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INTEREST: My Hero Academia Manga, Anime Removed from Chinese Digital Platforms


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Engineering Nerd



Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 898
Location: Southern California
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:09 pm Reply with quote
k_dawg_3484 wrote:
The Communist leaders of China doing what they do best: getting butthurt and censoring.

This is nothing. Earlier in the year, they cancelled the NBA in China because one of the general managers of one of the teams retweeted a post in support of Hong Kong. Yeah, a multibillion dollar decision based off a retweet. The NBA, amazingly, didn't bow even though they lost a lot of money. And that was the right move.

Of course, during that crazy fiasco, the Chinese government sent all their apparatchiks around the internet trying to drum up controversy and support for firing said GM, and I'm sure they'll be doing the exact same thing here. So, beware any particularly pro-China opinions from new accounts or people that don't have a lot of posts.


You seem to forgot that this is the decision made by licensors themselves after their social accounts being bombarded with threats, controversies, endless loop of arguments, personal attacks, they just have to decide end it for good, after realizing the public opinion of this franchise have gone downhill.

You will be surprised that lots of anime bans (Vast majority of them are unjustified however)in China originated from fanbase themselves. Some got removed not because of the blacklist ( AOT and death note share that “honor”), but due to public pressure and outcry from Chinese social media. I mean, licensors are business people after all.

I know that under Western media lens, China is an evil purgatory that does everything wrong, and I do agree some of the reactions. But sometimes you really need to understand why people being so upset, not everything can be written off as “overreaction” or “freedom of expression”, there is a bottom line. If you are not stand up to it, people will keep crossing it like nothing happened.

No one ask a mangaka to be a historian that knows every bit of history, but if he does not know how to properly done a reference and just go “oh since you guys don’t like it I will just change the name in future chapters and manga volumes” as an “apology”, do expect people getting upset, especially over a manga that constantly portrays the importance of heroism and social justice.
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
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Location: IL
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:47 pm Reply with quote
AkumaChef wrote:
Megiddo wrote:
AkumaChef wrote:

This MHA fiasco is a great example. The character in question is the main villian if I understand correctly. If we assume the name of this character was a deliberate reference to Unit 731 then there really is no problem here...naming an evil guy after an evil event makes sense.

You gravely misunderstood.

The author allegedly named the evil guy after the victims of Unit 731. Not Unit 731 itself, but the people who were experimented upon. Unless you're trying to say the victims themselves were evil or whatnot, then that's just beyond the scope of civil argument for me.


I did not misunderstand anything. I'm well aware that the word maruta refers to the victims rather than the Unit itself or one of the people responsible for the atrocities committed there, but I'm not sure how that distinction matters. It's beyond absurd to think that anyone is calling the victims evil; I can't fathom how anyone might think that was even a remote possibility on the author's part. If the name was indeed an intentional reference to Unit 731 it's just a general one for the unit itself. Perhaps the author wanted to reference the unit and maruta was the only word he could think of which both did that and maintained consistency with his naming conventions of using the tree character for quirkless characters, etc.

To use a different example, is there really a distinction between naming a fictional evil character who performs human experiments Zyklon Untermensch as opposed to Zyklon Mengele?

Just to make sure I'm understanding your argument, you don't think there's an issue where an evil character is named after the people who suffered rather than the evil person/people who were the cause of the suffering?

What if you were to name a fictional evil character who wants to commit genocide Mordecai Anielewicz for instance?
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AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 821
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 1:44 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:

Just to make sure I'm understanding your argument, you don't think there's an issue where an evil character is named after the people who suffered rather than the evil person/people who were the cause of the suffering?


I'm not sure I can answer general-case question like that. Specifics matter a great deal. "maruta" does not refer to any one person specifically. Mention the word and it conjures up images of Unit 731 in general, which reinforces the idea that the character is evil. The idea that it could somehow be meant as a statement about the victims just doesn't make any sense to me.

Quote:

What if you were to name a fictional evil character who wants to commit genocide Mordecai Anielewicz for instance?

