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Actar wrote:

Out of plane unadulterated curiosity, I have a question. Why does the Japanese pricing system irk people (foreign fans) so much? Is it because they are just not used to paying such large amounts for BDs/DVDs?

Because if the Japanese can afford it, there's no reason anybody else can't... Unless for some reason the people living in Japan just earn more or have a lower cost of living (which is obviously not the case...).

It's all a matter of comparison and expectations.

What if you went into a normal grocery store and they were selling cantaloupes for $120 each. Okay, sure, they come in a pretty box and are perfectly round and without blemish, but they're $120.

What would your reaction be?

Now in Japan they actually DO sell melons for 10,000 yen a pop, because of various cultural reasons and also that they're not so easy to grow in Japan. People in Japan don't find such a thing odd at all, and are happy to buy one for the appropriate special occasions.

But would you ever, EVER, consider actually buying a $120 melon yourself in your country? Even for a special occasion?

Now, in the case of anime, there's always the argument "but that's the only way its legally available", but that doesn't change people's visceral reaction: A bluray is a bluray, just like a melon is a melon (even though one might be the best damn melon in the entire world)

Nayu wrote:

Actar wrote:

Out of plane unadulterated curiosity, I have a question. Why does the Japanese pricing system irk people (foreign fans) so much? Is it because they are just not used to paying such large amounts for BDs/DVDs?

Because if the Japanese can afford it, there's no reason anybody else can't... Unless for some reason the people living in Japan just earn more or have a lower cost of living (which is obviously not the case...).

Its a sense of entitlement by western fans. I'm not sure where it came from, but in the past five or so years it has become really really annoyingly prevalent. I remember back in the day when we paid $35 for two episodes of Ranma 1/2, dub only, on magnetic tape in a huge plastic cassette. We also walked to school in the snow, uphill both ways.

And we liked it.

Oh great. Another geezer croaking out, "Ehhhhh, you whiny whippersnappers don't know how good you have it ... why, back in the day... blah, blah, friggedly blah."

Hey, more power to anyone who has the stratch to pay Japanese prices for shows - you know, $500ish for a single title. I'd like to keep my yearly anime budget to a manageable (for me) $2-3,000 a year. At Japanese prices that would mean 4-6 titles a year. Well, that would be one way to keep my backlog down, I guess.

Signed,

Another One of those Totally Unreasonable and Spoiled Anime Fans Who Likes to Own Anime But Doesn't Want to Go Bankrupt Doing It

JustinGallimore wrote:

I guess its not weird that the Japanese bd has dubs but how is the Japanese bd not actually intended for America?

Not America specifically, but English speaking (either as a first or second language) import buyers in general. Remember the prices that we are talking about ~ if the dub already exists, and including it on the BD helps to sell an additional 50 sets, its well worth the inclusion.

Remember, as also noted above, that the original rights owner gets the rights to the dub, done for the R1 DVD release, for free as part of the license contract for the localization. So the cost of adding an already available dub is low enough that it makes sense to just add an available English dub to a Japanese BD release as a matter of across the board policy.

The vague "us/them" above would then not be "English Speakers / Japanese Speakers", but rather "Regular North American physical media buyers / Japanese physical media import buyers".

Oh come on Blood-chan, its not like I'm a 1%er. I'm happy that prices have gone down and the medium has shifted to something that doesn't squeak when I play it. However, it is valid that prices for anime have fallen so far that some reasonable rise in price isn't the end of the world.

And honestly, a few higher quality, higher priced titles a year is superior to a deluge of random, poorly written, poorly drawn crap.

@Nayu - I am a relentless bargain hunter, but my bigger concern is to make sure that there continues to be a viable R1 distrib industry. To that end, I am prepared to pay niche-ish prices when necessary. I just don't want to be gouged, that's all.

Blood- wrote:

@Nayu - I am a relentless bargain hunter, but my bigger concern is to make sure that there continues to be a viable R1 distrib industry. To that end, I am prepared to pay niche-ish prices when necessary. I just don't want to be gouged, that's all.

