Forum - View topicNEWS: California's AM2 to Host Japanese Girl Band Scandal
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toyNN
 Posts: 252 Location: Seattle, WA |
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Now I'm going... love to see Scandal perform in person... should be fun
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soulfringe
Posts: 18 |
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Can't say I am thrilled about this. I hate to sound like this, but I really don't wish AM2 the best of luck.
I like seeing a con put together an awesome line up like this. I really do. But I do NOT ever want to see conventions doing what they are doing. If you don't know what I am talking about, look at the date and location of AM2. It takes place in Anaheim during the same weekend as Anime Expo. Conventions are and should be a time for fans to get together in fellowship, along with fantastic industry guests. Like minded people together celebrating their hobby. But It seems to me that AM2 has lost sight of that. Doing what they are doing at the when and where is an open deceleration of War against AX. As fans it's like being forced to pick between your divorcing parents. It's a situation they really shouldn't have put the fans in. Brothers and Sisters are being split apart by bickering parents. Anyways, as much as I would love to go to AM2, I have long since booked my reg and hotel for AX. I also just can't support them because it appears to have been made with ill intent. |
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jmaeshawn
 Posts: 170 |
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O.O Haven't seen Scandal since they came to Sakura Con 3 years ago!
So glad they are coming back to the US!!! 
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TokyoGetter
 Posts: 416 Location: CA. You can tell by the low moral standards. |
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Hi Soulfringe.
I am working to put on the AM2 event and acting as an assistant organizer and social media dude. At the risk of completely overstepping my bounds, I would like to address some of your concerns because I feel you're making some rather heavy inferences here that are simply not true.
You are aware that these kind of scheduling conflicts happen all of the time, right? There are dozens and dozens of cons in North America alone, and a lot of them happen at the same time. Southern California is a massive urban center with millions and millions of people that has hundreds of entertainment events happening at different venues every single night of the year. I'll get into this deeper below, but I want you to keep that in mind.
An "open declaration of war" would be... um... open. I'm a loudmouth, and a lot of people would tell you that I'd probably be bitching, screaming, and complaining at great volume if there was a "war" at hand. Heck, several of them work for ANN! But alas, no. That's just the way it came down when we looked at time windows, planning, what worked best, availability, etc. The main promoter behind AM2 himself has openly said "nah, no beef" in numerous places and even in press releases. I believe he's even said it on the ANN podcast! Still people think we're sitting at home twiddling our mustaches and laughing like madmen. It certainly sounds more dramatic and daring than the truth, where we're all working multiple jobs, doing as much planning as we can, prepping content, and going to school, but it's just not the case. I don't even have a mustache! We are not forcing any decision on anybody. We have said "hey, check out both if you want!" Seriously, come on by and if you dislike it, that's cool. I think you WILL like it though, and we're working hard to have an event that we'd feel comfortable with both as fans and as con-goers. It's important to us, and that's our goal.
A free convention held during a major economic recession is indicative of ill intent in your book? Again, there's no drama and no beef. A lot of people are going off saying otherwise, and yeah there's not really a big surplus of plausible deniability cool-aid to pass around, but the truth of the matter is the truth of the matter. I understand what people think, but it would be WAY TOO MUCH WORK if this was just an exercise in passive aggression. Think of it this way: I am a diehard fan of music. I have often had to choose between seeing one of two out-of-town touring bands who had booked shows on the same night at different venues months in advance. At either of these shows I'd get to hang out with people who shared my love, passion, and interest in music, and I could have felt like I was missing out if I picked one over the other. But I never felt like calling Shellac a bunch of perfidious and conniving jerks because they were playing the same night as Matthew Sweet. I hope you understand where we are coming from. Please let me know if I can clear anything else up for you. |
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enurtsol
 Posts: 14761 |
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Dunno much about AM2's history, but during the great schism regarding Anime Expo's direction years ago, some staff split off. 
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Skullflame
 Posts: 9 |
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Ah, if AX wasn't at the same time I would so go.
