Forum - View topicRIGHT TURN ONLY!! - TP Attack
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littlegreenwolf
 Posts: 4796 Location: Seattle, WA |
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I'll quote Zac here from our previous Torren Smith thread animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6662&postdays=0&postorder=asc&topic_view=&start=0
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I agree completely. Also, darkhorse has never tried to branch out into shoujo manga. The thing manga has that the early 90s comic industry did not have is that half of their readers, if not more, are female. |
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The Ramblin' Wreck
 Posts: 924 Location: Teaching Robot Women How To Love |
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^^
Never underestimate Grrl Power. |
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Nani?
 Posts: 632 |
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What all these arguements come down to is this. Will the Manga boom continue and become part of the norm?
I say the answer is probably yes. We've already seen the comparison with the early 90's comic book market. The one thing to note was that Marvel and DC were reaching for the same fanboy audience and really not reaching outside the traditional fans. Compare this with the late 70's literary science fiction boom. There, Star Wars was a "gateway drug", introduceing people who would never pick up a science fiction novel to a field and expanding the market. In addition, there were almost fifty years of literary tradition built up with authors that are household names. I say manga more closely resembles the latter situation, though there is yet to be a breakawaymainstream hit. Like SF, it is pulling in more and more fans and is not dependant on it's traditional base. It has a "gateway drug" in the slow buildup of anime over the last 15 years or so and comes from long tradition that isn't even fully tapped. For example, I can think of two political dramas total that have been released in this country. All the Best, Nani? [/i] |
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ANN_Bamboo
ANN Contributor
 Posts: 3904 Location: CO |
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Ya know, I'm pretty sure all these presidents and CEOs have a better grasp of the current manga market than a bunch of college students on a forum. For one, the former group has people with degrees and a ton more experience in economics.
Just because some fans think a few titles are crap doesn't mean that Tokyopop only publishes junk, nor does it mean that the industry is caving. Just because you don't like a certain title doesn't mean that the company is falling into the clutches of doom. CEO + At least a masters in college + year of experience > anime fans with ~high school diploma/bachelors. |
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Aaron White
Old Regular
Posts: 1365 Location: Birmingham, Alabama |
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Oy. What I said was that her rhetorical style seems to be learned from cover copy. The reviews seem more like hype than reviews, even when negative, because the rhetoric is the rhetoric of advertising, not of evaluation. What can I learn from these reviews that I can't learn from Previews? Thumbs up or thumbs down? For an example of what comics reviews can be-short reviews that actually engage the work beyond a "This happens and then this happens and then there's this cool guy and you should buy it" level-check this out. http://www.tcj.com/259/r_honor.html |
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Vekou
 Posts: 329 |
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Uh... yeah, and? Just because we're not company execs better doesn't mean that we're not allowed to have our own opinions and predictions. What is wrong with the staff here? Freedom of opinion is looked down upon more at this board than any other I've ever been to... |
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Godaistudios
Posts: 2075 Location: Albuquerque, NM (the land of entrapment) |
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I think her issue is the presumptuous statements that seem to imply one knows better than the companies... as if one's suggestions to the company shows one knows better than the company already does.
Last edited by Godaistudios on Tue Jun 15, 2004 3:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Kagemusha
 Posts: 2783 Location: Boston |
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so, just because a company has people with buisness degrees planning their future, they can never skrew up and go bankrupt. gee, i wonder why it happens so often? the manga industry needs to be prepared for the possibility that manga will never go beyong the point its at now and plan for that situation (personally, i believe that manga will get bigger, but companys should still prepare for what could happen) i dont think the manga industry could ever just disappear at this point, just because of the nature of its fans. I've never met an anime/manga fan who has just decided to quit watching or reading. its not some fad. |
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Nani?
Posts: 632 |
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I'm not sure I agree with that logic. A masters and good grasp of economics are certainly useful skills but the abliity to scout talent and be in touch with the fan base seems to be more of "streetwise" skill that I doubt can be taught in a classroom. Look at the founders of Motown for example, not (I think) a college diploma among them or Stan Lee. Look at yourself and Lianncamp. You are both accepted as talented critics because of the knowledge you picked up in to some extent outside of classrooms. Contrast that with current American"enterainment industry" where Masters degrees are the norm and to earlier less "schooled" times (particularly in music) when talent was often recognised by intelligent people with a sense for scouting out quality who may or may not have a degree. Yes, the beancounters are important, but I don't really trust them with creative desicions. By the same token, not all fans are more articulate than "this stinks/that's cool".