I don't believe that we should take the low prices of the second and third rate anime as where pricing should be. We've always had low priced "budget" sets, such as "Don't leave me alone, Daisy" or "World of Narue" (actually, world of Narue was awesome but....) and premium sets like the El Hazard magnificent box. I don't see anything wrong with asking for a premium for higher quality product. I certainly don't feel that every anime should be priced like Garden of Sinners (which looks awesome on my shelf) but I feel that some shows do deserve to be priced appropriately. Its not like anyone gets bent out of shape that a Ferrari isn't sold for the same price as a Honda. (Well, unless you're a mindless tool like the vast majority of Occutards.)

Nayu wrote:

Blood- wrote:

@Nayu - I am a relentless bargain hunter, but my bigger concern is to make sure that there continues to be a viable R1 distrib industry. To that end, I am prepared to pay niche-ish prices when necessary. I just don't want to be gouged, that's all.

I don't believe that we should take the low prices of the second and third rate anime as where pricing should be. We've always had low priced "budget" sets, such as "Don't leave me alone, Daisy" or "World of Narue" (actually, world of Narue was awesome but....) and premium sets like the El Hazard magnificent box. I don't see anything wrong with asking for a premium for higher quality product. I certainly don't feel that every anime should be priced like Garden of Sinners (which looks awesome on my shelf) but I feel that some shows do deserve to be priced appropriately. Its not like anyone gets bent out of shape that a Ferrari isn't sold for the same price as a Honda. (Well, unless you're a mindless tool like the vast majority of Occutards.)

except for the fact that the prices are all high in Japan, they don't make "budget" anime, they just make anime that has a low budget and price it the same as the high budget anime. They just hope they get the 3,000 in sales to break even on.

Actar wrote:

Out of plane unadulterated curiosity, I have a question. Why does the Japanese pricing system irk people (foreign fans) so much? Is it because they are just not used to paying such large amounts for BDs/DVDs?

Because if the Japanese can afford it, there's no reason anybody else can't... Unless for some reason the people living in Japan just earn more or have a lower cost of living (which is obviously not the case...).

Many things, but the main thing is they indeed aren't used to paying that much. Though now, people consider even the Madoka DVD's (I'm leaving the BD and LE out of this.) severely overpriced, despite them costing the exact same price (Not at the MSRP) people used to pay in the singles era.

Sigh, there are even people who think S.A.V.E. releases from FUNimation are overpriced these days...

BTW, Japan's cost of living is higher, and their per capita is lower than North America.

Quote:

11 United States $47,200 2010 est.
22 Canada $39,400 2010 est.
38 Japan $34,000 2010 est.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html

Asrialys wrote:

Zilan wrote:

The DVD release is pretty damn good quality. I might pick this up if Aniplex USA releases it over here at a reasonable price.

Perhaps prepare for the "Import" tag...

Same here.

On the one hand, I'd LOVE this box set. A DRRR!! is what I've been waiting for with baited breath, but if it gets saddled with the same eye-popping sticker price as Fate/Zero? Fuhgettaboutit.

In my mind, a box set it supposed to offer the series collectively cheaper than the individual DVDs did. If it offers new content or enough extras, then it matches or almost matches what the singles cost, all fair, tride-and-true practices. But otherwise I think slapping a "Limited Edition" title on and hiking the price up higher than a Victorian housemaid's nightgown upon seeing a rat is a sad state of affairs indeed, especially for a niche market like this which is already struggling.

I dearly want to own spectacular series like Fate/Zero, but those $300+ fees (not even for the entire series?, my mind cries) scares me off every time.

Don't get me wrong, I've bought what other fans have bemoaned as "overpriced" anime before; Darker Than Black, Code Geass, Star Driver, etc.

I guess my issues are hypocritical, or self-solving. I'm not sure. Somewhere between dropping $80 for a LOTR extended edition and flipping out over the aforementioned $300+ pricetag, my brain gets a little fried, one could say.

In any case, hoping for the best with this DRRR!! box set. *crosses fingers* Otherwise I'll have to wait a few years and snatch it up at a con. My wallet just can't seem to support it all.

Ashen Phoenix wrote:

In my mind, a box set it supposed to offer the series collectively cheaper than the individual DVDs did.

