Like Key said, the forces of the dark territory have no choice but to listen to Gabriel and he is kinda half assing the whole thing since his goal is Alice and not the human empire. And to be honest I dont completely blame him for doing things half ass. The dark territory has 50,000 troops while the human empire only has 3000 so I can understand him being cocky and pretty much leaving it to the commander of each race. And to be fair the smoke bomb strategy was pretty decent imo. The only reason that went bad was because integrity knights are just to damn strong. As for the plan D.I.L came up with if it would have succeeded the dark territory would have already won. It wasn't really explained in detail in the anime, but other than the part of plan that consisted of using up all the spatial resources in the area D.I.L was also having scouts find the exact position of the integrity knights so that when the art was fired it would be carried through path ways made up of wind arts that would send the attack directly to the integrity knights. The attack would have killed most, if not all of the integrity knights, but Alice beat them to it.

And im guessing the Lady Fanatio part of your post is a joke right lol? But just incase its not I will say that Fanatio doesn't love Kirito she loves Bercouli. Fanatio was just messing with Alice since they don't get along super well. And if Kirito is Kawahara's self insert I feel kinda bad for him because Kirito thinks pretty poorly of himself.
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Hiroki not Takuya



Joined: 17 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:53 am Reply with quote
^ Like I said, my earlier comments were based on a few things from the first season that it seems Reki was careful to explicitly negate. I'd say the smoke bombs were the best and most realistic tactic used and the mages was close behind. My main complaint about tactics is concentrating forces in a small area with only one outlet, but between Gabriel not commanding well and not preparing and everyone else seemingly having no battle experience, that is "excusable".

It seemed to me that Lady Fanatio was speaking quite affectionately when referring to Kirito, going so far as to say that she wanted to use her feminine "charms" on him to "wake him up". If not love, then strong attraction. And as far as Kirito's "poor self-image", that is not supported by his passion and self-confidence. It seems to me that Kirito has all the earmarks of an adolescent male ego-boosting (self-insert) character, the most powerful and capable among his peers, sought-after by women, generally regarded with respect if not awe by everyone, the center of attention and action. As when Bercouli says he thinks somehow Kirito will determine the whole course of this epic world-changing battle (just by being there??). I'd say the writer thinks very highly of him, and thereby himself.
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Key
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:16 am Reply with quote
^
Kirito's poor self-image does not comes through in the anime, but it is much more evident in the Progressive novels. There he regards himself as being a capable gamer but nothing beyond that. (He repeatedly insists that Asuna, not him, is the one who could bring people together and lead everyone to beating the game and is socially awkward with other players.) That's where Kirito being a self-insert for Kawahara becomes more evident.

As for Fanatio, she is grateful to Kirito but not romantically inclined towards him; she's into Bercouli instead. (Remember, she was conflicting with Alice over him, not Kirito.) She may have said what she did about Kirito just to rile up Alice, whom she doesn't seem to get along with very well even though she recognizes and respects her as an ally.
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Kisuke525



Joined: 05 Nov 2019
Posts: 84
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:48 pm Reply with quote
^
This post above me pretty much nails it. Kirito really doesn't come across properly in the anime. When I was talking about him I meant novel Kirito I should have made myself more clear in my previous post that was my bad.

As for the new episode it was pretty solid. It cut some stuff as usual "which will always annoy me", but overall it was a good episode. I am a bit disappointed about the violence being toned down but in some places it's understandable. The scene with D.I.L and the 2 dark arts users at the end was pretty damn horrific in the novel.
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Vaisaga



Joined: 07 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:54 pm Reply with quote
I'll give Eldrie props for going out in a blaze of glory (with help from ghost Eugeo apparently). So much so that I just pulled him in Rising Steel and I ain't even mad.
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Hiroki not Takuya



Joined: 17 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 08, 2019 11:47 am Reply with quote
Sheyta- You are remarkably hard...
(Champion removes her armor)
Champion- Seriously, she's really getting me fired up...
Smile
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Gina Szanboti



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:23 am Reply with quote
Ah, Champion, if only we had met in another anime, you might've been a hero.
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Kisuke525



Joined: 05 Nov 2019
Posts: 84
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 5:30 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
Hiroki not Takuya wrote:
Why they use almost no tactics or exhibit any in-depth planning I think a plot hole but it can be attributed as a writing problem. Also, since the "caves" through the mountains are seeming very far away from Human settlements, you would think the Dark Forces would/could have been quietly sneaking in and setting up in the forest. Another was how Lady Fanatio seems not to have problems being known as a woman now. But again, writing. Maybe there aren't true plot holes?

