×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
EP. REVIEW: Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba Swordsmith Village Arc


Goto page Previous    Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Guy Tizio



Joined: 22 May 2023
Posts: 58
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 2:20 pm Reply with quote
Unculturedman wrote:
I’m glad people are finally coming to the conclusion that this series is terrible. Modern shonen battle manga is a joke. There’s nothing thoughtful or sincere going on in these series anymore. This series always felt like the most rushed, barebones, poorly plotted、by the numbers, factory produced shonen story I’ve ever seen. The insane popularity of it continues to confound me, because it’s clearly just the anime’s production values that keep it from being just another forgettable modern battle shonen.


Excuse me for saying this, but this seems like classic boomer reasoning to me.

Or rather, a person accustomed to series with very slow rhythms, so now if a manga has less than fifty volumes and 500 chapters it sucks.

They are popular for the simple fact that modern audiences are now tired of manga in which practically nothing happens for a hundred chapters.




Quote:


There was a lot I hated about this episode, but the breaking point for me was when everything came to a halt so Genya could have a full two-minute flashback to explain to us in extremely slow motion how the four emotions combined as if Tanjiro saying "i can't feel the other four" wasn't enough to make us infer what had happened. And if that wasn't bad enough, Genya had to narrate the whole thing??? Those dialogues 100% could've been cut, it looked so goofy old school shonen to have the play by play of that whole already unnecessary scene.

That is, you complain because it's "old story", the other above complains because "the new shonen suck"...

Make up your mind


Quote:

Another thing that bothers me is that we've now spent a solid 20+ minutes watching Tokito in the water jug doing nothing whilst Mitsuri hasn't been seen in like three whole episodes? It's already bad enough that the one female Pillar we've seen since season 1 gets relegated to fighting minions but she doesn't even get screentime. Instead of Tokito floating motionless in the jar and the 5th moon mocking him for the 20th time, they could've added a new scene of Mitsuri fighting and protecting the villagers or something, they could've had really cool action scenes with her whip katana last week to liven things up and have all the Tokito focus this week without making it so obvious that they're stalling to fill in the runtime


It's the same in the manga.

The fight between Muichiro and Gyokko covers practically 10 chapters.

And for this season, they have chosen to adapt three chapters per episode by showing two scenarios for each
Mitsuri will shine later, this is Tokito's fight


Quote:


It's funny you bring up Dragonball, because for as many pacing problems as the original anime had, something that series was really good at was building up to its fights. Pretty much any Z-era climactic battle would take multiple episodes to play out, but they were always the big payoff for longer stories that worked their way up to that. Goku vs Frieza was protracted as hell, sure, but it was a lot easier to swallow because there had been so much tension built up. There was a whole adventure with the other characters avoiding or taking on Frieza's forces. There were smaller but still threatening enemies that Goku and the others had to overcome. It wasn't just 3 episodes of the crew arriving on Namek and then immediately fighting Frieza for another 10.


Excuse me for saying so, but this is reasoning that makes no sense.

Dragon Ball is a manga from over thirty years ago, written in ways that were good over thirty years ago.

The anime even worse.

That said, comparing Dragon Ball and Kimetsu as a story makes no sense.

They just have two different textures.

Dragon Ball doesn't have a plot, they are a series of arcs that are not connected to each other and are clearly built on the spot. there is no unitary tram.

The Kimetsu instead there is a unitary plot.

It's Tanjiro's journey to save his sister and the people he meets.

In Dragon Ball times were very dilated because the manga was quite long and the anime often had to stretch to avoid getting too close.

So thank you very much if the whole Frieza thing was built on tension, it took dozens and dozens of episodes to come to a climax.


KImetsu, on the other hand, is a rather short manga, with an anime that doesn't have to be behind the manga because it's already finished.

If times are short, and because they are in the manga too.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hal14



Joined: 01 Apr 2018
Posts: 667
Location: Heart of africa
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 2:42 pm Reply with quote
@guytizio
What's the opposite of "boomer reasoning" because that's how your post comes across.

Demon slayer being short might be why it's paced that way, except the pacing is not always like it is in this battle. A character drowning for three episodes is a lot like the criticism you're giving to DBZ. In fact, what happened to the mist hashira would not be out of place in DBZ or Naruto. Or the villain fight going on because of yet another power-up/transformation; an old shonen trope that DS is very fond of frankly.

