Forum - View topicNEWS: Tokyopop to Restructure
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testorschoice
Posts: 468 |
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The Japanese licensors wouldn't mind Tokyopop calling non-Japanese comics manga, because Japanese people call non-Japanese comics manga, too. That includes comics that weren't published in Japan and weren't intended for Japanese readers. Japanese people have done so for decades. It's the overseas fans that try to make the distinction. http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/漫画 http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/ピーナッツ_%28漫画%29 |
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The Xenos
 Posts: 1519 Location: Boston |
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Yes, we do make the distinction. In Japan it's not an issue because they're speaking Japanese anyway. The thing is, like right now, we're not speaking in Japanese. So there's no reason to be using Japanese words for what we already have English terms for. The only reason to call Japanese comics manga is because that's their native name. Of course we're not really using the Japanese name. We're speaking the English pronunciation. It's not like we're saying "manga" in kanji or kana.
Out of curiosity, how much of that Japanese wikipedia page can you actually read? |
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testorschoice
Posts: 468 |
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All that explains why some English speakers might insist that only non-Japanese comics can be called manga. But they don't explain why the Japanese licensors would object to non-Japanese comics being called manga, as implied earlier in the thread. Because Japanese licensors don't object. They also don't explain why Japanese people would not call a non-Japanese comic manga until it appeared in a Japanese bookstore, as implied earlier. Because Japanese people would call it manga either way.
I can read both of the pages. Same goes for the English counterparts. 
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Dargonxtc
 Posts: 4463 Location: Nc5xd7+ スターダストの海洋 |
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Well they are starting off well. They're pulling out of Comic Con. Isn't that a good place to rub shoulders with Hollywood types? Pitch an idea, get some backing for a project, and the like? |
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The Xenos
Posts: 1519 Location: Boston |
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Another interesting note, The Beat is reporting that two of the people laid off at TokyoPop were two of the editors defending the Pilot Program in the press release here at ANN. Well that's a crappy note to go out on.
http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/06/04/tokyopop-layoff-update/ |
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kokuryu
 Posts: 915 |
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That sucks. I want them to put out manga FASTER not slower...
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CCSYueh
 Posts: 2707 Location: San Diego, CA |
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There's several titles I've been following forever that should be close to ending. Rebirth is one. Same for Chronicles of the Cursed Sword. Isn't Dragon Knights finally ending? It seems like they could just let those finish & not start up new stuff. Balance out But they'll probably cancel stuff. I hope it's not Tactics after being rescued from ADV. |
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ilikehotaznz
Posts: 28 |
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I own at least a hundred mangas from Tokyopop including Love Hina, so this is a real disappointment for me.
Looking back at my manga collection, one thing strikes me as odd... I don't think I've ever bought a new manga. Everything in my collection is used, and that is what is hurting Tokyopop. Selling and buying used books and videos has the same effect on the industry as outright piracy. Once again, taking Love Hina for example, you can currently get the first volume for $0.30 on Amazon. The most expensive volume I could find is the 8th, and it's only $4.54. Keep in mind that when you purchase a used book or video, Tokyopop gets nothing. |
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mufurc
 Posts: 612 |
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Bitterness aside...  I don't think it's the actual sales they may have problems with, it's the attitude itself. TP is threatening their market, successfully or not (I mean, it's not like TP is happy for such low OEL sales). Why would they sell TP any more manga licenses? (Story time: when publishers started to deal with manga in my country, one of them started with TP's OEL stuff. New fans, mostly young people, lapped it up despite the generally low quality (the only good apple in the bunch was Dramacon) because it was OMG MANGA. By now, other publishers have licensed Naruto, Kenshin, Hellsing, Nana, Berserk and Angel Sanctuary, but that one publisher is still stuck with TP's products and licenses, and not even Fruits Basket or Love Hina but stuff like Pirontan, Devil's Bride, Star Trek and Mail Order Ninja. I wouldn't be surprised if the reason was that the Japanese simply don't want to deal with them.)
