Forum - View topicKatanagatari (TV).
|
Goto page Previous Next |
| Author | Message | |||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
egoist
 Posts: 7762 |
|
|||||
|
But she still resides in my heart.
... and as we all know, that's what matters! She was a favourite in the series, but I didn't consider her that special. Perhaps the character design failed to hit where it should. Snowflake and Penguin were very cute characters, though. |
||||||
|
||||||
r3vival
 Posts: 56 |
|
|||||
|
Don't get me wrong I don't have anything against a sad ending, no qualms there. I just get more critical of a show when it decides to spoiler[kill off the characters I have grown to love] so I guess I have a tendency to throw it on the hot seat. Either way it was a fun ride and no matter how it ends it won't take away from that but the last episode for sure will effect how I feel about the series as a whole in retrospect.
|
||||||
|
||||||
|
egoist
Posts: 7762 |
|
|||||
|
That's it then. The ending wrapped up quite nicely.
It was really, really, refreshing to see him act like his sister. It also felt outstandingly good to see spoiler[her die]. I still can't believe they spoiler[killed his sister] too soon. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
GeminiDS85
Posts: 391 |
|
|||||
|
I was enormously impressed with the ending of Katanagatari. spoiler[The happy, sentimental ending that I feared was looming as a possible scenario did not come to fruition, and I could not be happier with the final outcome. Togame’s departure from the realm of the living was an absolute masterstroke for the series. Her didactic confession served not only to enlighten the identity starved Shichika but to discover a sense of self-worth in her otherwise vain existence. I would be curious to read how others interpreted her confession. Did you believe her confession, part of it, or did you think that it was all lies? I would argue that Togame had intended to kill Shichika from the beginning, but if she would have actually gone through with it is completely up for debate.]
Overall, Katanagatari was my unsurpassed jewel of the 2010 anime calendar. Final Grade: Very Good |
||||||
|
||||||
Kruszer
 Posts: 7987 Location: Minnesota, USA |
|
|||||
|
I don't know I have mixed feelings about the ending. spoiler[While Shichika's single man rebellion and annihilation of the swords, their new masters, Emonzaimon, and the Shogun was totally epic, I can't help but feel cheated that he didn't kill the backstabbing princess too who also deserved it. Instead she becomes his lovesick tagalong? Say what now?]
|
||||||
|
||||||
Blood-
 Bargain Hunter Posts: 23884 |
|
|||||
|
I, too, am unsure how I feel about the ending. Right now, having just finished the eppie, I feel somewhat unsatisfied while at the same time having a vague appreciation of how things went down. Westerner that I am, naturally a large chunk of my story-telling yearning includes a conventional happy ending. That part of me spoiler[goes unfulfilled, of course. On the other hand, the ending does have a poignancy and power it might lack, otherwise.]
I have a feeling it will take me a while to finally settle on a lasting judgment of the ending, which is kind of an interesting and unusual viewing experience for me. What is not in doubt is my love for this series. Loved the look, loved the characters, loved the humour - loved it all (with an asterisk by the ending). I'd buy this puppy in a heartbeat (especially on BD). |
||||||
|
||||||
|
juan2ce
Posts: 1 |
|
|||||
|
I really really loved this anime. I which I could express it better but I am not that good with words. This has become the first work I have seen from Nisio Isin, are bakamonogatari and the others better? And I was wondering if there was any difference between the light novel and the anime.
|
||||||
|
||||||
Mister V
 Posts: 1000 |
|
|||||
|
Oooo. I didn't see this coming. Togame certainly played her role really well, and they managed to keep it all bittersweet to the very end. Also, I think Shichika's voice actor's performance was really quite good - he really did sound like he was fighting back tears.
Badass Shichika is of course epic, but that sequence is... weird. I'd hoped a battle against all of them at once. Though, hmm... I confess having mixed feelings towards the ending, but at least they kept to their unusual, tale-like style. And it is quite different, and original. Certainly made this year more colourful for me. |
||||||
|
||||||
TatsuGero23
 Posts: 1277 Location: Sniper Island, USA (It's in your heart!) |
|
|||||
|
AH!!! IS OVER... hard to believe we stuck with the series for a whole year. First off before diving into things, I was pretty pleased with the series as a whole. Although I enjoy a different philosphy on "what amounts to power" it was pretty great to see Shichika finally unleash like that looking all badass like that; highlighting how the original users were superior then the current owners as he progressed.
