Forum - View topicNEWS: Man Arrested for Holding Woman Captive He Met at June Anime Con
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Charred Knight
 Posts: 3085 |
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The point is that anime doesn't turn you into a serial killer, or molester. People are painting us with the brush of perverted criminals, and I don't think we should be defending that. Yes, you need to be careful at anime cons, but that's true of any group function like that. |
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TD912
 Posts: 274 |
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While I somewhat agree that this story isn't entirely within the scope of what ANN should cover, having the story posted here doesn't somehow automatically make all anime fans look bad. The source articles from Chicago are trying to convey that out of the many, many regular anime fans, there are a very limited number of crazy obsessed otaku, and there was a panel that talks about it. Maybe it could have been worded somewhat differently, but trying to censor information just to make things seem all happy and fine and dandy is not good journalism. The author did a little research, and found information she believed to be relevant. If you don't like the way she wrote, feel free to email her. That's why her contact information is on the top of the article page. People seem to be afraid that others will interpret the article as if it was trying bash all anime fans or something. If there was a car convention with a panel about aggressive drivers and road rage, and later some crazed attendee intentionally ran someone over, and then a car news site posted about it, you wouldn't blame the panel, the other attendees, the site, or automotive fans in general simply for bringing up the topic. ANN's article is pretty unbiased. It's not "happy" news, but it's unbiased. Even if another news source quoted ANN, I'm not sure how it would somehow "validate" anything. The most they could say is "ANN reported on this topic." Views on anime and manga are different in the US than in Japan. If a biased news station wanted to twist the facts for some reason, they would find a way to do so even if ANN didn't publish any article. Again, whether this falls under the scope of what ANN should cover or not is debatable, but I don't see how it paints all of us as extreme violent criminals. Last edited by TD912 on Mon Sep 26, 2011 8:37 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Apollo-kun
 Posts: 1213 Location: City 7, Macross 7 |
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I can't believe people like this still exist in this world, and I hope that the poor woman gets the best help available to her. Also hope that the guy gets locked away for a very, very long time.
Let's just pray that the media doesn't use this sick [nasty word] as some kind of example of ALL anime fans, and start blaming this on anime, instead of realizing that this is a case based purely on the messed-up machinations of one disgusting freak of a man. |
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enurtsol
 Posts: 14757 |
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Don't assume! Maybe or maybe not anime/manga has turned the couple into this.
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Cutiebunny
 Posts: 1746 |
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And on the next episode of Sick Sad World...
I feel really bad for the woman. No one should be treated like this. It's bad enough that she met this guy at an anime convention (so now we'll all be labeled as having the potential to do this), but that he thought he had the right to do this to another human being who clearly did not want to be treated like this is disgusting. Lock this sicko away and throw away the key. Maybe Bubba will teach him what happens when you mess with a lady... |
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Sunday Silence
 Posts: 2047 |
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Well, be lucky the police didn't report finding "Lolicon" or other incriminating manga/anime. |
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Banden
 Posts: 140 |
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Speaking only for myself, I wasn't criticizing ANN's choice to carry the story, although I agree with others that its actual relevance to anime fandom seems questionable, and it seems more like a stereotype-reinforcer than anything substantively important for anime fans to know about. I am troubled by the way the Chicago Sun-Times reports the story, bookending it with references to anime and otaku as if looking to point at finger at somebody other than the perpetrator of the crime. "Japanese porn cartoons" is a very old stereotype that we should all be wise to in the year 2011 and speaking out against when it rears its ugly head. Instead, some people here are pointing other fans and continuing to validate that attitude! Hate other fans as much as you want, but don't feed toxic stereotypes that make us all look bad. There is no trend of anime fans acting out violently against women, period.
Welcome to a discussion thread about a crime that was committed in Chicago. If you'll click that link at the top of the page and read the article, and the Sun Times link that goes along with it, you may just figure out where those qualifiers came from. 
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firefly777
Posts: 1 |
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Whoa she must of been blind, really desperate and/or really easy to move in with this guy only after a month in meeting him especially at an anime convention if the info is correct. I would only move into my partner's place if I had money to burn, it's been at least a year (long term relationship), or if she's a nympho
 . *SIGH* Common sense is such a rare thing nowadays.
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Sunday Silence
Posts: 2047 |
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Stop trying to beat around the bush and admit that you got a legitimate answer to a query you made. You asked for a case where otaku went berserko and you got one (two, if you count mine from a page or two back). |
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MrHatandClogs
 Posts: 283 Location: Between two ferns! |
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As people are clearly not understanding what I'm saying, I will cease my arguments after this..
