Forum - View topicANNCast - Viewers Like You: I Think Therefore I Rant
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Oh that's rich from Zac.
Last week he was making fun of people who don't blindly love a series and instead point out flaws. This week he's wondering as to when it became acceptable for those who blindly love a series that they stuff down their gullet to hate on fans who don't think the same way. Trying to have a bob each way, eh? |
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Spotlesseden
Posts: 3514 Location: earth |
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the caller that trying to seek approval is sad. If people don't want to discuss with you, then sorry that's too bad. I don't agree with people in this forum and people still discuss with me.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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This is happening only inside your head where "we find your endless nitpicking obnoxious and don't really see what the big deal is" equals "blind unthinking love". Not agreeing with you and thinking that your constant pedantry is annoying does not make us mindless, in spite of what your ridiculous ego tells you. I don't blindly "love" Space Pirates just because I don't give a shit about the skirts thing and think your complaints about it are worthless dorky nitpicking. Christ. |
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vinamara
 Posts: 229 |
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People are fanatical about certain shows because those shows connect with the viewers in a deep emotional manner. People identify themselves with that show because their innermost fragile feelings are evoked or reflected by that show.
Their opinions are fueled by their treasured sentiments earned by that show, so naturally people become defensive or protective of their favorite shows. (I'll admit I too fall prey to that occasionally). People fail to understand that some people don't perceive their favorite show in the same spirit or enthusiasm, which by the way, differs from person to person based on time, age, personal propensities, circumstances and so on. This ultimately leads to them being forced to prove that their favorite show is perfect in all areas, which they believe is a way to show their love/zeal for that show. Disagreements should simply be exercised in moderation and in a disciplined manner. There is no need to trample other people's perspectives or force one's opinions on others. And I totally agree with Zac about how opinions should be presented. You don't have to glorify or crush something you feel extremely about just because someone has different tastes that don't match yours. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Zac, you only found what I was saying obnoxious because you didn't like your favourite show of the season being criticised, however large or small.
As I said in the previous ANNCast thread, I was not endlessly nitpicking. Yeah, I mentioned it in the Winter 2012 Preview Thread. Then people replied to me and I replied to them, then they kept on replying to me and me to them. That's normal Forum behaviour, not me being obnoxious. Then you guys revived it in the ANNCast. Bamboo referred to me specifically and then you chimed in with your own attack. I replied to that in the comments, which again is perfectly normal. Then people replied to me, and again my subsequent replies were merely responding to those replies. I did not bring it up out of the blue in the ANNCast, and I did not engage in "constant pedantry". Dude, just listen to yourself. Read your post again. That tone? Those insults? That defensiveness? That's what we call being a blind rabid jerkarse, A.K.A. a fanboy. You're no different from a Narutard, except you just happen to use bigger words and can spell. That's it. Last edited by dtm42 on Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:00 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Splitter
 Posts: 1276 Location: Knockin' on Heaven's Door |
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So Zac sees progressive LGBT anime as series where a LGBT couple that where the focus isn't on their relationship and it's just seen like a normal thing and it's not paid special attention to the fact that they're LGBT?
Watch Kanamemo. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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100% not true. Slam it all you like; I didn't make the damn thing, I hold no personal stake in its success. I am, however, perfectly entitled to find your complaints worthless and your nitpicking annoying, regardless of how many people bait you into it. When the rooster won't stop crowing at sunrise, I don't get irritated with the sun. The fact that you're now telling me I'm just a dumb mindless fanboy blindly in love with this show because I think you and your pedantry are obnoxious is... well, that says a lot more about you and your ego than it does about me, buster. |
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sainta
 Posts: 989 |
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I really don't think that there is a problem with samesex relationships in anime/manga, at least in Japan. Clamp is known for their use of homosexual relationship in series such as Tokyo Babylon, and it was a pretty good series in my opinion.
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SoandSo
 Posts: 204 |
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Just a quick aside, not at all related with the...thing involving dtm... What if you had made it? How would you react, or how do you think people should react, when something they put actual work into is critiqued or torn apart or whatever? I don't ask as an attempt to browbeat you with some "Put yourself in the artist's shoes'" argument. I'm just curious cause you've hinted at that side of the creator-critic relationship before. I'm sure nobody here is unfamiliar with the kneejerk, hypersensitive reactions from artists or creators on Deviantart, Youtube, you name it, towards criticism, however constructive and especially if put in blunt or harsh words. Unless something is couched in the fluffiest, most harmless discourse possible or undercut with constant mumbling of "IMHO", it doesn't count as constructive criticism, they'll chase you off, call you arrogant or an idiot or whatever else, and the firestorm ensues. Do you feel that's warranted, or at least a bit understandable? |
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P€|\||§_|\/|ast@
 Posts: 3498 Location: IN your nightmares |
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I don't think it's necessarily accurate to lump teens as a group who tends to have this ick attitude about gays and lesbians. I think youth can also be a virtue in that regard, and older folk like me may harbor more traditionalistic sentiments that insist on resisting progressive attitudes. So it goes both ways with all age groups. Maturity is not the only prerequisite to becoming open-minded and accepting of others for being different. I find in a lot of sites aimed at teens I visit with blogs and forums, the majority of young people have the right mindset about recognizing GLBT as normal people, just like themselves, whether or not they are GLBT themselves.