I think that is more likely to offend someone because now you're talking about a specific person, so there is no doubt that there is some kind of statement being made. I'd really have to see the rest of the work to have much more of an opinion though. Naming an evil character after someone who is generally seen as a hero doesn't make any logical sense. I imagine that such a work of fiction would be deliberately absurdist and the protagonist would be named something like Adolf Hitler. It has a Lewis Carrol sort of feel to it, not an offensive one. If such a work was written in a non-absurdist way, so that it seemed obvious that the writer had something against Anielewicz then I'd find that offensive and I'd stop reading it.
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sherryzxt



Joined: 12 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:02 pm Reply with quote
Trying to explain why these kind of things get banned is very difficult due to culture differences.

First of all, there is that collectivist vs individualist culture.

Some people here think it wasn’t a name of a specific victim so there’s no problem. In China, people wouldn’t have cared as much if the name referred to a specific victim because people look at it as a group situation. Not to say they won’t be upset if villain was named after one victim but it would more be because of association that victim has with themselves than outcry for that specific individual.

Many many many fans and series non-fans (anime fans) and people who don’t even watch anime or those who are just trolls and flames for sake of flaming are upset because to them, this is disrespecting the bottom line of their entire identity as Chinese.

They associate both themselves and victims as Chinese and hold that group identity of these victims suffered are ancestors. People in China have strong belief systems based on their ancestors instead of god that it’s similar to a religion. Therefore whenever something like this happen, they feel strong emotions personally and have immediate knee-jerking reactions. Things like this are almost never forgiven by vast majority of Chinese.

If I explain it this way, maybe some people in the west would understand this situation better.

edit: TLDR; if we have to translate that into Western culture, it's like your immediate family was a victim to human experiment then the family member of the murderer of your family made a manga you love and then made a villain that traumatized you of this exact event because creator used your family member's name as the villain, probably something close like this, even then this translation wouldn't actually be accurate or equate to how Chinese felt about this whole situation.


Last edited by sherryzxt on Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:27 pm Reply with quote
sherryzxt wrote:
Trying to explain why these kind of things get banned is very difficult due to culture differences.

First of all, there is that collectivist vs individualist culture.

Some people here think it wasn’t a name of a specific victim so there’s no problem. In China, people wouldn’t have cared as much if the name referred to a specific victim because people look at it as a group situation. Not to say they won’t be upset if villain was named after one victim but it would more be because of association that victim has with themselves than outcry for that specific individual.

Many many many fans and series non-fans (anime fans) and people who don’t even watch anime or those who are just trolls and flames for sake of flaming are upset because to them, this is disrespecting the bottom line of their entire identity as Chinese.

They associate both themselves and victims as Chinese and hold that group identity of these victims suffered are ancestors. People in China have strong belief systems based on their ancestors instead of god that it’s similar to a religion. Therefore whenever something like this happen, they feel strong emotions personally and have immediate knee-jerking reactions. Things like this are almost never forgiven by vast majority of Chinese.

If I explain it this way, maybe some people in the west would understand this situation better.


FANTASTIC post.

I was not aware of the details, but these kinds of cultural differences are exactly what I was alluding to in my discussion with Swissman earlier in this topic:

AkumaChef wrote:
I look at it like this: There are trillions of us on the planet, and we all have different histories, backgrounds, nationalities, and preferences. It is truly impossible to have something that doesn't offend someone out there. Because of that principle we owe it to everyone around us to not meddle in their interests unless we want them to meddle in ours.


I am sure that many people were honestly offended by the name (intentional or otherwise). But is it really necessary to go so far as to resort to death threats, flaming, and things like that? Surely the people who are making those threats must at the same time have been victims of the same sort of behavior directed at things that they enjoy? Do on to others as you would have done to you.....
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Ushio



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 630
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:39 pm Reply with quote
AkaRed wrote:
Scion Drake wrote:
Яeverse wrote:
Horikoshi ruining the jobs of so many people, surprised neither he, his staffers, or editors exercised caution regarding that name. Did no one know?

(Actually I didn't know either. Not a history buff)


Well neither is he since Japan’s schools don’t teach this stuff much so they grow up without realizing the magnitude & what this stuff means to people.

Hopefully this doesn’t affect the series that badly.


And that's a big problem Japan education system and Japan as a whole need to realise what Japan did in the past and start to apologize for their war crime. They want to act as if that never happened and it's not good.

A lot of countries did mistake in their and apologize for their wrong doing. For example Germany is a prime example of what a Nation should do for dealing the issue about their past.