That's certainly true. In fact, if you look at all the titles on a given shelf, you would probably would see more that your not inclined to buy then are. What that means is the companies are doing a good job of expanding the demagraphics. That's good for the industry and a sign that you'll get titles of what you do like in the long term even if they are a smaller percentage of what's availible. All the Best, Nani? Last edited by Nani? on Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:07 am; edited 1 time in total |
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lianncoop
Past ANN Contributor
 Posts: 1705 Location: Indiana |
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Hmm...was that meant as a playful insult or just as playful...? |
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Nani?
Posts: 632 |
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That was me writing and doing a p|$$ poor job of editing while having version of a name in stuck in my head that doesn't match reality. No insult was intended. I'm re-editing now. shitsurei shimasu, All the best, Nani? |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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"Freedom of opinion is looked down on"? What in blazes are you talking about? Has anyone here told you that you can't say what you want to say? What you're saying is that you should be allowed to run your mouth off in whatever topic and nobody but nobody should be able to say "I don't think you really know what you're talking about", which is what Bamboo said. A large number of people on these forums come in and immediately lay claim to some mystical expertise that they can't back up, can't prove and then go on to say things that are flat-out untrue. People like Bamboo and I get tired of it and eventually say "You probably don't know what you're talking about, man." and then we get flamed for trying to supress people's opinions. You're entitled to your opinion, we're entitled to telling you you're full of it. That's what 'free exchange' is. That's what 'conversation' is. When you run your mouth, people respond. Deal with that. |
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ANN_Bamboo
ANN Contributor
Posts: 3904 Location: CO |
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Everyone is entitled to write in whatever style they choose. The difference between a column like RTO and the reviews you linked is that Liann writes about every single volume of a series that comes out, not just an overall review. It's easy to take an overall series or a book and say, "The author craftfully takes his characters and spins a social commentary reminiscent of Camus," but it's not the case with individual reviews. If you're writing a paragraph-long blurb about Volume 4 of Hot Gimmick or something, you have to let people know what's in each volume. You can shoot off Camus and Pirsig all you want to, but if people don't know what goes on in Volume 4 of that specific series, then they can't tell the difference between Vol. 3, 4, 5, etc. Not every individual volume of Chobits has its own philosophy. Sometimes all that happens is someone eats a sandwich and finds a dollar. One of the complaints that Tankouban Tower got was that each mini-review of a volume could be for any book in the series, because it was too general. The first several Shelf Lifes got complaints because people said that there was too much review and not enough plot. For both columns, readers said that what they wanted was for someone to tell them vaguely what was going to happen, so they could decide, "hm.. do I want to spend $20 watching someone wash their clothes?" I'm not trying to defend Liann here, or argue your point, I'm just pointing out the difficulties of having reviews like the ones on the Comics Journal. In fact, thanks for linking them; they were an interesting read. |
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ANN_Bamboo
ANN Contributor
Posts: 3904 Location: CO |
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Uh... yeah, and that's not what I said. I never said you weren't allowed ot have your own opinion. "Freedom of opinion" is as much welcome here as it is anywhere else. Just because I don't agree with your opinion doesn't mean "OMG OPPRESSION!!" The whole point of my post was that a lot of people are coming onto the forum with a lot of presumptions that they believe to be the be all and end all of marketing and economics. There were posts in other Tokyopop threads saying things along the lines of "they don't know what they're doing, blah blah blah" Sure, everyone can have their own opinion. My comment was that these people probably have more knowledge of what the bigger picture is, since they would have more info (sales figures, market reports, etc). |
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Vekou
Posts: 329 |
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The vibe I'm getting here goes something like "Well, you're not in the industry and I seriously doubt you have any grasp of economics or marketing, so what do you know about anything? You're wrong, and now I'm going to exaggerate what you just said so it looks totally ridiculous... [does exactly that]."
Instead of, "Actually, you're wrong, and here's why... [insert valid and polite response here]." |
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