Despite being a shorter story, DS still uses some of the tropes older, longer shows used to extend their run. Which might actually be why the pacing feels weird at times (this just occurred to me).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Unculturedman



Joined: 01 Apr 2022
Posts: 57
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 2:51 pm Reply with quote
Guy Tizio wrote:
Excuse me for saying this, but this seems like classic boomer reasoning to me.

Or rather, a person accustomed to series with very slow rhythms, so now if a manga has less than fifty volumes and 500 chapters it sucks.

They are popular for the simple fact that modern audiences are now tired of manga in which practically nothing happens for a hundred chapters.

That’s not what I was saying at all. Even shorter series had much better writing than this. Yu Yu Hakusho is several volumes shorter than DS and has much better character writing and narrative development because Togashi is a great writer and storyteller. Rurouni Kenshin is only a few volumes longer and is worlds better than this series. It has nothing to do with length. These new Mangaka don’t know how to meaningfully write and develop characters and stories. It’s all just action, action, action, with no substance. Action was never the point of a shonen battle manga. It was to use action and conflict to explore characters, ideas, concepts and themes. The new Mangaka saw what the previous generation did and I guess the only takeaway was “cool fights!”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ShinuZERO



Joined: 18 Jul 2013
Posts: 53
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 3:14 pm Reply with quote
That's not the case for all new manga though. I think that's too broad of a statement to make. There are modern manga-ka that are pushing the battle manga forward like Tatsuki Fujimoto. Though I will agree Demon Slayer is fairly generic and would fall into the camp you mentioned.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Guy Tizio



Joined: 22 May 2023
Posts: 58
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 3:18 pm Reply with quote
Hal14 wrote:
@guytizio
What's the opposite of "boomer reasoning" because that's how your post comes across.

Demon slayer being short might be why it's paced that way, except the pacing is not always like it is in this battle. A character drowning for three episodes is a lot like the criticism you're giving to DBZ. In fact, what happened to the mist hashira would not be out of place in DBZ or Naruto. Or the villain fight going on because of yet another power-up/transformation; an old shonen trope that DS is very fond of frankly..


If in the manga it was a prolonged part, it could not have been decreased more than that, taking into account that this season is short and therefore inevitably they will have to put 30 chapters in 13 episodes.




Quote:

That’s not what I was saying at all. Even shorter series had much better writing than this. Yu Yu Hakusho is several volumes shorter than DS and has much better character writing and narrative development because Togashi is a great writer and storyteller.

This is also very questionable because Yu Hakusho is not much shorter than Kimetsu.
About thirty chapters of difference are passed.


Quote:

Rurouni Kenshin is only a few volumes longer and is worlds better than this series. It has nothing to do with length. These new Mangaka don’t know how to meaningfully write and develop characters and stories. It’s all just action, action, action, with no substance.

Oh yes, how much substance the old manga had, look....

How can we not forget the 150 chapters of Stardust Cruaders in which Jotaro says fewer words than in all of the first chapter of DIU ?

Or the beautiful reasoned times of Bleach. Wow, those chapters where nothing happened and the characters talk about their feelings are beautiful....


Quote:

Action was never the point of a shonen battle manga. It was to use action and conflict to explore characters, ideas, concepts and themes. The new Mangaka saw what the previous generation did and I guess the only takeaway was “cool fights!”

In short, the new manga suck, long live the old ones, which are well written because they are old!!!

Just the way the boomers think
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Sasuke149



Joined: 09 Sep 2009
Posts: 52
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 3:28 pm Reply with quote
First of all, I like nearly everything about Demon Slayer. I like the characters, the story, the animation, the emotional scenes etc. etc. There is only one thing I don't like in the anime: the pacing. It's god-awful. It ruins everything. And I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks this way. I first felt this when I watched the episode in season one where Tanjirou met the hashira. They dragged the whole scene so much that I got bored after a while. Then they continued with this in the later seasons. But the pacing in this season is just the worst. It reminds me of the Orochimaru - 3rd Hokage fight in Naruto. That damn sword was stuck in the hokage's guts for weeks... OTL It's a shame honestly. All that great animation and story going to waste because of the studio's greed to milk the series.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mooseV01



