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ANNCast - Omega Men


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Hypeathon



Joined: 12 Aug 2010
Posts: 1176
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 11:16 pm Reply with quote
Dragynstorm wrote:
I've heard people say this about Viz quite a bit recently… what does Viz do to piss everyone off that other companies aren't doing as well?

Anime fans that mention stuff like that about Viz usually refer to anime or manga titles that are quietly discontinued after a number of volumes and no representative mentions a thing about it, let alone explain why. Frankly while I do understand how it particularly bothers people who avidly collect every volume of say a certain manga series and are really into it, the American manga and even anime market are not that big here. Or rather titles that aren't usually in the NY Times best-selling manga of the week don't seem to light the world on fire.

So with titles like Gintama and Reborn being discontinued, which as far as I can recall I've never seen a single volume on the NY times best-sellers, it's not too surprising. And while it would be nice to see Viz represenatitves make an announcement through twitter or something, it's not as if seeing 1-2 copies of the latest volume of a manga at Barnes & Noble compared to the latest copy of say Vampire Knight, Naruto or Bakuman having 3-5 times as many copies isn't evidence of it a title not selling that well. In fact, I just discovered a link of I think book scan numbers that shows sales of comic books including manga titles and the companies involved in 2010 and the past few years. According to the page, no Viz manga volume that was Naruto, Pokemon or Vampire Knight sold more than 20,000 copies in 2010. So if not even Bleach or One Piece (despite its 6 month campaign earlier last year) sold that much, I can't help but wonder how much the more low key titles sold.
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Sewingrose



Joined: 11 Jan 2011
Posts: 579
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 11:30 pm Reply with quote
I know the rush at closing stores is crazy (and all for the 10-20% off of what you could get 40% off of last week if you had a coupon), and for the most part, the bones are picked clean by the time the good deals come around. But I got a few things when a Borders closed around me back in Spring, including the complete 8 Volumes of Pluto Manga for about $25.
The people buying fixtures are amusing though.

I don't think I could ever work from home, because I need an office/work environment to be in, otherwise I do jack all.
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Surrender Artist



Joined: 01 May 2011
Posts: 3264
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 12:20 am Reply with quote
This was pretty nice. There's something relaxing about shows like this. I wouldn't mind one these once and a while.

The opinion that Justin gave about Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood matches mine. I nearly turned my television off after just a few minutes of the first episode. The whole beginning is incredibly obnoxious to watch. It turns into something tolerable by episode thirteen and sneaks craftily upward in quality as it goes, but if it weren't just a single, weekly half of an hour's diversion on television, I probably would'n'tve bothered. Thank mercy that they kept that comfortable old cast and found a really good replacement for Aaron Dismuke, who naturally could not reprise his part.

I love sandwiches, but I can't quite choose my one sandwich. I would probably be left equivocating between a cheesesteak, being a good southeastern Pennsylvanian and all, and a good corned beef reuben. Or maybe just a gigantic roast beef, turkey and salami with provolone hoagie that weights as much as a premature infant, but tastes twice as good. Then again, there's always fresh mozzarella and prosciutto... That pastrami and tongue sandwich sounded pretty tasty too..

Has, and I do apologize if this is out of line or place to ask, an ANNCast about ADR scriptwriting, or perhaps just a segment about it, ever been considered? I have no idea of how infeasible this might be, but if it were possible I think that it could be really interesting. I'd especially like to hear about particular sentences or concepts that are consistently difficult to fit ot the available lip flaps, what influence the Japanese companies have and, most of all, about differing philosophies on how closely the English version should try to match the original.
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tuxedocat



Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 2183
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 12:56 am Reply with quote
Surrender Artist wrote:
Has, and I do apologize if this is out of line or place to ask, an ANNCast about ADR scriptwriting, or perhaps just a segment about it, ever been considered? I have no idea of how infeasible this might be, but if it were possible I think that it could be really interesting. I'd especially like to hear about particular sentences or concepts that are consistently difficult to fit ot the available lip flaps, what influence the Japanese companies have and, most of all, about differing philosophies on how closely the English version should try to match the original.


I second this. Chuck Huber. Please?