Actually, none of these are plot holes at all. They Dark Realm forces are using almost no tactics because their boss, Vecta, isn't bothering to; remember, he doesn't give a damn if the invasion succeeds or not, as long at it provides an avenue for him to find Alice. They can't disobey him, either, because of the "might makes right" principle that's as intractable on the Dark Realm sides as the Axiom Church's rules were on the human realm side. (I'm not sure how clear the anime is making that to people who haven't read the novels, but that is clearly spelled out in the novels.)

Concerning the tunnels, the Dark Realm forces have tried to infiltrate that way; remember the attack on Rulid earlier this season, or the goblins way back in episode 1 of the first half? They don't succeed because of regular Integrity Knight patrols. (This has been alluded to a few times in the anime.) Going over the mountains is too difficult, and tunneling through the mountains probably hasn't happened for the same reason that the East Gate stood inviolable for so long: it wasn't allowed to be broken through.

Concerning Fanatio, she already explained that: Kirito convinced her during their fight back in the first half.

Now, I'm not saying that there aren't plot holes here; the one that is IMO the biggest one will come up a few episodes down the road, unless the anime version comes up with a more plausible explanation for how it's supposed to happen. But these aren't among them.


Sorry for replying to this old post but I was curious about something. You say that there's a plot hole coming up but I don't really know what you're referring to. Do you mind replying to me and covering it with a spoiler or PMing me what it is?
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Key
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:33 pm Reply with quote
Kisuke525 wrote:
Sorry for replying to this old post but I was curious about something. You say that there's a plot hole coming up but I don't really know what you're referring to. Do you mind replying to me and covering it with a spoiler or PMing me what it is?

Significant novel 17 spoiler: spoiler[maybe "plot hole" isn't the exact right term for it, but I'm referring to the seemingly way-too-simple way Higa comes up with to fix Kirito.]
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Vaisaga



Joined: 07 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:02 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
including Sortilena, who suddenly pops up again after not having been around since episode 9 of the first half of the arc.


She's actually been in the background of a few shots since the war started.

Anyways, I couldn't care less about Kirito's harem sleepover. The whole time I was just imagining Tiese alone in her tent crying herself to sleep Sad
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Kisuke525



Joined: 05 Nov 2019
Posts: 84
PostPosted: Sun Dec 22, 2019 6:24 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
Kisuke525 wrote:
Sorry for replying to this old post but I was curious about something. You say that there's a plot hole coming up but I don't really know what you're referring to. Do you mind replying to me and covering it with a spoiler or PMing me what it is?

Significant novel 17 spoiler: spoiler[maybe "plot hole" isn't the exact right term for it, but I'm referring to the seemingly way-too-simple way Higa comes up with to fix Kirito.]


Sorry for taking so long to reply to the post.spoiler[ I can't say I agree with you on that. All 3 of the main girls need to be in the Underworld at the same time, Kirito needs to stay alive in the Underworld until the procedure is done, Higa pretty much has to gamble his life to get it done, and on top of all that it needs to be done before the Underworld is shut down. So I don't really think it's "way-too-simple" I actually considered it kinda difficult. When I first read this arc I actually thought Kirito was gonna be a lot easier to fix but maybe that was just me.]
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Niyari



Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 304
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:15 pm Reply with quote
Not gonna bother putting spoilers since if you're watching Alicization, there's a 99% chance you've seen Ordinal Scale. I'm almost certain the pair at the end are Eiji and Yuna. How? I have no idea.
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DerekL1963
Enjoying the time of EVEEnjoying the time of EVE


Joined: 14 Jan 2015
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2019 3:58 pm Reply with quote
A smirk at the prospect of pain and death - and a smol girl in pink? I'm thinking Pitohui and Llenn. Or at least I'd like it to be them.

spoiler[But the folks on Reddit are pointing towards a pair of short stories published on the Japanese BD of Ordinal Scale that makes them think it's Eiji and diva-Yuuna]
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Key
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:59 pm Reply with quote
DerekL1963 wrote:
spoiler[But the folks on Reddit are pointing towards a pair of short stories published on the Japanese BD of Ordinal Scale that makes them think it's Eiji and diva-Yuuna]

I could maybe see the former, but in the latter case I'd want some explanation for how that could happen. spoiler[That Yuuna was toast at the end of the movie.]
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