Forum - View topicNEWS: ADV Court Documents Reveal Amounts Paid for 29 Anime Titles
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walw6pK4Alo
 Posts: 9322 |
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Finally, it's nice to see actual numbers for what licensing actually does give back to the producers. From what I've heard about Bamboo Blade and other series, shows can run between something like 75,000 to 120,000 per episode to produce. So are licensing fees really only a small factor to help the bottom line? It certainly doesn't appear like licensing can possibly be determining what series are considered successful and thus what will get made more often, no wonder Japanese companies are moving to the more expensive way of distributing anime internationally.
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vulcanraven01
Posts: 677 |
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No wonder they went belly up.
746,665 for Guvyer? 780,000 for Air Gear? 960,000 for Kurau: Phantom Memory? 780,000 for Pumpkin Scissors? Bear in mind this is without costs for productions and distribution, etc. Still, some real bargains within the stinkers. |
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chrisc1978
 Posts: 363 |
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Its not like the titles would transfer back to ADV if Funimation wins and ADV gives Funimation the 8 million. Funimation already made a profit on all these animes. I am sure were not getting the whole story but i'm pissed, instead of coming out with blu-rays Funimation hurried and sold them as S.A.V.E. collections.
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ArsenicSteel
 Posts: 2370 |
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Agreed. I love actual numbers and wish there were more situations that allowed for us to see them for this side of the anime industry. |
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jmfsilenthill
 Posts: 1863 Location: Chinese cartoons are srs biz |
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$960,000 for Kurau? I'm sure that was a good investment (even though I like the show)
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Prede
 Posts: 388 |
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I saw these documents a few days ago and commented on them. I do think this post is leaving a few important details out however. Like:
*ADV had 3 Sojitz employees working in their office as part of the ARMS deal. *ADV claims they were working in the best interest of Sojitz, not ADV *ADV claims ARMS overpaid for these licences (on purpose) *ADV claims they lost control of the company to these executives from Sojitz *ADV claims Sojitz failed to pay millions of dollars to the Japanese licensers Might want to add this to the news article, if you find it relevant. My exact post:
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bayoab
Posts: 831 |
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Believe Sgt Frog is only season 1 (26 eps) based on later documents.
Also, the top titles with the not-exact 000 numbers were partially paid for since the sheet is for balance remaining. Everything after a certain point is definitely the exact licensing fees. |
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Surrender Artist
 Posts: 3264 Location: Pennsylvania, USA |
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It would be really fascinating, but almost surely impossible, to have the production and market costs as well as sales figures so we could understand just what they lost on all of this.
Nearly a million dollars for Kurau: Phantom Memory?! How on Earth did that seem like a sensible deal? It might be a good series, but I can't imagine anybody expecting it to be the kind of sure-fire hit that would justify that kind of cost. Red Garden and Pumpkin Scissors were, I believe, notorious flops; all the more so given the high fees paid. I'm slightly surprised that Le Chevalier d'Eon wasn't even costlier. I imagine that it was not a great success. UFO Ultramaiden Valkyrie, on the other hand, seems like it might have been one of the few really good deals that they made. Although if it refers to one of the latter two 'seasons', which were only six and four episodes long, it might be less so. Bubbles always look so foolish in retrospect and it's particular stark when that foolishness is quantified. It's especially strange since I was 'on sabbatical' from anime during this period, so the particulars are mostly new to me. Last edited by Surrender Artist on Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Crisha
Moderator
 Posts: 4290 |
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Yeah, saw this yesterday on Crunchyroll's site. I think this basically boils down to overestimating the market and poor business decisions from both sides.
Oh yeah, and f*** Sojitz. With them appointing three executives to ADV, including the CFO and Chief Strategy Officer, it sounds like ADV didn't have the final say in matters including what could be licensed and how much for. Conflict of interest. |
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Prede
Posts: 388 |
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ADV claims both that Sojitz overpaid for these shows, and that they had lost control of specific aspects of their company. Considering ADV's previous opposition to licensing the Original Eva movies because the 1 million dollars was too much (and that's a proven property), I put some real weight behind their statement here. Why would they then later be willing to pay so much for an unknown show? Of course licenses across the board had risen during the boom, but still. I'd think a hostile move by Sojitz to purposely overpay for titles and then to charge ADV fees and try to make a quick buck out this whole situation would explain a lot. It makes more sense then ADV just making terrible license choices and overpaying for them. ADV may have very well picked these shows, but they claim they had no control over how much they paid for them. I'd like to believe that. Again this is only what ADV claims, I'm sure the people at Sojitz would say something completely different. Everyone has their story... |
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bradc
 Posts: 152 |
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Looks like ADV was biting more than they can chew; the license company wasn't even mature enough to handle itself, comparison with FuniAnimation which sets them apart with their marketing strategies. ADV/Geneon(Pioneer) releases were disappointing way back when they release Saiyuki Reload. Poorly packaging with copy and paste logo on existing logo....
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Big Hed
 Posts: 1607 Location: Melbourne, Australia |
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40% of the total expenses on 4 titles... Wow.
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Fifth B
 Posts: 213 |
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I've seen this a couple times now, but the shock never weakens. I still can't believe they paid 780,000 a pop for Pumpkin Scissors and Tokyo Majin. And as much as I loe the show, I have to wonder how the hell anybody came to the conclusion that Kurau was worth nearly a million dollars. That must have hurt them pretty bad. Also, am I the only one surprised by hw relatively cheap Air was for them? I thought the Key/Kyoto Animation shows were much costlier than that.
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Tenebrae
Posts: 486 |
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Oh wow... oh wow. Boggles the mind. I'm willing to bet that most of the items on that list remained in the red. There's no way they could have recouped the money they put on, for example, Coyote Ragtime Show, Pumpkin Scissors or Tokyo Majin; they're all trash. Now Kurau might have been a better money maker, but make a million? Nah.
edit: I know! Let's blame piracy! Yeah, that's the ticket! Last edited by Tenebrae on Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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walw6pK4Alo
Posts: 9322 |
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I think 009-1 for 325,000 is one of the biggest offenders on that list. It's not that good a series, it's not really that good looking either, and I can't hope to think it made any money back. It's also half the length of some other shows that were far better, and less expensive.
The best deal on that list is Underwater Ray Romano. I wonder how they got that for such a low price. |
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