Joined: 21 Apr 2017
Posts: 177
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 3:38 pm Reply with quote
I just think it’s kinda laughable that Demon Slayer keeps getting dinged harshly for these slower paced episodes, but the anime with the absolute worse pacing IN EXISTENCE, the One Piece anime, consistently keeps getting 4 and 5 star reviews with the occasional 3, no matter how dreadfully slow it gets. Lemme tell you, if this demon slayer episodes pacing bothers you… you would not survive the One Piece anime.

And yet you wouldn’t get that impression reading the reviews here. I’m aware a different person covers One Piece here… but cmon… there’s a disconnect here. No way does Demon Slayer get ragged on for its pacing on the very same site that keeps giving the One Piece anime 5-star reviews. Lol.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Minos_Kurumada



Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 1006
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 4:06 pm Reply with quote
There are many ways I would call KnY, "Modern" is not one of them.

Its sense of humor its normally "I AM GONNA SCREAM BECAUSE SCREAMING ITS FUNNY" Bleach's and One Piece's mansai "humor", modern humor its more "meta".

The villain's development it's normally a 5 mins flashback right before dying when in modern Manga antagonists normally develop along the heroes, like HXH, MHA, Kenichi, Baby Steps or Blue Lock.

The battles are "I am about to die but now I am gonna fight toe in toe with the villain because I really want to" 80s styled, like Saint Seiya or Hokuno no Ken.

If anything, this feels like something that was written at the beginning of the 2000s but with Fairy Tail's phase, but, different from FT, it takes itself serious and expends too much time with flashbacks that cut said phase.

Take that as you will.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Anime Binge-Watcher



Joined: 28 Jan 2020
Posts: 90
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 4:23 pm Reply with quote
mooseV01 wrote:
I just think it’s kinda laughable that Demon Slayer keeps getting dinged harshly for these slower paced episodes, but the anime with the absolute worse pacing IN EXISTENCE, the One Piece anime, consistently keeps getting 4 and 5 star reviews with the occasional 3, no matter how dreadfully slow it gets. Lemme tell you, if this demon slayer episodes pacing bothers you… you would not survive the One Piece anime.

And yet you wouldn’t get that impression reading the reviews here. I’m aware a different person covers One Piece here… but cmon… there’s a disconnect here. No way does Demon Slayer get ragged on for its pacing on the very same site that keeps giving the One Piece anime 5-star reviews. Lol.

Hello, might I introduce you to the concept of different reviewers having different tastes as opposed to the whole site being a collective hivemind where everyone has the exact same opinions?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mooseV01



Joined: 21 Apr 2017
Posts: 177
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 5:06 pm Reply with quote
I’m aware but it’s still laughable. DS gets dinged for pacing but OP doesn’t? That’s just off and probably why people have an issue with this. Makes it seem like DS has a bully. Most people are not gonna look at it as 2 different people. They’re gonna look at it as ANN loves OP but hates DS. That’s what it means when you have reviews under one umbrella.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
theotheranimeman



Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Posts: 74
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 6:38 pm Reply with quote
Unculturedman wrote:
I’m glad people are finally coming to the conclusion that this series is terrible. Modern shonen battle manga is a joke. There’s nothing thoughtful or sincere going on in these series anymore. This series always felt like the most rushed, barebones, poorly plotted、by the numbers, factory produced shonen story I’ve ever seen. The insane popularity of it continues to confound me, because it’s clearly just the anime’s production values that keep it from being just another forgettable modern battle shonen.


Even though I agree that Demon Slayer doesn't have any redeeming features aside from its animation, I completely disagree with modern shounen manga being bad.

Out of the modern shounens I've experienced, a lot of them seem innovative and inspired, like Jujutsu Kaisen, Dandadan, Dr. Stone and Chainsaw Man, which are all taking the genre in their own interesting directions. I don't even like Chainsaw Man, but I kind of appreciate the different approach it's taking at least. There's also Black Clover, which isn't modern in its approach, but it's an amazing (at least the manga) old school shounen that feels just like the classics, like Naruto or Yu Yu Hakusho.