If AM2 did not plan their con at the same time as AX as a declaration of war, whoever planed that date is a complete idiot. You can not plan without considering your surroundings, convenient or not. First, thinking about yourself, because it's located near AX, you hinder the number of potential people who would attend. Take the Chevy Nova for example. It completely failed in Spanish speaking countries because it's name translated to Doesn't Go. They didn't think of where they're promoting, and as a result crippled their potential sales. Second, your public image is seen as we are at war with AX, regardless of what your stand is. You can say your not all you want but few people are going to hear you or believe you. Companies do it all the time, we are not competing with so and so, and when things go well for them, they rub it in the other companies face, other wise they have something to fall back on. I'm looking at you Nintendo <3. So either whoever is promoting you is very aggressive, or they fail at their job. Take your pick. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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There's a mountain of drama and a metric ton of beef. This is nonsense. The drama + beef isn't why AM2 is happening - you guys are very clearly dedicated to this event and want to make it special for the people who attend. There's a lot of enthusiasm and I think that's awesome. But to suggest that there is absolutely no rivalry here is ridiculous. People aren't stupid, and many of us have some sense of history. We would genuinely appreciate it if you wouldn't treat us like we're stupid and can't see the obvious. |
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TokyoGetter
Posts: 416 Location: CA. You can tell by the low moral standards. |
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I wrote an honest and sincere response to a concerned user who posited that what I've been working very hard on is innately unfair to fans, and he got what I was trying to say. (Edit: It seems his really fair and well-written reply post is gone now, so I don't know if you saw it.) I hardly see that as treating people like idiots, and with all due respect I resent being told that I'm trying to do that. Can I speak for every single person involved? Realistically no. But I can assure you that I didn't enter into a teenage blood feud with anybody when I took on my gig last year. Rivalry? Again not from my personal end. Allow me to rephrase it and to put the onus directly on myself: in MY dealings on a day to day basis in MY work life that pertains to this thing there has been no malice and no conflict. People have been cool all the way down the board and I've been involved in far smaller events that seemed like hostage negotiations compared to this. But some people just want blood. Life's too short and I'm too old. There's no dartboard in my house with an AX logo on it. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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He didn't respond to you so I don't know why you'd tell me that he "got what you were trying to say" without any evidence suggesting such a thing, but OK.
Nobody "wants blood". Nobody thinks that you're the bad guy. Nobody's said anything like that. At least not here. At the same time nobody wants to see that you are obviously launching a competing event, competing for the same exact demographic, the same exact fans, in the same area on the same weekend and then be told that you are not actually competing. It might not be a "teenage blood feud" but good lord man, this is like competing with your neighbor's Labor Day barbeque with your own barbeque, telling everyone in the neighborhood that the hot dogs and coleslaw at your event are free and then insisting that nobody notice the extremely obvious crap going on. People are gonna love your food either way and some will go to one event and some to another, but this attitude is an insult to our intelligence. Drop the artifice and people will stop asking these questions and pushing you on it, I guarantee it. |
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Nayu
Posts: 676 |
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You like Matthew Sweet, you can do no wrong. 
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TokyoGetter
Posts: 416 Location: CA. You can tell by the low moral standards. |
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Zac I could have sworn that there was a response here earlier from Soulfringe. Where it went, I don't know, but it was here. I spoke to him via Twitter regardless and in the future I'll avoid mucking up your forums... because now I'm Colony Drop emo-boy fodder.
I dig your points, and I know that people are going to think what they're going to think. I just want people to know that we haven't sat around trying to bum people out. I can't control that, just like I couldn't control the weather, the natural color of my hair, or my love for the Wu Tang Clan. But I wanted to give it a try and have said my peace, and I see what people mean. Thanks for hearing me out ya'll. Sleep well. (Hot damn I want potato salad now.) |
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soulfringe
Posts: 18 |
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I did have a response. I deleted it. I felt like I was being uncouth after reflecting on it.
Essentially it came down to me saying that I might have been quick to judge, but regardless of my quick, that this was definitely going to detract from AX attendance and could have been planned better. I have already seen handfuls of people voicing their decisions of "AX or AM^2". There was even a facebook poll. And it is exactly this stuff that really has me upset. I have a couple friends who have already "screw AX, I'm going to to AM2." So I already see some of that result of detraction. Whether or not the scheduling was made with ill intent or not, the results remain. Especially with WCS, there will no doubt be less cosplay at AX. I really hope this does not spurn the future growth of AX. I want to see it grow to a much larger level of attendance and awesomeness. |
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toyNN
Posts: 252 Location: Seattle, WA |
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Dang I'd forgotten about the AX staff split stuff from a few years back and take it that AM2 is atleast part of that result.