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Surrender Artist
 Posts: 3264 Location: Pennsylvania, USA |
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I tend to be a little uncertain of the portrayal of homosexual, particularly lesbian, relationships in anime because I fret over the intent of the creators. While I somehow doubt that Kunihiko Ikuhara was making an exploitation series, but the motives behind the folks who made Destiny of the Shrine Maiden were probably less pure and I tend to be pessimistic about this sort of thing. I find them fascinating, yet I can’t help but doubt my motives and worry that I might just be sublimating some more prurient interest into a veneer of respectability. With homosexual relationships, it’s easy stumble into feeling that only a very restrictive portrayal that avoids anything susceptible to fetishization is permissible. This ends up being a perversely well-intended desire to limit or marginalize portrayals of homosexual relationships for fear of exploiting them. (I remember a thread several months ago wherein several people by very well-meaning accident started thinking that a woman could be character only in very limited circumstances, whereas a man was implicitly more versatile, so that the portrayal would not be sexist)
To some degree, a certain amount of prurient interest can’t be avoided; people will sexualize anything, such that even innocuous portrayals might function as exploitative. Then again, portrayals of men and women in relationships can be seen both as emotionally and dramatically genuine or as exploitative depending upon context and attitudes, whereas portrayals of homosexual ones err on the exploitative side. A man and woman kissing can easily seem innocent, but make it a matched set and the reaction isn't quite the same. I suspect that it will be surprisingly tricky to get past instinctively reacting, "oh my!" to a man and man or woman and woman kissing or embracing to some sort of normality, which might require a few things that make a point of portraying such relationships. I honestly don't know and I don't have a particularly good perspective to judging. Oddly, perhaps coïncidentally, I’ve become more interested in and sympathetic toward homosexual subjects because of anime, in some significant part because I’ve been reading Okazu. (An episode about the subject, or on a double-bill with something like sexism and misogyny could be really interesting, although it would probably also make for the best forum thread ever) I haven’t seen the animated version of Wandering Son, but I loved the first volume of the manga and I’m very much looking forward to reading the second volume, which was delivered to me today. The Adventure Time affair was irritating. I yearn for an America where cares even a little about loudmouth moral authoritarians. I’m slightly optimistic myself. I once saw a wonderful chart of young people’s attitudes on homosexual marriage by state that showed a majority of youth opposed only in deepest darkest Dixie.
This seems more than a little backwards to me. I doubt that the video was pulled and that people were fired because of any association with 4chan, but instead because of a fear of a backlash against any overt association of homosexuality with youth entertainment. If the pictures had been of Finn and Princess Bubblegum embracing et cetera or the video intimating a heterosexual relationship, this probably would not have happened. Persistent intolerance and social marginalization are the story here, not internet grudges. ----------------------------------------------- I watched the original Mobile Suit Gundam on Toonami too. I remember a daily ritual of a roast beef sandwich and an episode of Mobile Suit Gundam. Last edited by Surrender Artist on Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:52 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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Cecilthedarkknight_234
 Posts: 3820 Location: Louisville, KY |
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I forgot about that series and it was a serious relation ship between those two characters but more seem to be okay with yuir over yaoi but them comes other things. I have a friend that's into anime but hates any gay relationships due to his own moral reasons, you can't help the way you where raised. I also want to point out the two major series that did a serious yuri relation ship was aoi hana, Sasameki Koto and did it quite well imo. There needs to be more like, hell I would take only one a year if given. Don't get me wrong I loved yuru yuri for it was but sometimes it's nice to watch something with more meat on the bone. |
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Splitter
Posts: 1276 Location: Knockin' on Heaven's Door |
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It would be really nice if Japan gave us another Takako Shimura. Alas... Actually, now that I think about it. I think there are a lot more "serious" yuri than there are yaoi. I'd actually like a serious yaoi. The only one I've seen thus far that is remotely close is Antique Bakery,. which I really enjoyed. |
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Megiddo
 Posts: 8360 Location: IL |
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That's because yuri is mostly Class S stuff about girls in middle/high school feeling affection for their upperclasswoman. There is very little yuri focusing on the sexual nature of the relationship, but a ton dealing with the progress from friends to more-than-friends. I'm not sure I would say that yuri is more 'serious' than yaoi, but the latter definitely has a much larger concentration on the sexual nature of a relationship, and much less about that transition from just friends to more than that.
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Splitter
Posts: 1276 Location: Knockin' on Heaven's Door |
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So then in order to have a progressive yaoi or a progressive yuri, they follow different paths. A progressive yaoi would have to put sex on the backburner and focus more on the couple's relationship and a progressive yaoi would have to be about physical contact and taking things beyond the "Catholic school greenhouse", and not just as cheap comedy or cheesecake either. |
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