Forum - View topicThe Heroic Legend of Arslan (TV).
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11406 |
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Though I can see why Narsus wants to kill Bodin, I'd much prefer to see him stricken with leprosy.
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Agent355
 Posts: 5113 Location: Crackberry in hand, thumbs at the ready... |
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I think both countries have Middle Eastern and Western stylistic elements going on, but I can see how you'd see Lusitania as more Western. As for the plot twist, I don't know if something like that ever really happened or not, but it certainly reflects the fears of ancient kingdoms as recorded in the Bible. In Exodus, it is explicitly stated that Pharaoh feared the Israelites would become more numerous than the Egyptians, then join their enemies and fight against them in war. That's *why* he started oppressing them. |
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Stark700
 Posts: 11762 Location: Earth |
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Episode 10:
Good episode overall. I thought that Narsus was quite clever to figure out the scheme going on. I really want to see more background story again from this guy in the future. And anyways, this episode also showed more skills from Arslan's group as well as setting up for their next adventure. Very excited! (Also I heard some news on the upcoming new theme song so I hope they can live up to the expectations for the first half. It's becoming one of my favorites this season). |
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DuskyPredator
 Posts: 15495 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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Really? I thought it was kind of obvious that the guy wanted to make Arslan marry his daughter so that he could get power, that the separate room was a clear that he planned to make act that night by getting rid of his current allies. Especially since heavy amount of troop movement we saw made it quite obvious. If anything they wasted a big asset by just leaving the place after defeating the guy who tried to make a dark effort, there were many men who may have followed the prince, a powerful warrior, and great strategist. Instead they left the place to whoever inherits it, likely a family member who thinks that he coldly killed him and damaged their estate. Could bite him in the butt if he plans on later joining the different factions together. I mean they did not even try to intimidate the guy and convince him from the fact that their small party took down that other guy's army. Instead they say that they are not interested and leaving and then of course the guy is going to act out on using the men he assembled. |
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Yttrbio
 Posts: 3653 |
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The political trickery might be a bit more interesting if it everything about a person's motivations wasn't immediately obvious just by looking at his character design.
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MaxSouth
Posts: 1363 |
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Rich feudal spoiler[helping the prince] in such situation is either improbable, or he should have been absolutely devoted to the point of being ready to accept death, if loyalty would require that.
The reason is that once a feudal would tamper with much larger occupation forces, his land, army and himself would be absolutely destroyed as an example for others who could even theoretically think of going against occupiers in the future. The feudal would certainly know that and either would not spoiler[help the prince] at all, or be prepared to stand with him to the (quite soon and sad) end once the crushing punishment would come from the occupiers. So this element of the story is not realistic in terms of logic and interests of the character that was portrayed in it. _______________________________________________________________________ I like how concept of slavery is not dumbed down in this story, well done. It is always a pleasure when authors do not treat viewers as simple-minded one-cell brains that can not grasp the ideas that more complex that just black or white. Last edited by MaxSouth on Tue Jul 28, 2015 4:07 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11406 |
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Amen. Hodir was as unsubtle as Priest Cornello in FMA, from whom he appears to have been cloned, and he's hardly the only character with this problem. I was as astonished as DP that they just rode off and left the fortress to whoever decided to take it over. They'd just been discussing needing more troops and allies, and then they not only throw away a golden opportunity to acquire exactly that, but increase the likelihood of having created a new antagonist. I guess we're supposed to think that if Arslan can't even get the freed slaves on their side, the troops would have been even more opposed to following him, but it's not very convincing. |
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Vaisaga
 Posts: 13230 |
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I think it works fine. It's not a question of if Arslan can win them over to his side. They just killed the soldiers' lord, one who apparently treated them very well and they were loyal enough to antagonize the future monarch for his sake. Even if Arslan took command of them, the threat of them plotting revenge will always be there. More importantly, Farangis's down time outfit was nice. Much better than that stupid thing she normally wears. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11406 |
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The situation and interests of soldiers and slaves are very different. The slaves have apparently been treated well and become accustomed to their lot, and now suddenly and without warning are out of a job in a sense, with no experience in the paid work force. Being awakened in the middle of the night to an uncertain future is not how people are won over to your side.
The soldiers however, still have a job, with whomever they decide to fight for, or whomever takes over the "company." Their lot in life hasn't suddenly changed, only who will be giving them their orders and paychecks. Arslan and company should have stepped up right then to be the ones giving orders. I'm not discounting that some of the soldiers would be loyal to Hodir for political or ideological reasons, but while some might be interested in revenge, I think most would see Arslan as the proper leader to follow since Hodir was loyal to Pars at least publicly when he was alive. Makes more sense than going over to the Lusitanian side, but then, it seemed to me that Hodir kind of jumped the gun in trying to assassinate Arslan anyway. That Arslan (or Narsus) didn't even make an overture toward the troops, or try to fill the leadership vacuum he just created before riding off just seems like a guarantee that this will be back to bite him in the ass. |
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musouka
Posts: 707 |
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Yes, if Arslan had, oh say, an hundred men, leaving the fortress with troops was foolish. Instead, he had five, not including himself. A single handful of people he could trust completely (well, more like three, since Farangis and Gieve are still relative unknowns) and to help him win over hundreds of people that were willing to murder his comrades and take him as a prisoner for a political power play. They only escaped in the first place due to a few clever surprises and the shock of killing Hodir.