Opinions on the ending in general, I can get the mixed feelings for it. Personally I have no problems with the instants where a character you grow attached to dies off as they do. In one sense it might be a cheap emotional pull but goddammit, I do enjoy that emotional tug. I do believe Togami's reply to Shichika though. In one sense you could see it as her attempt in trying to make it easier for Shichika to forget about her, but more then that, I think it was a very deep realization to her actions throughout the series. Everything she felt and said were all true, but at the same time, she was aware that there was the chance she would still go through with her plans. Shichika even said he'd go through with it in a sense when he said he'd kill himself if he was told too. I felt that she would have killed him but like she planned all along, die along with him rather then alone. It just as she said, luckily she was killed so she didn't have to kill him. But that princess... yeah that is where most of my mixed feelings are too. On paper, I can see how it amounts to her being bond by the destiny of the sword maker with him having changed history and although she and Togami fought alot, they had a rivalry for one another to the point that they were almost friends; but it didn't come off like that. But it was definitely a better ending then what I thought was gonna happen where she ends up taking over. In the end, some type of justice, as little as it was, came through with Shichika killing the guy responsible for the sword hunt and how Togami had to live her life. Oh, and how Shichika worked in his catch phrase at the very end, it made me smile. |
||||||
|
||||||
tarheel91
 Posts: 128 |
|
|||||
|
That ending was one massive "WTF!?" for me. spoiler[Planning on killing him? Togame being this heartless? It sounds like a load of BS; it goes against everything we've seen. It's either bad writing, or she's lying/exaggerating.
I don't understand why she had to die. Yes she's the daughter of the guy who tried to fix history, but so what? How does that necessitate her death, especially when the Princess 1) likes her and 2) is pretty neutral in regards to the prophecy coming true. Honestly, I felt like the whole prophecy thing was pretty stupid as well. There's no foreshadowing or even hint of this earlier on (before episode 11). Really, it feels like one big Deus Ex Machina to me. And then, Shichika's decision to let the woman responsible for Togame's death tag along makes absolutely no sense. For someone so clearly affected by her death, you'd think he'd hold some resentment for the woman responsible.] What's more, none of this has to do with what made the show great: the dialogue, the art, and the comedy. It's completely out in left field and doesn't enhance the show at all. Basically, my biggest issue with this ending is it's totally unrelated to the rest of the show. It's a complete tangent. The first 5/6 of the show is about these two's journey and their growth along the way, both individually and as a couple/team. Then, all this crazy stuff. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
GeminiDS85
Posts: 391 |
|
|||||
|
I can empathize with everyone being conflicted or upset about how the ending transpired, but I think that was Nishio Ishin’s ultimate goal in writing Katanagatari. The ending is supposed to make the viewer distressed. Ishin wants you to ask the question: what was the purpose of Shichika’s journey? Well, the short answer is: spoiler[ In the end there was no real grand purpose to Shichika’s journey because he was failure, and not all journeys are meant to be considered successful. Katanagatari’s ending is brilliant in that it concludes in the exact opposite of how this sort of narrative is traditionally played out. Typically we see the hero who turns out to be the most powerful person in the story is able to change the world because of this newly discovered power. However, in Katanagatari our hero is the strongest individual in this fictional world, yet he is unable to accomplish anything world changing with his strength.]
He is a pawn, a weak-minded weapon (“Sword”) who is never able to gain control of his life. Shichika is a very disheartening character, he’s tragically flawed, which is what makes him such a fascinating protagonist. spoiler[Even when Togame dies and Shichika attempts to finally break free of the control of others and be his own man, he falls right into Shikizaki’s plan. The ending is even more disheartening because of his inability to ever become anything more than a tool. All he can do in the end is follow Togame’s proposal of drawing a map of Japan because he cannot be anything more than an extension of someone else’s will, hence the sword analogy.] Katanagatari is a story for all those who have set out on a journey andspoiler[ failed. There is no happy ending to be found, but this is often the way life works out.] |
||||||
|
||||||
|
Eivion
Posts: 569 |
|
|||||
|
Just finished this. I'm pretty satisfied with the whole thing aside from spoiler[Princess's survival], and even that doesn't bother me too much. I think GeminiDS85 has it right as far what the point of the story is.
