Forum - View topicBootlegs vs. Fansubs.
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bluechibi
Posts: 137 |
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LOL interpret the list however you want  I'm not going to lie, be in denial or make excuses for downloading them. I don't download them just because they are there. I've always had a wide taste in anime, which explains why I own so many old anime VHS. Now what I usually do is look at the reviews on ANN, then download the ones that look good.
I would say out of all of them 0.6% are animes that haven't been licensed yet. |
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Legato 2057
 Posts: 437 Location: Soon to be Japan |
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Why don't you just admit to being cheap and stingy with your money? It has nothing to do with your being an anime fan, you just don't want to spend any money.
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bluechibi
Posts: 137 |
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umm that's the whole point of the list, to emphasis that because of fansubs I no longer have to spend $100s and $100s on DVDs or VHS like I use to. That it does affect the industry that people like me save their money from buying dvds and spend it on other things such as games and a new 22" monitor that will make my fansub viewing even more enjoyable. |
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Sword of Whedon
Posts: 683 |
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So it's just fine for you to run into a store and steal said 22" monitor?
Fansubs exist in a bare DMZ as it is. Frankly it's getting so bad, and so many people are violating the rules that I'm expecting a major industry-wide JAILED style crackdown (except this time they'll be serious). Legally, there's no leg to stand on for fansubbers, and fansubs have been ALLOWED to continue to exist as a favor to fandom, it's traditions, and the fact that they do get some feedback on titles through it. The harm is starting to outweigh the benefits though, especially with the advent of digisubbing. It used to be that most people wouldn't watch a tape farther than about 3 generations from the master, because the degredation just got too bad. So realistically you're probably talking under 500 copies spread from a single fansubber on a MAJOR title, and usually under a hundred. Now it's 10-20x that. I'm a fansubber myself, but I never distribute what I do, they're strictly for con video rooms because I don't want Wo Ping selling my work on the streets of HongKong, and this way it encourages people to buy legit. |
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Immorrel
 Posts: 21 Location: Here and there (California currently) |
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amen and preach on. I use fan-sub so I can see something. But when it finally gets around to being licensed I know that if I actually put it onto a CD somewhere that I will go and buy that DVD when it comes out because I like having the fansub option to see stuff with. And I like to keep my friends outta trouble who do this for everybody else. So do your fansub groups a favor and go and buy the anime when it comes out cause it keeps people with lawsuits away from everyones source of anime straight from japan.
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^ . ^
 Posts: 53 Location: Texas |
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I don't have a problem with them at all. The main reason I watch fan-subs is the same reason I think everybody else does.
I simply don't have the patience to wait for stuff like the Ghost in the Shell series to get released here. I'm currently in the middle of watching the entire first season right now. I can tell you, this series is way better than anything being released in America right now. Of course, when it finally does get released here, I'll be the first person to run out and buy it. The fan-subs, to me, are just a way to get a fix before the real thing gets released, and they do that very well. Same way with Berserk. I just finished volume 26 a few days ago. I still plan on buying the manga though as it get's released simply because I like to have the real thing. Not that the people who translate it do a bad job or anything, but who would want to just have it on a computer? |
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Dilandau
 Posts: 525 Location: Tea House |
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That is exactly the point of fan-subs, and why the US anime industry does not slaughter the fan-subbers. The fan-subs generate the initial interest in the Otaku that lust with greed and impatience. But the point, and usually should be on every fansub is a little message that says to burn the fansub and buy the real thing when it is licensed. But, fan-subs really don't have much of a point anymore, because the demand for anime in the US is so great now that the US companies license the anime as soon as it airs in Japan, if not before. A fan-sub becomes a bootleg once the domestic rights for the series are acquired. I agree that there will never be a legitimate anime market in asia, simply because the boot-leggers exist. Considering not just the legal implications, but the sub-standard audio/video of bootlegs that the Asian countries are stuck with. They will never get professional quality anime. They will assume that it is 'normal'. As a fan, I find that thought more upsetting than lost revenue. |
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Dilandau
Posts: 525 Location: Tea House |
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Again, just a quick point to the poor and lusty of anime. You can still have your anime. You just have to look for sales. (I don't think I will get smited for this because they are ANN sponser...)