Also unlike Germany, Japan never got a true trial for their war crime and that's a big issue for the victime on the Korean and China side. Japan never truly paid for that because big old Uncle Sam somehow "protected" them.



WW2 ended 75 years ago this year. No one in Japan apart from a handful in there 90's or older is responsible for the actions of those during the war.


Also are you [expletive] joking? The firebombing of Tokyo and other cities, Hiroshima and Nagasaki show Japan paid a price not to mention the occupation.

The Japanese authorities set up a large system of prostitution facilities (Recreation and Amusement Association, or the RAA) in order to protect the population. According to John W. Dower, precisely as the Japanese government had hoped when it created the prostitution facilities, while the RAA was in place "the incidence of rape remained relatively low given the huge size of the occupation force".[52]:130 However, there was a resulting large rise in venereal disease among the soldiers, which led MacArthur to close down the prostitution in early 1946.[53] The incidence of rape increased after the closure of the brothels, possibly eight-fold; Dower states that "According to one calculation the number of rapes and assaults on Japanese women amounted to around 40 daily while the RAA was in operation, and then rose to an average of 330 a day after it was terminated in early 1946."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_Japan#Rape
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SpaceTheGamer



Joined: 17 Dec 2016
Posts: 271
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:02 pm Reply with quote
I really don't get why is China making such a huge deal out of this, there have been several anime characters with Murata as their last name before, hell even KnY had a character whose name was just "Murata" and that was last year but I don't remember anybody making a fuss about that
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Engineering Nerd



Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 898
Location: Southern California
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:30 pm Reply with quote
SpaceTheGamer wrote:
I really don't get why is China making such a huge deal out of this, there have been several anime characters with Murata as their last name before, hell even KnY had a character whose name was just "Murata" and that was last year but I don't remember anybody making a fuss about that



..........Sir, with all due respect, please do read the article carefully before commenting on the thread and you would know the answer of your questions. Thank you

Also, pretty sure you meant Maruta, no?
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SailorNaruto



Joined: 16 Mar 2016
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 8:00 pm Reply with quote
It's China. They've done a lot more for a lot less; that shouldn't be a surprise. But between this and the attention seeking morons on Twitter burning their MHA manga copies (because yeah trashing shit you've already paid for will surely punish Hori), this is blowing up to be bigger than it needs to be. I've said once before that him naming that character that was in poor taste, but I severely doubt there was any malicious intent behind it, nothing to warrant all this
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ZephyrVayu



Joined: 02 Jan 2012
Posts: 79
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 3:30 am Reply with quote
This isn't surprising. China has always been like this, and has banned other properties for weaker reasons. This is not an example of "cancel culture". We only need to worry if it's banned in the west or Japan. Storm in a teacup.
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Tempest
I Run this place.
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Joined: 29 Dec 2001
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:58 am Reply with quote
SpaceTheGamer wrote:
I really don't get why is China making such a huge deal out of this, there have been several anime characters with Murata as their last name before,
I addressed this in this post: animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=5210811#5210811
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Tempest
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:23 am Reply with quote
ZephyrVayu wrote:
This is not an example of "cancel culture". We only need to worry if it's banned in the west or Japan. Storm in a teacup.
I posted about this in a different forum earlier today. It is definitely a form of "cancel culture." It's very different than the "cancel culture" we're familiar with in the west though.

Chinese cancel culture is nationalist in nature, not progressive. Chinese netizens will cancel anything that offends their national pride.

It's been tried by Nationalists in the West, and by Nationalists in Japan, but never gotten much traction. However in China, if you offend national pride, even if the Government doesn't cancel you (they often do), the nationalist netizens will.

-t
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Tempest
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:40 pm Reply with quote
Engineering Nerd wrote:
No one ask a mangaka to be a historian that knows every bit of history, but if he does not know how to properly done a reference and just go “oh since you guys don’t like it I will just change the name in future chapters and manga volumes” as an “apology”, do expect people getting upset, especially over a manga that constantly portrays the importance of heroism and social justice.
Well, that is exactly what he did. Apologized and said the character would be renamed.
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dormcat
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:53 pm Reply with quote
Tempest wrote:
Apologized and said the character would be renamed.

And the new name of the character is, er, well, I'll wait for reactions from Kyushu University and US veterans.
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