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REVIEW: Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood DVD Part 5


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iamthevastuniverse





PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 7:06 am Reply with quote
Blightstrider wrote:
I AM THE VAST UNIVERSE wrote:
Really?That's the first time I've heard of anyone complaining about the final fight in the series with Father


Then prepare for another.

spoiler[The biggest problem this fight had, was that because of the closeness of the events, it had to be compared to the fight with Bradley, where it fell short. Alot.

The problem was, that after Father lost all the souls which he used to devour God, the fight just became WAY to predictable (and the whole reverse-circle thing felt a little contrived) and rather hard to get immersed in. While in the end, he did a lot of damage to the characters that got too close, there was nothing that struck me as rather serious, nothing that could be fixed in five or so episodes.

The ‘good guys’ a force did not seem really taxed during the fight, as Father was stuck on the defensive all the time and the only character that actually suffered anything serious in the long-run was Greed, which was rather... typical. Greed came off as a character that I KNEW was going to die, just because of the nature of his existence, so killing him off seemed rather predictable, not to mention the way they did it seemed so tacked on like... “Oh, well, I guess Father needs to kill SOMEBODY important before going down, hey, Greed still needs to die!”

The other fights were fine for the final arc, like with Envy vs Roy and especially Bradley! Hells, Bradley was so kick-ass. The Father fight just seemed like a major let-down after all that.]


Well obviously your entitled to your opinion but personally I was never disappointed with Brotherhood whatsoever it delivered in every convincible manner possible throughout its entire scope.
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Maidenoftheredhand



Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 2633
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:56 am Reply with quote
Thanks for the review Carl

Quote:
The sheer logistics of keeping the show's enormous cast in play is impressive enough, but even more impressive is how much it makes us care for them, down to the bit players and even the villains.


This is what I love so much about Fullmetal Alchemist. Yes it has a large cast but every character has a purpose and no character is wasted.

And while the ending battle was certainly grand in scope I thought the solution of getting back Al was very simple almost the opposite of that grandness

spoiler[Ed giving up his alchemy was the perfect way to conclude the series for me. Especially if you go back to the 1st episode where Ed compares alchemists to gods (a very arrogant statement)

In fact what Ed did was the exact opposite of Father who in his arrogance wanted to keep "improving and improving" himself.

Ed however realized throughout the course of the series he doesn't need to rely only on himself and his own power but he can he also rely on others. Thus throwing away the arrogance he has at the beginning of the series. Ed realizes that giving up alchemy is not really a sacrifice for him at all. And I think that realization shows how much he has grown

And then the scene of him fixing the roof by hand which of course could be done much quicker by alchemy but then he wouldn't see the beautiful view is one of my favorite scenes in the series.]
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:08 am Reply with quote
That is another thing I don't quite get.

Can somebody explain to me spoiler[how giving up his alchemy powers somehow is 'worth' the price of Ed's arm and leg, and Al's body, and Al's soul? They go on the entirety of the show focused on equivalent exchange, but yet at the end don't even really abide by it? I also thought it was hilarious when Marcoh just gave Mustang's sight back with the stone as if it was the easiest thing in the world. He could have done the exact same thing to restore Ed's and Al's bodies back, no?]
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Veroniku



Joined: 04 Jul 2008
Posts: 20
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:32 am Reply with quote
@Megiddo
spoiler[Well, yes, Ed and Al could've been restored by a stone, I think you missed about 10 episodes of the series. They DECIDED not to use it, because of what it's made of.

Instead, your point should be "How could they restore Mustang's eyes with the stone, when Hohenheim, who was made of stones, couldn't restore Izumi's organs because it was a symbol of her sin?" To which some would argue that's because Mustang didn't really sin, but that's a bit farfetched as he wouldn't have lost his eyes in the first place, if the fact that he didn't sin counted. I think it's more about going through the gate.

As for whether the toll of Ed's gate is equally worth Al coming back to reality, well the whole concept of equivalent exchange has always been purposely hazzy (who can JUDGE what a person's soul is worth? Well, in FMA I guess it's that truth guy), but I personally think this gate which represents almost-limitless-knowledge is worth a lot. Knowledge is gold, right?]


So as everyone already mentionned, it's not a perfect series, but then which series is perfect?! The fact that there are loop-holes and things to argue about, makes this so much more enjoyable and memorable. I personally ADORED the end. As the review said, yes it's a bit hard to get your head around it if you're trying to think about it logically, but since when are shonen supposed to be totally logic? Arakawa wanted to make one of the most epic shonen, and she succeeded.