The reason I don't like Demon Slayer is that it doesn't try to do anything new at all, while not having any charm either.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NeverConvex
Subscriber



Joined: 08 Jun 2013
Posts: 2302
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 6:49 pm Reply with quote
mooseV01 wrote:
I’m aware but it’s still laughable. DS gets dinged for pacing but OP doesn’t? That’s just off and probably why people have an issue with this. Makes it seem like DS has a bully. Most people are not gonna look at it as 2 different people. They’re gonna look at it as ANN loves OP but hates DS. That’s what it means when you have reviews under one umbrella.


Why would/should ANN care about someone who reacts like this at all? Getting irrationally upset about them not doing a thing (applying some kind of universally consistent grading rubric to all shows) they never set out to do is on the people treating the reviewers as if they're one person, not on the reviewers.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cryten



Joined: 19 Jan 2019
Posts: 987
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 7:10 pm Reply with quote
Having predicted that demon slayer would pull the old protracted fight gambit last week it does not surprise me that the same element that happened in the last 3 arcs happened again (ranked demon has twists that stop it from being easily killed). It IS becoming rote at this point, and since it has not really evolved the fight much it hasn't engaged very much other then making me think what new power ups are they going to rely on next. Also what happened to Tanjiro's revelation that he just needs to visualise successfully cutting an upper rank to make it happen better. That got thrown out as soon as it wasnt convenient.

Unfortunately Demon Slayer is struggling with not being able to match the pathos of its first 3 arcs with its later 2. That and the story beats are not refreshed enough to keep up with so much repetition.

Also a thought occurs to me. If becoming a Hashira requires killing an upper rank demon like they implied with the bakugo demon slayer fellow I can never remember the name of, why do any Hashira exist? Since the upper ranks had no members killed for the past 112~ years. I suspect people would say that the lower ranks count but in a way that seems like a contrivance. Not recognising contribution just luck of the draw for survivors.

Also in regards to complaints about the reviews. I firmly reject them as having a reviewer not state his feeling avoids giving readers a basis in which to judge his opinion from. Being hurt by not having affirmative opinion matching your own is understandable but not a reason to cease criticism.

The only point which I have some agreement from in this argument is I believe a review should have a paragraph on technical performance of an episode. But I also understand that such a paragraph might not fit neatly into a reviews narrative for the week, so might not be included.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LuffyTDS



Joined: 21 Nov 2015
Posts: 18
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 7:19 pm Reply with quote
mooseV01 wrote:
I’m aware but it’s still laughable. DS gets dinged for pacing but OP doesn’t? That’s just off and probably why people have an issue with this. Makes it seem like DS has a bully. Most people are not gonna look at it as 2 different people. They’re gonna look at it as ANN loves OP but hates DS. That’s what it means when you have reviews under one umbrella.


If those people look at it as one person then they are objectively incorrect, so who cares? That's on them. Plus everything about One Piece's story and characters is miles better than Demon Slayer so at least the slow pacing leads to something worthwhile IMO
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mooseV01



Joined: 21 Apr 2017
Posts: 177
PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2023 7:38 pm Reply with quote
Not one person. They’re just gonna look at the website as a whole funny. Either DS is being dunked on too heavily or OP is being treated to lenient. But there’s just a disconnect here.

At the end of the day tho, like most critic reviews, they’re not worth even considering. Most are out of touch with what the common man considers good anyway and that doesn’t change here. Echos of the Mario movie and the discrepancies between critic and audience reviews come to mind.

It is what it is tho. I agree that OP is the better series. But it absolutely does not have a better adaptation. Compared to Demon Slayers, anyway. Wano has been treated better than the arcs beforehand tho.

To me, it’s like video-game reviews. No one says “oh bob gave this game that score” or “Tim gave that game that score”. No, people usually say “Gamespot (as in the site) game that game a 5” or “IGN gave that game a 9”. Etc etc. No one (or rather the grand majority) do not refer to reviews by the person who did it. That person is part of a site and they represent that site.

So yeah man. People will absolutely look at it as ANN as a whole and not by any single person… because that’s just how most people take reviews when they’re under a unified umbrella.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous    Next
Page 5 of 11

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group