One of the ad banners at the top of the screen is for buyritedvd. Which sell legitimate US owned dvd's that are simply overstock and Bandai doesn't want in its warehouse. Everey anime dvd on there is spare change. Not a lot of choice, but it is cheap anime none the less. I am a uni student (an international student without ability to work, no less). And I understand your frustrations. Join an anime club, rent, look for sales, if your really want something you can budget for it (even if its only 1 dvd a month).....you should be studying if you have that much time on your hands. 
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Scaramanga
Posts: 134 Location: San Diego, CA |
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And personally, I don't know what all the too-do is about. If you REALLY want anime that hasn't reached the US or been recently licensed, you CAN buy legit R2 DVDs online. And I don't want to hear whining about region free DVD players either. Those things are becoming about as common as water these days. Not to mention there has been a recent push by large media companies (i.e. Blockbuster) to negate regional releases (and region coding.) And if you can't AFFORD said DVDs and continue to DL licensed fansubs or buy bootlegs your no better than a crack junkie who steals money who feed his/her habit. If that's the case I can recommend a few good 12-step programs.
And bluechibi, don't think your admission of guilt for one moment obviates the hardship that you and your ilk visit upon not only the anime production & distro companies but true fans as well. Those of us who believe in value given for value received. |
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Sword of Whedon
Posts: 683 |
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Welcome to the miracle of DVDSubber(http://www.dvdsubber.com), a program which will keep fansubbing alive long after traditional fansubs are gone. |
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Sword of Whedon
Posts: 683 |
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Considering that your livelyhood is not dependent on these items selling, and that you haven't looked at any statistical data, how could you? This thread should more than demonstrate that there is indeed a problem.
I'm going to take great offense to that one. The fact that someone is an atheist has 0 effect on their moral compass, in fact it could be argued that it pushes it to the MORE moral, as atheists make up a mere 2% of the prison population, yet 10-15% of the US population at large (sources, Dept of Justice and US Census) If such an insinuation were correct, atheists should make up 15%+ of prisoners. |
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Legato 2057
Posts: 437 Location: Soon to be Japan |
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No offense to everybody involved in this thread, but can't we just drop the subect already.
Everybody has already stated their stance on the subject. Now this thread has simply become a battle between posters trying to prove their point to each other when both sides have already made up their mind. |
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Scaramanga
Posts: 134 Location: San Diego, CA |
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I disagree with you COMPLETELY on every salient point in your post! *removes tongue from cheek* (NOT that cheek, perv.) And Tony, actually there are quite a FEW R2 releases that have subtitles, just as there are R1 discs that have subtitles (and dubs) in foreign languages. Isn't that the point of DVDs in the first place - the ability to place loads of audio and video streams on one disc? And as far as paying more, yes, often you will have to pay more for R2 discs than when they are released here, but then there are some series' that will likely never make it over here so for those, R2s are very attractive. As far as someone's behavior affecting me, well... if it affects the industry in that less distro houses are willing to release products to the West because sales are meagre, then yes, this affects me. Personally I don't care what morally repugnant things people do. But as soon as it affects me and/or something I'm concerned with, you bet your britches I care. |
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Sakura no Miko
 Posts: 83 Location: Sunny California |
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I've watched fansubs...
The only thing good about them is a) learning more Japanese terms/locations ect. and b) seeeing series that aren't availble in the US without having to import and bug with the regional coding, ect. But they are illegal...so I feel guilty about that. |
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Fenrir
 Posts: 369 |
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Even though my fansub collection greatly outsizes my anime dvd collection I still love to get anime on DVD. Eventually I would love to replace all of my fansubs with R1 releases but I just don't have the money to do that righ off the bat for sure. Hence why I download anime. It's not a substitue for buying anime I will go buy anime when I can and when the price is reasonable thank god for Ebay and the cheap legit anime on there. You gotta support the industry fansubs are allowed to exist because most of us fans go back and support the industry however bottlegging is just wrong. I only have one bootleg and that's of a series that is not fansubbed or licensed. Most of us fans would never be able to satisfy our lust for anime without fansubs in some form or another but as long as all of us throw our money back into the industry it's all right. I can't wait to be able to get my hands on Yu Yu Hakusho box sets and on the Sailor Moon box sets when I have cash. I find the main thing that fansubs does is save me money by allowing me to wait for box sets of certain shows and when those come out I get them. Then again I tend to go to cons and on ebay and just blow tons of cash on legit anime all at once. Hey do what you need to save moeny but support the industry!!!
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