Forum - View topic
INTEREST: Mamoru Oshii: "Hideaki Anno is More of a Producer Than a Director These Days"


Goto page Previous  1, 2

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Top Gun



Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 3793
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 3:02 pm Reply with quote
Abraham Omosun wrote:
Can't wait for the eventual final battle of Miyazaki vs Oshii vs Anno vs Tomino as the 4 Oldmen of the Anime Apocalypse (ANIPOCALYPSE? ANIMECALYPSE?) battle it out for supremacy Laughing Laughing

Get Imaishi to direct it and I am so there. Very Happy

Man I don't even know how to unpack this. "Weird auteur creator makes thinly-veiled criticism of another weird auteur creator while simultaneously praising grumpy older creator and dissing the younger creators who have largely supplanted him"...does that about sum it up?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SpacemanHardy



Joined: 03 Jan 2012
Posts: 2474
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 4:48 pm Reply with quote
Top Gun wrote:


Man I don't even know how to unpack this. "Weird auteur creator makes thinly-veiled criticism of another weird auteur creator while simultaneously praising grumpy older creator and dissing the younger creators who have largely supplanted him"...does that about sum it up?


He's just grumpy that nobody remembers Sky Crawlers anymore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
Jayhosh



Joined: 24 May 2013
Posts: 968
Location: Millmont, Pennsylvania
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 5:51 pm Reply with quote
This sounds like it might be a case of something lost in translation. I concur with an earlier user who suggested that his intended point was probably moreso regarding how him and Miyazaki and other directors from his era placed a much more prominent focus on the thematics structuring their films; as in, they “picked a fight with society” through their films by calling out its ills with scathing critiques veiled through sci-fi and fantasy premises and settings. Whereas contemporary directors’ films tend to be incidentally thematic without much of pointed value to say regarding the current state of our world.

However, even if that was the intended message by Oshii, I still think it’s a pretty baffling thing to say. I mean, Anno’s Shin Godzilla is literally a straight up brutal evisceration of the Japanese bureaucracy with its political opinions left in no uncertain terms regarding its response to the 2011 earthquake/tsunami. As someone else has already mentioned, Your Name deals in the erasure of tradition and culture with industrialization. And almost all of Hosoda’s films tackle a different theme of the concept of family, whether that be accepting a new member, creating one with those who aren’t blood relatives, or learning to be a parent and the selflessness that must come with it. I think all of the referenced creators have shown that they incorporate relevant social themes into their works. Maybe they aren’t delivered as cryptically as something like Angel’s Egg (lol) but they’re certainly present and. Large part of what seems to drive these individuals.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Suxinn



Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 123
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 7:32 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
In his own case, he creates films so that he can "pick a fight with society," and he believes that Miyazaki does the same even if he claims to create films for children to enjoy.

Oh, come on, Oshii, it doesn't have to be either/or! I do agree that Miyazaki (at least as he is now) seems to keep coming back to film in order to "pick a fight". (I mean, he literally said that one of his motivations for his most recent return was to prove that traditional animation was still better than 3D.) But I also think that Miyazaki is constantly, constantly thinking about his audience, and making films that his audience (children) can enjoy. If you watch any of the documentaries showcasing how Miyazaki works, you can see how focused he is on replicating the sense of wonder and imagination that children see in their everyday lives. Like, Miyazaki always has things to say about society at large in his film, of course, but he's first and foremost a filmmaker for children. And I think that's important to remember because so much of children's animation is treated as if it can't be as thematically rich as "adult" animation, when it absolutely can, as Miyazaki shows time and again.

(And I'm saying all of this while not actually being a fan of most of Miyazaki's actual work, though I definitely respect him as a filmmaker.)

Also, as much as I love Hosoda, I can kind of see where Oshii is coming from about his and Shinkai's works being more like "I-novels". Because as creators they do tend to have pet themes that they just keep returning to with each subsequent film, which is not necessarily a bad thing, as Oshii himself mentions. (I once heard a del Toro fan talk about how he thinks del Toro basically makes the same really good film over and over, and that really stuck with me -- because if you like someone's style, would you mind if they made the same film over and over?) I wouldn't have necessarily phrased it like Oshii did, though, because they do technically have themes.

No comment on Anno because I actually have never watched anything he directed to completion, wonder of wonders. I should get to watching Evangelion one of these days...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
BlueAlf



Joined: 02 Jan 2017
Posts: 1001
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 7:35 pm Reply with quote
I agree there might be something lost in translation as well. From what's described, I'm not sure if 'theme' is the correct choice of words.

I think I sorta get where he's coming from though. It's more like the older generation (him and Miyazaki) tend to attempt to portray things objectively while the younger generation (Anno, Shinkai, Hosoda) tend to approach their stuff more subjectively.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Zeino



Joined: 19 May 2017
Posts: 941
PostPosted: Mon May 03, 2021 11:42 pm Reply with quote
Hey, Oshii?

1. Anno is far closer to Miyazaki then you are, so maybe you shouldn't go and make such presumptive statements.

2. Miyazaki's left behind radical politics after finishing the Nausicaä manga and has adopted a much more ambivalent "do your best to help out on a local level, because worldwide change may be impossible." position (See the Youtube video: "Miyazaki's Marxism - The Politics of Anime's Legendary Director" for further details.)

3. You've clearly not see Shin Godzilla.

4. Hosoda and Shinkai shouldn't be bound by your notion of what an anime director must be.

And 5. If Vlad Love is your idea of picking a fight with society, then joining local social justice protests would be a far better use of your time instead of directing.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
simona.com



Joined: 20 Apr 2007
Posts: 264
Location: Tokyo
PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2021 6:28 am Reply with quote
SpacemanHardy wrote:
Grandad's off his meds again. Rolling Eyes


#nailedit
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Animegomaniac



Joined: 16 Feb 2012
Posts: 3750
PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2021 7:06 am Reply with quote
Pokenatic wrote:
Gotta say, Oshii absolutely lost me when he said Hosoda and Shinkai's works also "lacked a main theme".


And that's where I agree with him and judging by what people listed here of what they think of as themes of their works... they agree with me.

Plot is not theme. "The Place Promised in Our Early Days" comes closet to an actual theme but to say "love" is a theme is like saying an action set piece is a theme. And it's not because I dislike Hosada's and Shinkai's output.

I loathe them but it's not like I need an excuse to rag on that piece of crap sentimentality that is Your Name. .... . Do I add a period when the title has a period?

And then there's Hosada and his theme of family. What do you have to say about it, Hosoda?
"Family good"
Astounding. And your next film?
"Family good."
... next film?
"Family good."

Hmm. But to be fair, it does beat his first film which has "Misogyny good".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jayhosh



Joined: 24 May 2013
Posts: 968
Location: Millmont, Pennsylvania
PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2021 10:16 am Reply with quote
Loathe is kind of a harsh word just because you don’t like their movies, isn’t it? It’s a big oversimplification to say that all Hosoda’s films can be boiled down to “family good.” He comes at the subject from a different angle with each story. Wolf Children showcases just how painful and heartbreaking raising a family and specifically children can be when they leave and become their own people. I have no idea how you got that out of TGWLTT either (unless you’re referring to his actual first film, OP Movie 6). That being said you don’t have to resonate with a directors thematic focus to acknowledge its legitimacy.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Konopan



Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 392
PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2021 5:58 pm Reply with quote
The guy who directed GITS Innocense doesn't understand subtlety or nuance, big surprise
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
simona.com



Joined: 20 Apr 2007
Posts: 264
Location: Tokyo
PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2021 6:06 pm Reply with quote
@Jayhosh you always make a lot of sense. I like that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group