Also, think what you want about OEL being "manga" or not, the fact is that most of it sucks save for a handful of good/decent titles. If I were a Japanese publisher I probably wouldn't like it that TP is trying to associate the word I use to sell my product with such (generally) low-quality products, especially on new markets. But that's just me and I'm not a publisher, so... |
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enurtsol
 Posts: 14761 |
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Well, they got something the first time it was bought new, but yeah, for awhile now even Japanese publishers are affected by bookstores that trade in used manga.
Well, most manga sucks too, so it's not like they could get on their high horse. 
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mufurc
Posts: 612 |
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Could be, but this is not about high horses. Would you want to promote your products like "it's manga, like all those sucky books already out there"? Even if it does suck, I guess "frankly, it sucks but please buy it anyway" is not a very good promotion. 
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CCSYueh
Posts: 2707 Location: San Diego, CA |
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The used book market has been around for ages. I have lots of sci-fi I've bought used over the yrs. I don't see a lot of places like Del Rey going under.
I know the last comic-con panel was obsessively full of OEL info. It really seemed like they'd sunk their hearts into OEL & didn't really care about the Japanese stuff. I suspect the Japanese stuff is probably more expensive (It's my suspicion about the Korean titles also. There are some good Korean titles out there. I love King of Hell, & Rebirth. Red Rum was good as was Under the Glass Moon & INVU & I like Queen's Knight. TP isn't really that good overall with the Korean stuff. Ice Kunion had some good titles. Net has some good stuff. Or maybe it's they're going for titles overall that don't appeal to buyers. It seems they were picking up a lot of Korean titles that seemed to be styled on games or meant to appeal to the gaming crowd which I found pretty lifeless & predictable.) It probably makes sense to try to appeal to our domestic geek crowd, but it's a risky venture because there's no guarantee they'll buy into the look of manga. After all, manga & anime in Japan ARE aimed at least in part at their geek/otaku fanbase. I hated seeing that Star Trek promo, but I understood their goal. However, it seems their success has been from manga & the devotion to all of this other stuff is like saying "We don't care about you, we're pursuing those guys over there who've never given us a dime" to the bulk of their buyers. |
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Vulcannis
Posts: 41 |
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Bull. If a person sells a book, they get money which they may put towards buying a new book. Piracy, at least in the traditional physical and not hand-wavy IP sense, is direct competition with the publisher. One is how a normal market works, the other is market subversion and scummy behaviour. Hardly the same.
As it should be. Or are you arguing that when you sell your car Ford should get a cut? |
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The Xenos
Posts: 1519 Location: Boston |
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Japan actually has had a problem with used manga sales. Yet I really doubt it's that big of a dent in the American market. In Japan the used manga market is bigger, even if the manga market itself is too. I remember something before. Still, I don't think used manga sales are big enough in America to do that much damage. Plus it's one less used copy thus someone would pick up a new one.
Of course, technically, when you buy it new at a bookstore, TokyoPop doesn't directly get money either. They're buying the store's stock of the book store. if enough sell, they'd buy more. My local store has a bunch of manga sitting on the shelf. TokyoPop's already gotten paid for those whether I buy them or not. Not to mention the book distributor who takes its cut. |
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marie-antoinette
 Posts: 4136 Location: Ottawa, Canada |
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Actually, that's not true. Bookstores do not have to purchase books from the publisher, because books are 100% returnable to the publisher. Which means that if they don't sell, the bookstores will send them back. Sometimes they will only send the front covers back and destroy the rest of the book, which is why paperbacks have the notice on them that if you buy the book without it's cover it is stolen property. And thus, the publisher gets paid when the books have sold and after the bookstore has taken it's cut. The reason for this is to make it more appealing for a bookstore to order high numbers of a book, because then that book is going to have greater visibility within the store. This way, a store can do that without taking a financial risk of it's own. |
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