Compete how ever you feel you need to I guess - having it the weekend before would make kind of more sense imho - but either way I'm going to see Scandal. |
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anemayfan
 Posts: 66 |
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I'm going to both AX and AM^2 (Mainly for SCANDAL).
The big downside is I am going to be forced to split my time between two great events where I would have loved to have been able to devote full time to each one. 
I'm hoping that there really wasn't any ill intent from AM^2 when scheduling was decided, but any fan of anime / manga who lives in southern California "should" know that AX has traditionally held their event during the 4th of July weekend. I've been aware of this ever since my first AX back in 1997. Granted there have been times when AX didn't fall on the 4th of July, but typically it is usually the first weekend of July. It really was poor choice of scheduling to put AM^2 opposite AX. Most of my friends are split over this. The ones who cosplay a lot will be at AM^2. The ones who don't cosplay are sticking to AX. And finally a few of us are having to split our time between the two which means we'll miss many events from both conventions we normally would enjoy attending. I believe it would have been better for both conventions if they weren't scheduled on the same weekend. Preferably at least a week separating them would have been heaven for fans out there. Back to back weekends of anime, manga & music would have made this summer into a dream. My friends wouldn't have to be forced to decide between the two and likely would have attended both. I'm still waiting for the programming schedules of both events to come out so I can work out the logistical nightmare of which convention I will be at during what day and at what specific time for what event. So instead of just making decisions on what workshop to go to or what anime showing go to or what group I'd like to see perform live, I have the added stress of figuring out which convention is hosting said events during which day. Which in the end could have been avoided with different scheduling. I'm hoping the best for both conventions, but scheduling like this will only serve to hurt both events in the long run because they divide the same fan-base. |
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PatrickD
Posts: 93 Location: California |
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I won't be attending either convention, but have been watching this play out from the east coast. I don't have a horse in this race, so I'm relatively unbiased. I attended AX from 2000 to 2005, but stopped going since there was really no reason for me to travel across the country when I had large conventions on the east coast I could attend. I harbor no ill will towards either event, however, I absolutely agree with people who are pointing out there is drama. Hell, the very existence of this debate is undeniable proof of that.
We know for a fact that at least some of the higher-ups at AM2 were once working for AX, so therefore we also know that they are fully aware that Anime Expo is always on July 4th weekend. Just about anyone in southern California who is an anime fan is aware of that and certainly anyone who goes to conventions is aware. There is simply no way anyone can believe that AM2 selecting July 4th weekend was an accident. That means that AM2 selected to be on the same weekend as AX (and at the same location AX has used previously) completely on purpose. I don't ever recall hearing a reason from AM2 as to this scheduling, but there are only two reasons I can think of as to why they would do this: Possible Reason #1: They wanted people who were in town for AX to be able to attend their event. I suppose they could think, "Hey, we're starting up this new thing. Let's make it free and put it on the same weekend so people can come on over and check us out." That might have worked last year when AM2 (under its old name Club 2 the MAX) was within walking distance of AX, but I really can't buy this argument when it's 30 miles away since anyone coming in from out of town is unlikely to have a car. As far as I know, AM2 is not providing a shuttle service. Possible Reason #2: They want to hurt AX and siphon off attendees. This is the reason I see and that it seems most people see. By placing it on the same date, they want to force people to choose not to go to AX. Yes, some will go to both, but a lot of people aren't going to want to travel back and forth. Think about it this way, if you are not acting in the best interests of your own convention and are just out to hurt another convention, what would you do? Schedule your convention on that convention's date. If you are making a convention and want to make it successful, one of the most essential things to do is NOT pick a date that is near the date for a more established convention. Go to that convention, leave flyers, talk to people, but do not be scheduled near it. Put enough time between that event and yours to give wallets time to recover. (Even if your event is free, there are hotel and transportation costs.) Forcing anime fans to choose is a terrible thing. AM2 could be quite successful on its on, but I feel as if it's hurting itself and not meeting its own potential by going up against AX. The ONLY reason I can think of why they would hurt themselves would be if they could hurt AX at the same time. If this was a naval sea battle, AM2 would be launching all its cannons towards AX. Meanwhile, everyone on the USS Anime Expo would be saying, "I'm sorry, did you just hear something?" This battle seems rather one-sided. |
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