I'm not saying ANN is wrong for reporting news that makes anime fans "look bad". I understand that they need to report anything and everything anime/manga etc. related, and I respect that. And, I encourage that, and I know they aren't posting just to "make fun of us". I mean I'm pretty sure most of the people working for ANN are fans themselves. What I've been trying to get across, is that it's ludicrous for them to post speculation from other news sites. In doing that they are showing said sites they "agree" with their accusations. Where I know that they certainly are not, it makes it seem that way, and that's exactly what these people are hoping for. I follow this site for news, not speculation. As someone said earlier..."Do I want them to post stories about people stalking seiyuus?" Yes, because those are facts that someone was targeting someone directly related to someone in this culture. Is that a squeaky clean depiction of this culture? No, it's another example of an otaku looking creepy. But, it's proof that a fan of the culture did something wrong because he was a fan of what that victim did for the this culture. But a guy luring girls from conventions, has nothing to do with him liking/watching anime etc. I hope that's more clear, and I don't want anyone to think I don't want ANN to post things that make us fans look bad. I just want them to post actual anime news, not speculation lead from other media outlets. Because if the original story hadn't stated any of those accusation that it had to do with his otaku background, ANN wouldn't have even thought to post it. |
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Banden
Posts: 140 |
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Obvious troll is obvious? Okay, fine. Explain to me. How does a quadruple homicide from the other side of the Pacific in the late 80's confirm the newspaper's comments about "male megafans who had trouble relating to women and acted out violently against them"? Go ahead, show me the mental gymnastics. I'm not asking the question - for other examples - in a vacuum. If people are going to agree with the implication the newspaper makes about this in anyway being attributable to what cartoons this sicko watches and other people who watch those same cartoons, I'd like some actual evidence instead of blind fandom hate. There is no trend of anime fans acting out violently against women. Period. |
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la_contessa
Posts: 200 Location: Pennsylvania |
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I'm not crazy about the framing of the article (the bit about the con panel on otaku subculture at the end looks like someone scoured the website with the PURPOSE of finding something objectionable), but I think it makes us look just as bad to throw a fit about the story being reported in the first place as the actual facts of the story may make us look.
The fact is they chatted on Facebook. The fact is they met up at an anime con. For anime fans to immediately react with anger that the facts were reported makes us look defensive and insecure. Reporting an objective fact ("They met up at an anime con") is not an attack, it's a real, live fact. It's not a GOOD fact, but it's a fact, and we can't bury our heads in the sand and ignore it. It doesn't mean all otaku are nuts, it doesn't mean most otaku are nuts, it doesn't even mean SOME otaku are nuts. It just means this one jerk was nuts, and he chose anime conventions to find victims--and as a community, we need to be aware that this kind of thing exists. Many people seem to be making a big deal over the fact that other subcultures also have nutjobs in them, which is absolutely correct. Any stories involving those people and subcultures should ALSO be accurately reported. It is a fallacy, however, to imply, "Because other subcultures have more/worse problems, problems in the otaku subculture should be ignored/whitewashed." The existence of problems in other subcultures is completely irrelevant to whether or not otaku have our own problems, and I have no problem with cases like this in any subculture being reported. Anyone chatting with random people on Facebook and meeting random people at cons should be careful. I used to work security at a small, northeastern anime convention, and I was routinely HORRIFIED at the dangerous behaviors I saw from young attendees (it's one of the reasons I stopped going to cons at all, actually). I think attendees (and their families) DO need to be aware that these things can happen at anime cons, simply to make them more aware of the consequences of their decisions. This girl was not very young, but the suspect was still able to (I presume) trick her. Obviously HE is responsible for his own reprehensible actions, not the victim, but if awareness will prevent even one victim in the future, the story was worth it. (and by the way, I would bet that if this happened at a sales convention, or a Tupperware convention, or a muscle car convention, or a flower show, or ANY other large group of people, the media would have reported the same details on the event. Why is only mentioning "anime con" bad? Should the media also say "show" instead of "flower show" so as not to offend the majority of flower show goers who are not sketchy abusers? Or is only anime verboten? My point is that the descriptor "anime," "flower," "muscle car," etc. is nothing more than that--a factual descriptor. It is not an assignment of blame in and of itself. Like I said, I think the last bit about the con panel was unnecessary, but I don't object to the article as a whole) |
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Aura Ichadora
 Posts: 2283 Location: In front of my computer |
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Technically, this is about the same as all the news we get about teenagers getting arrested for using "death notes" in school or the incident of the boy who died imitating Naruto, albeit a lot creepier on some level. It's still news, and it still gives us as anime fans a bad name since it's relating an anime-related object to something horrid. |
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Banden
Posts: 140 |
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Everyone needs to be aware that sexual assault exists. It's not a unique or severe problem inside the anime fan community that outside, as far as anyone has been able to demonstrate to me? The guy's crimes are heinous, and there's no reason to even suggest that his crimes have anything to do with us aside from the fact that he and she attended a convention? I don't think anyone is suggesting that we should whitewash it, but there's no reason for us to own it and call it "a problem in our community" either! Anime fans have been struggling with unfounded accusations of being deviants and perverts for decades based on the general public's skewed perceptions of the anime artform; which to me is what makes anime conventions very different from sales conventions, Tupperware conventions, muscle car conventions, flower conventions. On the contrary, I think most people would agree we've been a very inclusive fandom compared to most others? Back in the day it was just the sweaty neckbearded forever alones, right? Over the years its evolved into a pretty vibrant 50/50 mix of guys and girls, inclusive to yaoi fans and GLBT and welcoming to all kinds of tangent subcultures? Which is why I am particularly offended when a newspaper associates a sexual predator with "the community". Particularly when people within the community voice agreement and use the opportunity to speak badly of "other fans". It's a step backwards. It's a validation of a completely unsubstantiated stereotype that has never really gone away, in spite of the fact that we've only been able to come up with one other example so far of a sexual assault at an anime convention, between the present day and the Miyazaki murders on the other side of the ocean 20 years ago. We're doing the community a disservice when we allow someone to write things like the Sun Times reporter wrote without correction. These are Sir Lancelot's crimes, not ours. Violence against women is unequivocally, definitely, positively not one of the things that binds us together as a community. And it's not okay for outsiders to imply that it is. |
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enurtsol
Posts: 14757 |
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Not with the trending popularity of otaku-pandering fanservice of late-night less-mainstreaming of anime! Heck, we revel in it! 
He's one of us................... Oooooooooooooooooo! 
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