On the comparison between manga and anime, I really liked how the anime thought about Havok spoiler[(while in the manga he has to suffer through rehabilitation)]


Last edited by Veroniku on Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:47 am; edited 1 time in total
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Maidenoftheredhand



Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 2633
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:35 am Reply with quote
Megiddo

For what was given up!

spoiler[The series made it very clear that the only price Truth takes is a passage fee to get through the doors of Truth.

Everyone gets different things taken: Izumi her internal organs, Mustang his eye site, Ed his leg, and Al his body. There is symbolism behind what is taken but there is no 1 for 1 sacrifice. The series NEVER said this.

Ed went through the doors twice, the 2nd time to pull Al's soul back and that time he lost his arm. So when Al's soul returns to the doors of truth, Ed gets his arm back. Ed & Al's doors are connected hence Ed is later able to get to Al. Problem he needs to give something else up to get them both through the doors (the passage fee). Why does alchemy work? Because alchemy in a sense is the power of the arrogant. All the alchemist who went through the doors (with the exception of Mustang who was forced) tried to play God and bring a human back. If you take Truth as "God" then of course he wants to punish the arrogant. But Ed is saying take back that power I don't need it. He's throwing away this very arrogance.

Please note that Ed never got his leg back which he lost during the first exchange.]


For Mustang and the P. Stone

spoiler[Yes Ed and Al could have also used the stone to get their bodies back. But they already said many times "they did not want to". It's not like the stone is free, it's made up the lives of many people. Ed & Al got in the situation themselves and they did not want to use the lives in the stones to fix themselves.

It was different when Al used the stone to fight Pride and Kimbley because he felt he was fighting with the people in the stone.

Mustang never said he had these same misgivings. He's not Ed & Al. If Mustang was blind he could not accomplish his goal of changing the country and so he did what he felt he had to do (and in another sense unlike Ed & Al, Mustang did not go through the doors of truth by choice).]



For Equivalent Exchange it's also not really about sacrificing anything but if you look at the themes of the series it's more about a way to live your life. If you get something, give back in return. I never felt the theme was about losing something but about giving back. These are two very different ways to look at it. One is ultimately negative and one is ultimately positive. Equivalent exchange is not meant to be negative thing. Hence in the ending

spoiler[Ed and Al decide to over-turn it and give 2 for 1.]
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Yttrbio



Joined: 09 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 10:58 am Reply with quote
I dunno, I never really bought Ed's growth through the series. spoiler[At no point in the series did it seem like Ed would be unwilling to make the exchange he makes at the end. Yeah, he valued alchemy, but not that much. In the end, it just felt like it suddenly occured to this supposed super-genius: "Oh, I can just do this!" It's like he checked out these superpowers from the library just long enough to save the world, then went back and returned them.] Maybe that was the point, but it feels rather silly, set against all the angst Ed suffered throughout the series.
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Maidenoftheredhand



Joined: 21 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 11:03 am Reply with quote
You are right Ed would have given that up in the beginning if he realized that was the answer but certainly he would not have understood that giving it up wasn't much of a sacrifice in the early part of the series as it was something that defined who he was. It was ultimately a simple answer but sometimes simple answers are the hardest ones to find.

And I certainly didn't see anyone predicting it beforehand.

The growth was also symbolic spoiler[Ed doesn't need alchemy because he can rely on others instead. And certainly this was not something he realized in the early part of the series where Ed and Al would often try to do everything themselves.

But as the series went on they began to trust more and more people telling others their problems and asking for help..and in the end they got it]
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sainta



Joined: 21 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 11:11 am Reply with quote
Yttrbio wrote:
I dunno, I never really bought Ed's growth through the series. spoiler[At no point in the series did it seem like Ed would be unwilling to make the exchange he makes at the end. Yeah, he valued alchemy, but not that much. In the end, it just felt like it suddenly occured to this supposed super-genius: "Oh, I can just do this!" It's like he checked out these superpowers from the library just long enough to save the world, then went back and returned them.] Maybe that was the point, but it feels rather silly, set against all the angst Ed suffered throughout the series.


spoiler[As far as I remember Edward had in mind he was the only one who should suffer. In one occasion, Al told him he better not sacrifice himself anymore. As the series continued, he had join forces with his friends despite the dangers and even people he used to hate like Scar and Hohenheim. At one point, he accepted becoming Greed's servant just to know more about Father. In the final fight, Father revealed that the truth existed within everybody, and could only use the ones whose alchemic abilties increased which I'm sure was a hint to Ed's final transmutation.]
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Crisha
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Joined: 21 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:30 pm Reply with quote
Maidenoftheredhand wrote:
For Equivalent Exchange it's also not really about sacrificing anything but if you look at the themes of the series it's more about a way to live your life. If you get something, give back in return. I never felt the theme was about losing something but about giving back. These are two very different ways to look at it. One is ultimately negative and one is ultimately positive. Equivalent exchange is not meant to be negative thing. Hence in the ending.