(I understand he did the script for Oh! Edo Rocket! which is one of my favorite dubs ever. Mostly because the script localization was hilarious.)
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ljaesch



Joined: 03 Apr 2009
Posts: 299
Location: Enumclaw, WA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 1:27 am Reply with quote
As someone who considers herself to be a writer, I would love to hear an ANNCast, or at the very least, a segment of an ANNCast, on ADR scriptwriting. Smile While the topic sometimes gets touched on in some of the "behind the scenes" features that are sometimes included on anime DVD releases, those features really don't go as in-depth as I'd like.

Surrender Artist wrote:
Has, and I do apologize if this is out of line or place to ask, an ANNCast about ADR scriptwriting, or perhaps just a segment about it, ever been considered? I have no idea of how infeasible this might be, but if it were possible I think that it could be really interesting. I'd especially like to hear about particular sentences or concepts that are consistently difficult to fit ot the available lip flaps, what influence the Japanese companies have and, most of all, about differing philosophies on how closely the English version should try to match the original.
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Hypeathon



Joined: 12 Aug 2010
Posts: 1176
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 2:31 am Reply with quote
Surrender Artist wrote:
I'd especially like to hear about particular sentences or concepts that are consistently difficult to fit ot the available lip flaps, what influence the Japanese companies have and, most of all, about differing philosophies on how closely the English version should try to match the original.

If you want to get at least an idea of that perspective, I suggest listening to episode 23 of the That Anime Show podcast hosted by Terri Doty and J. Michael Tatum where Josh Grelle was a 2nd coming guest for the show and at around 1 hour and 10 minutes in they answer an email question that asked about the scriptwriting process. From what I recalled, they refer to how in terms of scriptwriting they focus on adapting a script to have the dialogue sound less wooden, obvious, literal and unatural since the translation needed to adapt the script is already literal and that leaving the literal translation as that barely works as a dramatic piece of dialogue. And then there's what Josh Grelle phrased from Chris Ayres which is that their job for a dub is to be caretakers.

And to add more on how closely the english version should match the original, depending on the actors and maybe even the script writers, they may feel like revising a line here and there to make it seem more like the character they're acting as. What may sound too literal and plain for certain characters can be revised to seem more like something only this character would say in that situation, at least that's how I observe it. To use Johnny Yong bosch being Ichigo as a prime example, I don't know if it's more to do with the script writer or with Johnny himself, but there are several lines through all that's been dubbed in Bleach that him sound like he was being a bit more punkish and acting tough when his facial expression shows it.


Last edited by Hypeathon on Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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ArsenicSteel



Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 2370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 2:54 am Reply with quote
Quote:
From what I recalled, they refer to how in terms of scriptwriting they focus on adapting a script to have the dialogue sound less wooden, obvious, literal and unatural since the translation needed to adapt the script is already literal and that leaving the literal translation as that barely works as a dramatic piece of dialogue


Viz and Bandai are able to adapt scripts just fine without the degree of reversioning or character redefining dialogue Funimation apparently needs to do.
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 15279
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 3:28 am Reply with quote
Quote:
Anno has very out-spoken criticisms of the U.S.A.


Yeah, a guy who adapted a manga about a sexual hamster has some real effing credibilty. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Anno's not coming back, because the fans berated him for an ending they didn't like


That didn't stop him from giving us that Cutey Honey movie and remaking Eva anyway.

Quote:
They don't know what to do with it.


It's more like they don't want to deal with fundy parents who complain about a cartoon which brings up "that time of the month". Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Won't sell the number of units it'd take to market it.


I dunno. They seemed to do ok with his other stuff. Just say, "From the director of", and that should save it. Plus give it the usual Hollywood names.

Quote:
Very small audience for [Only Yesterday]


The theater I saw it with at USC seemed fairly full of older women who didn't dislike it.