It is. It would have cost you $700-800 to buy the R2 DVDs (assuming you were buying from Amazon.jp or somewhere else that offered a ~25% discount). So buying this BD set instead saves you several hundred dollars. Wink

Being a long time Japanese R2 collector, Japanese pricing is calculated from various factors. Things like demographic, ratings, and quarterly sales figure affect the price.

Somehow many people here haven't gotten over the shock of anime being so expensive. It's the harsh reality that hits foreign fans who either avoided or remained ignorant. Despite the hypes from vocal fans and other media, most anime titles don't have large audience at all and it doesn't compel potential mainstream audience to spend their money on DVDs and other merchandises.

Since most anime titles are niche, they don't expect to sell million copies with dirt low price. Even with the lower priced regular editions, most people aren't compelled to buy anime DVDs. It's like me watching a live action drama from DVR, but never buys the DVD or BD. Seriously, no matter how low the price, the sales figure is relatively the same or worse.

reanimator wrote:

Somehow many people here haven't gotten over the shock of anime being so expensive.

I just always like to point out that entertainment in Japan is generally more expensive compared to the US. I've spent a lot of money importing J-pop CDs for a good 6 years...and albums are much, much more expensive than the US.

Thank you very much guys for the interesting responses.

samuelp wrote:

But would you ever, EVER, consider actually buying a $120 melon yourself in your country? Even for a special occasion?

Yes, I do know they sell melons for a high price there and I've seen some of them in Japanese supermarkets over here.

However, I think your comparison is slightly flawed, because you are assuming that Japanese melons and regular melons are the exact same product, which they are not. While I won't pay $120 for any run of the mill melon, I would pay $120 for a Japanese Musk Melon (just not very often). It is because I know that the melon is specially grown/air imported from Japan that I know that it is worth the value... Cubic zirconia be cheaper than Diamonds, but they are not the same thing.

I find it interesting as I always feel that, when dealing with a foreign culture and foreign products, one should always alter one's own expectations.

Blood- wrote:

I'd like to keep my yearly anime budget to a manageable (for me) $2-3,000 a year. At Japanese prices that would mean 4-6 titles a year.

Which is fairly typical for a Japanese anime buyer.
You only buy the one or two shows per season that you really love.

Annf wrote:

Blood- wrote:

I'd like to keep my yearly anime budget to a manageable (for me) $2-3,000 a year. At Japanese prices that would mean 4-6 titles a year.

Which is fairly typical for a Japanese anime buyer.
You only buy the one or two shows per season that you really love.

Which is unfortunately why most anime video sales, even of those people generally think are good don't break even. An order of magnitude more people watch without buying. Fans of the source manga also don't buy. Even when they enjoy a show, the fanbase as you mentioned, have to be very very picky at those prices. It's also why anime or its franchise related merchandise matters a lot to the rights holders, which has a much much larger market share since more can afford it.

On the other hand, this indicates potential. The interest and the market is definitely there. There are Japanese fans who ARE willing to buy when the prices are significantly lower as I've cited here. In fact, reverse importation wouldn't be considered a problem if this were not the case.

In any case, Aniplex is aware that not all shows are worth the same to everyone so they too are careful not to price themselves out of the market so only a handful are made available at JP prices here (out of the tons Aniplex produces)

Actar wrote:

Thank you very much guys for the interesting responses.

samuelp wrote:

But would you ever, EVER, consider actually buying a $120 melon yourself in your country? Even for a special occasion?

Yes, I do know they sell melons for a high price there and I've seen some of them in Japanese supermarkets over here.

However, I think your comparison is slightly flawed, because you are assuming that Japanese melons and regular melons are the exact same product, which they are not. While I won't pay $120 for any run of the mill melon, I would pay $120 for a Japanese Musk Melon (just not very often). It is because I know that the melon is specially grown/air imported from Japan that I know that it is worth the value... Cubic zirconia be cheaper than Diamonds, but they are not the same thing.

I find it interesting as I always feel that, when dealing with a foreign culture and foreign products, one should always alter one's own expectations.

Rather than comparing between different cultures, countries or environments, instead imagine within the same environment or place if EVERY melon costs $120.

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