Thank you for your analysis. It makes me more eager to see Brotherhood. I think I would appreciate it more now than if I had watched it earlier because I would have been constantly comparing it to the first series. I'm think I'm at a point where I can appreciate both for what they are. I'd like to see how the concept of Equivalent Exchange is taken with either series, and I think that your statement above probably best describes it.

Maidenoftheredhand wrote:
You are right Ed would have given that up in the beginning if he realized that was the answer but certainly he would not have understood that giving it up wasn't much of a sacrifice in the early part of the series as it was something that defined who he was. It was ultimately a simple answer but sometimes simple answers are the hardest ones to find.

And I certainly didn't see anyone predicting it beforehand.

Oh, it was. At least one fanfic I know of even used the concept (though the fanfic played with the more cynical tone that the first series had... I think it was set in that universe). But I'm not surprised no one on here knows of it. In fact, I'd be extremely surprised if anyone on here knows of the one I'm thinking of.
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Maidenoftheredhand



Joined: 21 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:43 pm Reply with quote
willag wrote:

Oh, it was. At least one fanfic I know of even used the concept (though the fanfic played with the more cynical tone that the first series had... I think it was set in that universe). But I'm not surprised no one on here knows of it. In fact, I'd be extremely surprised if anyone on here knows of the one I'm thinking of.


Well okay I probably shouldn't have said no one predicted it as I think when you have the Internet and a lot of people coming up with theories usually someone will think of it.

So to rephrase it wasn't something most people thought of. Or I don't think it was glaringly obvious even though the answer was rather simple in the end. Smile
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EnigmaticSky



Joined: 06 Aug 2011
Posts: 750
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 5:13 pm Reply with quote
I bought the bluray of this a while ago (kind of awkwardly since, I have the rest in dvd). It was a fantastic final set. I was yelling at my tv with my friend at parts. The series isn't perfect, but is is certainly worth buying. I agree with an A-. The one thing I have a problem with is the sponge-painted backgrounds. Really though, the last set was fantastic.
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Sippin Coffee



Joined: 16 Feb 2010
Posts: 19
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:02 pm Reply with quote
I finally finished this series on my DVR this past weekend and already own the first 3 volumes on Blu Ray. Having not seen the 1st series and not reading the manga, this has become the definitive anime for me. I will refer any acquaintance who expresses interest or curiosity towards anime to this series. A real masterpiece in my opinion.
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tsunayakuin



Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 91
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:12 pm Reply with quote
FMAB is almost perfect except for one thing= Winry.
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:11 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
That is another thing I don't quite get.

Can somebody explain to me spoiler[how giving up his alchemy powers somehow is 'worth' the price of Ed's arm and leg, and Al's body, and Al's soul? They go on the entirety of the show focused on equivalent exchange, but yet at the end don't even really abide by it? I also thought it was hilarious when Marcoh just gave Mustang's sight back with the stone as if it was the easiest thing in the world. He could have done the exact same thing to restore Ed's and Al's bodies back, no?]


You're basing your thoughts on the first anime, the manga never put much discussion on equivalent exchange like that, and in fact the heroes called that type of thinking cynical. The point was not what Ed sacrificed butspoiler[that Ed showed humility pointing out that Alchemy couldn't save one girl. The Elric brothers thought they where gods because of Alchemy when they where only human.]
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 8360
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:18 pm Reply with quote
They never thought of themselves as Gods -__-

Where do you people get this stuff? Did Arakawa actually write Ed and Al as thinking they were omniponent? I'd be much more wary of reading the manga if so.

As far as I understood their characters, they lived by logic and science. They had no interest in deities or gods or the like. They had no conception of themselves as being greater than any other person, and if I recall correctly, that whole "All is one and one is all" ordeal that Izumi put them through made them realize extremely early on that they are dependent upon others and the world itself. No, they never thought they were gods.


Last edited by Megiddo on Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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