Forum - View topicHey, Answerman! All Scanlations, All The Time
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agila61
 Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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The chinese sites, OneManga, MangaFox (don't know how many others are based in china) sure as heck make a profit from free. Its called advertising. Of course, their economics are different because they just rip off all their content without paying the creators of the work. Making a profit from free and legal is harder, but not impossible. The real problem is making a profit from free and legal on top of existing markets, or making a profit from free and legal in addition to new paid markets, since the cash flow from ad-supported free viewing alone is nowhere near enough to keep the industry in business. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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I don't get this. It seems to be trying to make a broad point that does not hold up in the extreme. After all, taken to the extreme, is says if someone is murdered, we should be sad to see the killer end up in jail, because putting the killer in jail won't bring the victim back to life. I am not sure where the "happy to see justice done" is supposed to stop being the response. Maybe if those who were deluding themselves into thinking they were actually helping build the industry get caught while the people pulling in the thousands or even millions from the big profit machines get away, we might have mixed feelings. |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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Pirates on that scale always attract the attention of the authorities and get shut down. Bootlegging and file sharing won't stop - but despite the fantasies of the RIAA, stopping all bootlegging is not the goal, The goal is to carve out a market space that allows revenues to be funneled back to the creators of the work. The flip side of the low cost of distributing online that makes the piracy possible is that in a legal distribution system, as much as 70% of revenues can go back to the creators. |
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Youkai Warrior
 Posts: 505 Location: Sarayashiki |
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It's so funny how people will justify scantilations. Look people, I don't care what you say, scantilations is stills stealing. Especially if the manga in question has been licensed and is available everywhere. Of course, while scantilations are hurting the industry, it's not the only thing that is.
On "old school anime", there might be some issue with what I've got to say, but I'm gonna say it anyway. Some anime that came out in the 90s were really great, (like Escaflowne) and then, there were some series that should have never left Japan. (Not that I've seen it, but I've heard horrible stuff about Galaxy Fraulein Yuna). Then there were others that just didn't satnd the test of time (in other words, some might've moved on from them) like Sailor Moon. However, despite some less than good anime that came out in the 90s, there is no doubt about it, there are several anime that came out in the 90s that are way better than todays, at least to me. I'm sorry, but in the last 7-10 years, there's been nothing but crap. I think one of the reasons newer fans don't give a damn about old stuff is either because they are too concerned with what's going on now, and don't want to bother with something older, or they have really bad taste, or simply put, they want to keep up with what's new, flashy, and "in" in their little niche. By the way, anime should not be a clique, but newer fans are treating it that way. I don't really care that newer fans have never heard of Escaflowne, or Trigun, or even some of CLAMPs older works like X or Magic Knight Rayearth, even though some might be into xxxHolic and Tsubasa. In fact, I'm glad. While the newer fans are fangasming over Naruto, Bleach and Vampire Knight, I'm enjoying Escaflowne, or some other really great series that younger fans have never heard of, and will stand the test of time. I have a feeling that some of the anime that are mainstream now, will run its course and that'll be it for some of those series. |
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glitteringloke
 Posts: 160 |
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I find it amusing that youkai warrior lists 'old school' anime as stuff from the 90s.
some of us want stuff from the 60s and 70s... *cough*cyborg009*cough* |
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loka
 Posts: 373 Location: Pittsburgh, PA |
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Perhaps you missed this statement:
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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"that audience was there because" is true of the large majority of the audience. If your point is that it would be more precise to say, "by far the large majority of that audience was there because ..." ... well, true, but its quibbling. If the manga viewing sites left the licensed titles alone, they would not be attracting the attention of the authorities, because they would be attracting a small fraction of the views that they in fact do attract, and no publisher would see any of their titles lose sales when the title hit a viewing site, because published series would never hit such a site. The big viewing sites benefit from having the smaller niche unlicensed titles to broaden their variety, but there has always been the option to adopt a policy of not uploading any scanlation or rip of a licensed work. If all unlicensed titles would be enough to compete for online viewers, there would be more sites doing just that. Indeed, one of the things we may see is one or more of the B-list and C-list sites adopting that policy - taking down all their licensed titles to see if it puts them back underneath the radar. |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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dewlwieldthedarpachief
 Posts: 751 Location: Canada |
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Gorgeous doesn't even begin to get into what they had to do remastering Akira; the sound alone was so beyond anything the studio could handle the guy who originally composed the soundtrack lent out his personal equipment to properly process it for the disc. Akira's dual layer BD was barely enough to fit the finished product on their; sure they could have tossed in another extras disc but that would have jacked the price up even more. I think my expectations may differ from some; when I buy a movie I mainly want the movie; I find extras occasionally interesting but rarely watch them more than once and more often than not am irritated at how space on the disc was wasted on some gimmicky shite. In my perfect world, all releases would be like Akira and extras would be relegated to supplementary books and documentaries, maybe with the exception of commentaries and such. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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What does profit and loss have to do with the share going to the creators? Hulu has been paying 70% of ad revenues to the rights owners since founding, though they only made their first profit this last fiscal year. While CR is private and does not have to say, it seems unlikely they have registered their first profit, but over half their revenues go to the rights holders. The creators are getting one or another form of revenue share ... whether their share is determined by royalty per view or as a percent of the gross. They are not getting profit shares, so they don't have to wait until the legit distributors make profits to see any money from the venture.