Quote:
Key the Metal Idol


I liked it, up until the dude with the leather pants. Crying or Very sad As for anime I thought would rock which didn't, I'd say Sohryuden[Catchy title, at least.], Biohunter, My My Mai, Ninja Scroll TV, Maetel Legend, Abashiri Family, Baccano, that last Casshern, most of those City Hunter specials,

As for Naruto, well, Hitler shares his thoughts. Laughing Personally, I'd like Berserk to wrap up already. [/quote]
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jsevakis
Former ANN Editor in Chief


Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 1684
Location: Los Angeles, CA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 3:53 am Reply with quote
Going very off-topic here guys. If we have a dub rewrite show (a good idea), we can have this particular bicker-fest then, OK?
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4410
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 3:57 am Reply with quote
Zac's description just adds to why I wouldn't want to go do Comic-con. 9 AM to have a chance at a 3 PM panel!! It also doesn't help that there is just a glut of various media that seems to have pretty well lost it's focus.
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DmonHiro





PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 5:36 am Reply with quote
To Justin: You want Tiger & Bunny to be darker and are on episode 5? Well, you asked for it mate. Wish GRANTED! I'm on 16. You will be VERY pleased at the amazing twists.
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Divineking



Joined: 03 Jul 2010
Posts: 1293
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 7:21 am Reply with quote
To Justin and Zac: Naruto is actually VERY close to ending. The current arc in the manga is pretty clearly the last one, and if the thing about Ultimate Ninja Storm 3 being ready once the manga is finished is true, it really may be done within a year.

On the note of Tiger and Bunny it definetly does get darker as it goes, along and I do agree that I want a physical release as soon as possible. Since there;s a seperate panel for the series at Otakon from Viz;s, I;m hoping it;ll be used to confirm a physical release.

Lastly on the note of Viz, I get why a lot of fans don;t like them, and I;m not exactly their biggest fan either, but it astounds me how many people are almost literally holding them hostage for one series. I like Monster as much as the next guy but is it really that hard to comprehend that it didn;t sell well? I;ve heard that it sold so badly that they even got a lot of copies BACK, so if it sold that terribly, I can sort of see why they;d want to keep quiet on it even if I don;t completely agree with that logic.
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The King of Harts



Joined: 05 May 2009
Posts: 6712
Location: Mount Crawford, Virginia
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:02 am Reply with quote
Quote:
but it astounds me how many people are almost literally holding them hostage for one series.

Monster
Full Moon
Hikaru no Go
Zatch Bell
Mar
Corrector Yui
Prince of Tennis

I count seven series they haven't finished. And that's just the anime they've dropped, I don't know all of the manga they've dropped.

Look, I understand that when things don't sell well you sometimes need stop the hemorrhaging, but that doesn't mean fans have to sit their and take it. It becomes a catch 22 because people aren't buying from them because they have a reputation of mysteriously dropping shows, but they mysteriously drop shows because people don't buy them.

I only own two Viz shows and I got them after they were completed, but I don't blame anyone for not buying Kekkaishi because they have legitimate doubts that'll be completely released and would rather take the "wait-and-see" approach. Nor would I blame Viz for dropping Kekkaishi, but it's their fault they're known for mysteriously dropping shows because, well, they do.

I actually think people would be less harsh on them if they took the Funimation approach and said they dropped it. No more just leaving it out there and giving fans false hope. Something I think that was overlooked in the podcast is that there's a difference between Media Blasters or Sentai keeping their noses down because they have fairly good reputations with the community, but Viz doing it makes them look they're holding their noses up to fans because they come off as not giving any kind of shit about it's customers. Hell, MB and Sentai even have internet presence on forum's (albeit a small one), while Viz has NOTHING. It's in the communities DNA to be tight-nit and close since it's so small, but Viz almost doesn't want to be a part of it. It certainly doesn't help that they seem to be allergic to Q&A panels at cons.

Not every company has to be Funimation where everyone has a twitter account and run their own social networking website. But just being TRSI, Sentai, or MB and just popping in every once and a while to say SOMETHING would go a long way towards building up good faith.
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Divineking



Joined: 03 Jul 2010
Posts: 1293
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 9:24 am Reply with quote
The King of Harts wrote:
Quote:
but it astounds me how many people are almost literally holding them hostage for one series.

Monster
Full Moon
Hikaru no Go
Zatch Bell
Mar
Corrector Yui
Prince of Tennis

I count seven series they haven't finished. And that's just the anime they've dropped, I don't know all of the manga they've dropped.

