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NEWS: ADV Suspends Anime ADVocates Club Program Indefinitely

Unproven, on the contrary, we've been without copyright laws in the past and artists still existed and still did get paid.

Once again, if you think these laws are necessary, explain to me how the industry gets by when those laws have been broken with high regularity for the last 30 years (by VCRs, cassettes, and CDRs)?

Yes, but we do live in that world now, and have for at least the past 5 years, even if not the past 30. I'm sorry but I'm not seeing the world falling apart here. Sure, there are some issues and there is a need for resolution of them, but the right resolution cannot be lawsuits or increases in restrictions on the internet. Those are extremely bad ideas that will fail horribly (and have already in the past) due to new generations of p2p technology.

If you say so it must be true, but I'm not seeing it. Just keep in mind that you say this is happening "with" protection. Apparently we aren't able to enforce it now, what makes you think we will in the future? The new laws have got you thinking they really can do something but decided not to until now? Why do you think anime policing will save us all when the RIAA & MPAA have failed miserably? I will take the wait and see approach you suggest.

If you're not a part of the solution, you're a part of the problem. Take your pick.

Oddly enough, I still haven't [perfected] the technique of [excreting] [infinite] amounts of money.

Conan-san wrote:

Oddly enough, I still haven't [perfected] the technique of [excreting] [infinite] amounts of money.

Since when did not being able to afford entirely non-essential diversions (e.g. Japanese cartoons) make helping yourself to them for nothing morally okay?

Since when did not being able to afford entirely non-essential diversions (e.g. Japanese cartoons) make helping yourself to them for nothing morally okay?

Apparently your money is non-essential to them if they price it where you cannot afford it. They wouldn't have gained anything either way.

In my mind, anything is morally OK that doesn't hurt someone else or yourself.

The point of explaining that one cannot afford something is to give a reason that no harm was done.

Copying something is not comparable to taking something. It's wholly different and the morality or immorality of it is entirely based on the situation. I doubt you yourself would say that copying is wrong if it were with the permission of the copyright owner.

It's not an inalienable right.

However, based on what I know of income in the content industries at this point it's difficult for me to believe on the whole it's paid less than what it's worth to society.

Yes, you are right to say that people will prioritize things that they can get free less. That is expected. I would say the extent to which people do that should be balanced against their desire to support what they want to continue. Even if someone is immoral, they would be a fool to spend money on things they care less about.

Don't forget, the alternative method that most people here seem to like to argue for also has plenty of costs.
1) Legal costs - lawsuits costs these companies how much?

2) DRM costs - continuous licensing costs for every item sold as well as the costs of development

3) Societal costs - if we step up to jailing people for this, we'll be putting a lot of people in jail that will be paid for by others taxes.

Even if we don't jail them, the costs of fining people the amounts we do in the US (222000) or even in Japan, are so high most people could barely live with that.

I think these costs are enough to promote "doing nothing" and those individuals certainly won't have more to spend afterward.

4) Enforcement costs - you need to spend money to track copying online in order to find people who are doing it. This money also has to be spent cracking the new systems that become available over time (Winny -> Share -> etc.)

I also think sharing (not bootlegging) is a natural control on pricing.

Anyway, I basically think the benefits of copying for society as a whole outweigh the costs of preventing it on the whole. And if copying should ever become unfairly balanced, I think a better (and less costly) method of allocating resources would be to mandate a tax on internet that would go to the media industries.

In my day, supply and demand was a generally adequate control on pricing.

They're supposed to serve as a warning

This is a common sense argument. Unfortunately, it disregards the fact that common sense is a commodity in short supply - particularly amongst our "entitled" youth.

Some of the punitive damages handed down in the US have been silly. But that's an argument for reform, not abandonment.

other wise all the money goes to Sony and EMI and it doesn't help Gonzo or Funimation in the slightest.

Oh go and dance with Iron Man, why don't cha? Oddly enough, I still haven't prefected the technique of excrimenting infinate amounts of money.

I buy shows that are worth it, if that's not the case then too bad so sad. I'm not going to go out of my way to prep up ADV just because they think releaseing nonsence like AIR and Kannon is a better move than geting a move on with Keroro Gunsou.