All we know about Hodir is that he has a young daughter of suitable age for marrying Arslan. What if he also has sons, to whom the troops first loyalty would go? Or heck, the daughter herself, who probably isn't going to be thrilled to wake up and find her father has been killed. I guess I just don't understand what would be the purpose of staying at that point. The well was poisoned. It's a hostile environment where the people Arslan can trust are outnumbered at least fifty to one. As has been pointed out in an earlier episode, his head is worth good money to Lusitania. Best to cut their losses and escape while they can, even if it does cause trouble down the road. Better that than die, because cutting the bowstrings probably won't work again. |
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DuskyPredator
Posts: 15495 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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They kind of called the situation onto themselves. A savvy person should have known that Hodir cared about one big thing, power. Arslan came in talking about how he would disrupt the system, and in a way that would leave Hodir weaker, without any idea of benefit. It really should not take a genius to see that this would lead him to think that Arslan might be getting influenced by this small group, which the small size would make him think that he could take down. When Arslan decided to leave this created another threat that Hodir would be branded a traitor, indeed another risk to his power, and of course he would then try to kill him.
They totally failed in negotiations, which should not be about only dealing with people who share your uncommon ideology, or fiercely loyal to the mere idea of your title regardless of what you are like. Hodir looked like a smart dude, he might have been out for his own interests, but freedom really is what Arslan himself is looking for. Really the first thing they should have done was propose ways that Hodir would benefit from further negotiations, that a political marriage would not be out of the question, or at least Arslan would promise to find other strong suitors to increase his influence as his ally with an army. Indeed my first response to Arslan saying that the slaves were free was "sure, they are now free to go die in the desert without any belongings or means of living". It is really not a case of just freeing them all and watching them make happy lives, instead the first thing to set up would be compensation for any work done, even if it was food and lodging they already had, there would still be choice. that could eventually grow into a stronger system and weaken the enemy's claim. |
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musouka
Posts: 707 |
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Trouble now or trouble later? They're looking for people willing to ally with the cause they have, not to lie to people and then have to deal with revolt when said lies become clear. Same with offering marriage to someone high, but not the prince himself. Who? Who does Arslan have to offer? He's not in the position to negotiate, because the only political power he has at this point is his claim to the throne--something the series is also making clear is shaky even to other people.
Hodir was asking for more than they could rightfully give, knowing they had little else to offer. He's a small garrison trying to maneuver himself into being major power by taking advantage of the prince's relative helplessness. It's stupid to offer your hand in marriage to the daughter of the first man that's on your side and has more than ten soldiers to his name. It's equally stupid to promise things that might come to bite you in the ass, like land or political marriages. Arslan offered the potential of a worthless post to Narsus, who accepted because he found the offer amusing. This was something totally different, |
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Vaisaga
Posts: 13230 |
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I like how Arslan's issue was with marrying someone he didn't know, rather than what a political mess it would be. |
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vanfanel
 Posts: 1243 |
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I had mixed feelings about the idea of trying to take over the fortress at first. But the more I think about it:
1) the well is now poisoned, as someone said above 2) this fort alone is not nearly big enough to handle a sustained seige 3) they still haven't put a huge amount of distance between themselves and the occupied capital, so holing up here would mean Lusitanian armies would arrive well ahead of any help they could call. They could easily trap themselves in an Alamo-type situation. 4) spoiler tagging a little book material: spoiler[Lusitania has control over only about 1/3 of Pars's land right now, and pragmatic soldiers like Giskal understand that the occupation force is still in a precarious position. To this end, they're deliberately keeping King Andragoras's fate uncertain in the eyes of the public, because that buys them time to strengthen their hold before the inevitable counterattack. Commanders in various outposts and nobles in their fiefs are all preparing for war, but at the same time all hesitating because they don't know who to swear allegiance to. If they knew Andragoras was dead, they would rush to Arslan's side if he were available. But if Andragoras is still alive, Arslan is not king; he's still just an inexperienced 14-year old prince. (If both are dead...welcome to Thunderdome, I guess.) So at this point, instead of making life-and-death alliances with feudal lords based on promises Arslan might not even have the authority to make, they may deem it wiser to rely on Daryun's connections with other surviving generals whose loyalties are well-known.] That said, I do think it would have been wise to put out a call inviting any soldiers with a desire to do so to go with them. Surely some would consider that a better option than waiting around for Lusitanian legions to show up. |
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Vaisaga
Posts: 13230 |
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Quick question for any American history buffs: What did the US do when they abolished slavery to prevent the same result we see in this episode?
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