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NEWS: Kakegurui Writer Homura Kawamoto's Isekai Revenge Manga Canceled After 1 Chapter


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luisedgarf



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 656
Location: Guadalajara, Mexico
PostPosted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 9:43 pm Reply with quote
mrsatan wrote:
glafrun wrote:
Yea, sarcasm, parody, dark humor etc.... Don't work in Japan at all. Walking on eggshells trying any of that out there. Maybe like 5% of the population understand that type of thing, but the rest will force you out.


(Formerly) Super sarcastic guy that once lived in Japan here that can confirm.
They took everything I said at face value and it made my life very difficult. Because I'm a big dummy on the spectrum, it took me too long to realize what I was doing to myself.

To this day, I still avoid saying sarcastic or dark humor.


That have a historical explanation, though: Japan, and also most Asian countries, were, and in some cases, still had a warrior mentality in their respective cultures, when people are taught since childhood on avoiding sarcasm or any kind of message that could be misconstructed as a serious topic, or taking serious matters lightly.

This is for very good reason: You wouldn't be sarcastic or even attempt to talk down against your senior during a war or any serious situation, would you?

Anyone who would have tried to be funny or sarcastic in such a situation, in ancient times and even still in modern times, could run the risk of being severely punished, beaten or tortured, at best, or executed, at worst. That's the reason why Japanese and many Asian people are stererotyped on being unscrutable.
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Ali07



Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 3333
Location: Victoria, Australia
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:50 am Reply with quote
Suxinn wrote:
Of course, all this is supposition, and I'm giving Kawamoto a lot of credit since I've liked most of what I've read from him (Rengoku Deadroll, Isekai Houtei, Kakegurui, etc.). I do agree that chapter one was super crass, and if it hadn't been Kawamoto writing it, I would've been much more wary of where it was going.

Feels like some people tend to be going in the opposite direction to yourself, when they say what they believe are the motivations behind this story/the direction that Kawamoto must've been heading.

Not sure if many that hold the "Kawamoto was jealous about the other's success with isekai" and "the other characters were surely going to be worse than what we saw in chapter one" have read any of Kawamoto's other work. Seems many were just thinking this was going to be pure schlock.

Like I've said, not all of the characters seemed to like Crawford, even though the ones that did show up on the scene didn't really bat an eye as to what he did. But the Aqua-parody definitely didn't like Crawford at all. I think she even called him trash. So, there was a bit there already that can be seen as wiggle-room, when it comes to not all of the isekai parodies being pure evil/trash versions.
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Hal14



Joined: 01 Apr 2018
Posts: 652
Location: Heart of africa
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:06 am Reply with quote
Ali07 wrote:

Not sure if many that hold the "Kawamoto was jealous about the other's success with isekai" and "the other characters were surely going to be worse than what we saw in chapter one" have read any of Kawamoto's other work. Seems many were just thinking this was going to be pure schlock.

Like I've said, not all of the characters seemed to like Crawford, even though the ones that did show up on the scene didn't really bat an eye as to what he did. But the Aqua-parody definitely didn't like Crawford at all. I think she even called him trash. So, there was a bit there already that can be seen as wiggle-room, when it comes to not all of the isekai parodies being pure evil/trash versions.


From the article:
Quote:
The series was teased in May as a revenge story "coated in hate and desire," centering on a someone who slaughters all who reincarnate from another world.


Yes it could have pulled a twist were some of the reincarnators weren't bad people, but the description the series itself gave makes it sound like most, if not all, would be evil degenerates so that the MC can kill w/out remorse.

Also, the reincarnators not liking each other or even being disgusted by one of their own doesn't make the others better. I recall in the film 'The Death of Stalin' the worst of the main characters was a rapist and paedophile, and despised by his peers but the other characters were still villain protagonists.
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all-tsun-and-no-dere
ANN Reviewer


Joined: 06 Jul 2015
Posts: 604
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:10 pm Reply with quote
luisedgarf wrote:

That have a historical explanation, though: Japan, and also most Asian countries, were, and in some cases, still had a warrior mentality in their respective cultures, when people are taught since childhood on avoiding sarcasm or any kind of message that could be misconstructed as a serious topic, or taking serious matters lightly.

This is for very good reason: You wouldn't be sarcastic or even attempt to talk down against your senior during a war or any serious situation, would you?

Anyone who would have tried to be funny or sarcastic in such a situation, in ancient times and even still in modern times, could run the risk of being severely punished, beaten or tortured, at best, or executed, at worst. That's the reason why Japanese and many Asian people are stererotyped on being unscrutable.