Its not clear who you are arguing are "making the rules", nor precisely which rules about what you are referring to, so the statement of this part of the argument leaves it a bit obscure. |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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Yes. Companies embracing a new business model = whores. That's totally a reasonable assessment. This is where I can only roll my eyes at people like you. It's like you're so committed to this absurd little crusade you've created against piracy that you're only fighting it for it's own sake. It's not even about the issue. This is pretty evident when you place this crazy idea of 'business dignity' (aka. not siding with the pirates) ahead of actually making money and finding ways to solve the problem and call any company who doesn't do the same whores without integrity. The only real conclusion I can draw is that for all your bluster and complaining about piracy, you don't really care about it at all. You just like being outraged and acting morally superior. |
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Charred Knight
 Posts: 3085 |
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I just don't think streaming and going to a digital release is really going to do anything. I mean your either going to have to shrink liscensing cost down to nothing meaning that only certain anime companies like Kyoto Animation and Sunrise can survive, or your going to lose massive amounts of money. I mean you can not make millions of dollars streaming anime, it doesn't get the views.
Also with digital you run the risk of killing off the print side, which would force you to sell 7 to 11 times the sales you get now to cover it, and frankly your not going to get it, you can't beat the ease of aggregator sites. Frankly, China has nothing to gain from helping american and Japanese companies. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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If it took Hulu, with a much earlier start and much broader content base, until this year to earn its first profits, it would be very surprising if Crunchy was making a profit at this point. On how long they can attract continued investment to allow them to grow their audience ... likely as long as their audience continues to grow. Its well known to be no get rich quick channel, but they are in the top 500 sites in the Phillipines and Singapore - and that is basically on the back of Naruto alone - top 1,000 in Malaysia, Qatar, Canada and Norway, and top 1,500 in UAE, Finland, Mexico, Chile, Australia, Indonesia and the US.
Their demo trends 18-24, fairly balanced on gender trending slightly female, and no kids. There are lots of advertisers looking for that demo - there is an established conventional wisdom on getting to young adults to establish a long term position in a cohort.
Its highly unlikely that it can revert to what it was before - being a streaming site dedicated to hosting bootleg material is a lot of extra DMCA work in return for much lower quality of advertising clients ... the heaving bosom free multiplayer games rather than the car companies advertising special deals to recent college graduates. There's a strong financial reason why the remaining bootleg streaming sites are leech streamers, relying on MySpace, Veoh and Megavideo to do the heavy lifting.
There is no indication that DMP is joining the aggregators. It seems far more like DMP is looking to poach the aggregators unpaid volunteer labor force, aka "scanlaters" and "suckers". They could well have been looking to primarily rely on poaching the unpaid scanlators that the bootleg manga viewing sites rely upon for free content, but of course if there is a sweep of the big manga viewing sites, they'll want to position themselves to take advantage of that as well.
DMP seems set to cherry pick the cream of the crop among the established scanlator groups, and with them their support networks in social media. The former scanlators will, of course, have to drop all of their scanlating activity in order to start working for DMP for beer money, and will of course be spreading the story about how they wanted to do something like this all along, but until DMP came alone, nobody in the industry was willing to give them a chance. I am not sure where you are finding your sex industry definitions, but the one paying the money and receiving the service without having to make a long term commitment would not normally be referred to as "pimping themselves out". Last edited by agila61 on Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:10 am; edited 2 times in total |
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