|
||||||
|
||||||
|
tarheel91
Posts: 128 |
|
|||||
I hope you don't mean in a classical sense. There is nothing tragic (again, in a classical sense), about this story. I really don't see the point of the story if we accept your reasoning. What is the point? Hell, the logic behind the whole concept is so convoluted I can't see the explanation being that cut and dry. Plus, how do you reconcile that idea with the first 83.666% of the show? It's a character driven comedy at heart for the first 10 episodes. The only thing I can come up with is that it's a satire of the traditional Japanese adventure story. We've seen it poke fun at several things you frequently see within this genre. I suppose the conclusion then is that things are really never that clean or convenient. A sort of challenge to the classical belief system? Whatever, I'm just rambling at this point. |
||||||
|
||||||
Hentai_JP
 Posts: 605 Location: Toronto, ON |
|
|||||
|
Oh man the ending (and last few episodes as well)... A little disappointing finale for not-so-brilliant series in the first place. Nisioisin put some good ideas in Katanagatari but pretty much none of them are well handled. Shichika & Togame romance progress and character development for once are very uneven. Particularly Shichika, who goes from stone-faced to all emotional and funny in a matter of one episode (somewhere in the middle, don't remember which one it was).
The last few episodes is why I rate this "Decent" instead of "Good". The whole thing just started to fall apart... Prophecy by evil genius? Really? Come on now! While I mostly like last episode, especially the pragmatic feel of the end: "Togame you are replaceable". "Shichika unleashed" was a good change of pace as well. But then Togame just had to go on and die for about TWELVE minutes. Spewing bullcrap of how heartless she is and it was all by design. I mean now I understand that her facade was to ease it for Shichika but there is no point if it's not clear while watching the scene.
Only "very good" for an "unsurpassed jewel of the 2010"? Man, this must've been a bad year for anime.
Katanagatari is very hard to judge for me as well. And even though I can also call it "interesting and unusual viewing experience" I'd rather have a "strong masterpiece" feeling than "unusual but interesting". Just saying. 
|
||||||
|
||||||
|
GeminiDS85
Posts: 391 |
|
|||||
|
@ tarheel91 Well let’s see if Katanagatari fits the classical (Aristotle’s) definition of a tragedy.
First we have rising action: Shichika’s decision to accompany Togame on the quest to acquire Shikizaki’s 12 deviant blades would be an example of rising action, also could be his hamartia. Next would be exposition: Well, we have plenty of back story presented in the first few episodes explaining Shichika and Togame’s connection to each other and the 12 deviant blades, so that would qualify as exposition. Then we need complications in the story: We have a plethora of examples to choose from to fit this component, but let’s say Shichika’s sister getting involved in the sword hunt would be an obvious example to point out. Now we need a climax: Togame’s death is the climax of Katanagatari. So, after the climax we need recognition by the protagonist: The discovery that Togame was planning on murdering Shichika after the sword hunt would be Shichika’s epiphany. He recognizes that his journey has been futile, and that all his sacrifices were in vain. After the recognition by the protagonist we need suffering: Shichika’s attempt to kill himself by storming the castle would constitute suffering. Then lastly we need catharsis: The desired effect to make the viewer angry and question the point of the series would be an excellent example of catharsis. So, according to Aristotle’s checklist, Katanagatari could be labeled a tragedy, so I do not think it is unreasonable to label Shichika as a tragic character. Although I think Ishin’s playing with more than just the concept of tragedy in Katanagatari.
Ishin’s trying to break the mold of the traditional narrative with his ending. The aim of Katanagatari is not to come off as another example of pastiche That being said, I am not saying that the narrative isn’t the prime focus of the show because I think it is. Ishin is challenging the typical hero ending with Katanagatari, but he is also telling the story of a tragic hero. It is really up for interpretation which element you think was Ishin’s primary focus. Either you interpret the ending, like I have, as focusing on the narrative, or you could say Katanagatari is more interested in making a statement and paying homage to the traditional hero narrative then trying to surpass it. The show is obviously incorporating both arguments, so either would be a rationale way to interpret the ending.
Again, stressing the importance of the narrative in telling Shichika’s tragic tale, the other eleven episodes serve to make the ending bittersweet. If we had not followed Shichika on his journey and cheered for him and Togame to finally get together, the catharsis of the last episode would have been minimal. Edit:
Are you telling me that your not going to rate Amagami SS as a Masterpiece? Or how about rating Angel Beats! as a Masterpiece? You and I certainly didn't bitch and moan about that series at all this year. 
|
||||||
|
||||||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group