Holy orientalism, Batman! Most cultures have a power structure; you could say the same thing about militaries around the world, or talking to a politician anywhere, and so on.

Japanese absolutely has sarcasm, it just plays a very different role in communication. In conversation, it is rarely used for humor; it is generally cutting and cruel. Here is an excellent, accessible explainer on the topic.
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Suxinn



Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 242
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 7:39 pm Reply with quote
Ali07 wrote:
Not sure if many that hold the "Kawamoto was jealous about the other's success with isekai" and "the other characters were surely going to be worse than what we saw in chapter one" have read any of Kawamoto's other work. Seems many were just thinking this was going to be pure schlock.

I feel like most people know Kawamoto mainly from Kakegurui, which isn't a bad thing since Kakegurui is pretty exemplary of what Kawamoto writes (and a good series to boot). And it is very clear from his works that Kawamoto does indeed like schlock, but I do feel that his schlock tends to be elevated by some pretty fun character writing. Not to say that this series wouldn't have been pure schlock, but I definitely would've toughed out the rough beginnings to make certain of it for myself.

HAL14 wrote:
From the article:
Quote:
The series was teased in May as a revenge story "coated in hate and desire," centering on a someone who slaughters all who reincarnate from another world.


Yes it could have pulled a twist were some of the reincarnators weren't bad people, but the description the series itself gave makes it sound like most, if not all, would be evil degenerates so that the MC can kill w/out remorse..

I think it's important to note that taglines such as those are decided by the editorial department and not the author. They're the manga form of clickbait, essentially, and authors have no say over them.

I do agree with your points, though, and as I mentioned, if I wasn't familiar with Kawamoto's work, I wouldn't be giving him so much benefit of doubt. And even then, I agree everything could have gone sour even with Kawamoto at his best. That first chapter was really... not great.
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Ali07



Joined: 01 Jun 2014
Posts: 3333
Location: Victoria, Australia
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 7:04 am Reply with quote
HAL14 wrote:
Yes it could have pulled a twist were some of the reincarnators weren't bad people, but the description the series itself gave makes it sound like most, if not all, would be evil degenerates so that the MC can kill w/out remorse.


You could be right, or you could be projecting. We'll never know, and while the main character had some reason to hate Crawford, we don't know where the "hate and desire" would fully stem from. There was the witch to take into consideration too, and how she'd influence the MC.

There's wiggle room to go either way, and taglines (much like using recognisable parodies) are known to be used to catch the eye. Hard to know for sure where it was heading, and only going down the extreme route would be ignoring some of the things in that chapter that would've been expanded upon.

HAL14 wrote:
Also, the reincarnators not liking each other or even being disgusted by one of their own doesn't make the others better. I recall in the film 'The Death of Stalin' the worst of the main characters was a rapist and paedophile, and despised by his peers but the other characters were still villain protagonists.

Oh, I wasn't going down the path of it meaning others were any better. But, since I'm not one thinking that every isekai character was going to be as trash as Crawford, it was mentioned to show why I felt there was already some wiggle room built in where they might not be as bad. They all know what Crawford did, and likely know what he had done prior, so no one was going to be good from that group.

A lot of the rage has been about what Crawford did, along with the expectation that others would do the same or worse. I just don't see all of them having been pure trash like Crawford, still would've been trash, bit might've been a little more palatable. Maybe...

Suxinn wrote:
I feel like most people know Kawamoto mainly from Kakegurui, which isn't a bad thing since Kakegurui is pretty exemplary of what Kawamoto writes (and a good series to boot). And it is very clear from his works that Kawamoto does indeed like schlock, but I do feel that his schlock tends to be elevated by some pretty fun character writing. Not to say that this series wouldn't have been pure schlock, but I definitely would've toughed out the rough beginnings to make certain of it for myself.


I'll take your word on that, as I haven't checked out their work (just doesn't interest me). I too might've checked out this one, but I can't say that for sure. Unless Crawford was going to be dealt with within the next chapter or 2, probably wouldn't. I just don't like seeing spoiler[rape] in fiction used this way. It's why I avoided Redo (which IMO uses it in a worse way).
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mangamuscle



Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2658
Location: Mexico
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 12:35 pm Reply with quote
At the end of the day, Kawamoto made a bet and lost, bigly! At best any new manga proposals will be scrutinized from now on by the editor in chief, at worst no new proposals will be accepted until his contract expires.
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