Look, I understand that when things don't sell well you sometimes need stop the hemorrhaging, but that doesn't mean fans have to sit their and take it. It becomes a catch 22 because people aren't buying from them because they have a reputation of mysteriously dropping shows, but they mysteriously drop shows because people don't buy them.

I only own two Viz shows and I got them after they were completed, but I don't blame anyone for not buying Kekkaishi because they have legitimate doubts that'll be completely released and would rather take the "wait-and-see" approach. Nor would I blame Viz for dropping Kekkaishi, but it's their fault they're known for mysteriously dropping shows because, well, they do.

I actually think people would be less harsh on them if they took the Funimation approach and said they dropped it. No more just leaving it out there and giving fans false hope. Something I think that was overlooked in the podcast is that there's a difference between Media Blasters or Sentai keeping their noses down because they have fairly good reputations with the community, but Viz doing it makes them look they're holding their noses up to fans because they come off as not giving any kind of shit about it's customers. Hell, MB and Sentai even have internet presence on forum's (albeit a small one), while Viz has NOTHING. It's in the communities DNA to be tight-nit and close since it's so small, but Viz almost doesn't want to be a part of it. It certainly doesn't help that they seem to be allergic to Q&A panels at cons.

Not every company has to be Funimation where everyone has a twitter account and run their own social networking website. But just being TRSI, Sentai, or MB and just popping in every once and a while to say SOMETHING would go a long way towards building up good faith.


Err...Viz has a facebook and a twitter you know, and they respond fairly frequently to both.
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Dragynstorm



Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Posts: 131
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:05 am Reply with quote
Feel like I'm white knighting here (and I guess to an extent I am), but I hate being seeing somewhat false info/one company being targeted for things other companies are also doing.

The King of Harts wrote:
Quote:
but it astounds me how many people are almost literally holding them hostage for one series.

Monster
Full Moon
Hikaru no Go
Zatch Bell
Mar
Corrector Yui
Prince of Tennis

I count seven series they haven't finished. And that's just the anime they've dropped, I don't know all of the manga they've dropped.


I don't know when they stopped putting out Zatch, but I was fortunate to do some freelance work on the manga. Viz stopped working on the Zatch manga shortly after Raiku and Shogakukan butted heads over missing pages. I was never given the "true" reason for stopping, so I can only assume that it was by word of Shogakukan (who owns part of Viz). Perhaps the anime was stopped for the same reason.

And this is something that bothers me. Why do people raise such a cry about Viz stopping manga series? (Not singling out you, The King of Harts) Yes, it's bad. It's REALLY bad. I hate it with a burning passion and wish they would just suck it up and finish putting out the freaking thing!! But… it's not like Viz is the only one that does it. They're not the worse offender by a long shot! But for some reason, many people I've encountered seem to dogpile onto them for it while giving companies like Tokyopop, who stopped releasing a much larger number of series, gets a pass. I don't get it.

The King of Harts wrote:

...Viz doing it makes them look they're holding their noses up to fans because they come off as not giving any kind of shit about it's customers. Hell, MB and Sentai even have internet presence on forum's (albeit a small one), while Viz has NOTHING. It's in the communities DNA to be tight-nit and close since it's so small, but Viz almost doesn't want to be a part of it. It certainly doesn't help that they seem to be allergic to Q&A panels at cons.


As someone else said, they have a Facebook account and multiple very active Twitter accounts (one for Viz, Shounen Jump, and Shojo Beat, I think). And for Q&A, it IS weird that they rarely have it at their panels. Pretty annoying, to be sure. But they took questions at Fanime and said (if I'm not mistaken, someone please correct me I'm wrong!) at Comic Con that though they would not take questions during the panel, they would take questions after the panel, outside the panel room. The year before that, one of the higher ups gave out his email so people could ask him questions personally.

Alright, I think I've said my piece. Viz isn't an angel or anything and they've done tons of things that I think are foolish, but I'm constantly bothered that they faults people latch onto and attack them and (often) them only for are ones that many others in the industry also have. Sorry for the rampant white knighting.


Last edited by Dragynstorm on Sat Jul 30, 2011 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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