×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
Claymore (TV).


Goto page Previous    Next

Anime News Network Forum Index -> General -> Series Discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Key
Moderator


Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18223
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 2:04 pm Reply with quote
Don't worry; this is still going to be one of my longer one-volume reviews, as I'm putting a lot of thoughts and discussions I've had about the series over the last two years together with some newer insights. I already have most of the parts that I can do without actually having the DVD written.

Much earlier in this thread I believe I gave the series as a whole an overall B+ grade, and rewatching the series has only affirmed that I was right the first time. (I give it an "Excellent" in the Encyclopedia ratings.)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
dizzon



Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 338
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:53 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
The late episodes of the anime strayed from the source material in a few major ways:

1. In the manga, spoiler[Raki never actually made it to Pieta, and thus never hooked back up with Clare.]

2. In the manga, spoiler[Clare and Priscilla did not meet at Pieta and go to battle elsewhere. (In fact, several years have passed in the manga and they still have yet to meet.)]

3. In the manga, spoiler[Clare sprouted those wing-like projections from her back during the fight with Rigaldo instead of during a fight with Priscilla. Likewise, the scene where Jean died helping bring Clare back from the brink happened in Pieta immediately followed the Rigaldo fight rather than following a Priscilla fight, albeit in an almost word-for-word similar fashion.] However, this change is of minimal consequence to the plot.

4. In the manga, spoiler[Raki never finds out that Priscilla is an Awakened Being (i.e. the cave incident doesn't happen) and some of the "road trip" scenes with him, Priscilla, and Isley didn't happen.]

5. In the manga, spoiler[the remaining Claymores apparently fall in Pieta under the Awakened Being onslaught, but seven survive by playing possum. As in the anime, they agree to abandon the Organization and take their own path.]

The scene where spoiler[Flora confronts Clare] happens in the manga but plays out very differently, though that has no impact on the plot and, honestly, I felt was handled better in the anime anyway.


I didn't realize so much of the last few episodes were cut-and-paste from the manga. Some of those spoilers kind of blew my mind. I guess if they took that many liberties with the source material, they could continue taking liberties in order to get the anime back on track if they wanted to do another season.

Quote:
Now, I'm in the apparent minority who thinks that, the way the anime set up, it would be possible to bring it at least generally back on a parallel track with the manga on a continuation. However, I don't expect that to happen. Besides, for all the loose ends the anime version left hanging, it did complete its main story, which in the anime is ultimately about saving Clare from herself. The manga only really gives lip service to that notion, thus making the story a more pure action tale.


That's what bugged me the most about the ending; the loose ends. It just seemed to me that they were going out of they're way to remind the viewer that there was still a bunch of great stuff left to cover.spoiler[ What about Isley and his march to the South? What about Riful of the West's impending conflict with Isley? What about Galatea and her growing distrust of the organization, and vice-versa? And what about prisilla? She wasn't killed in the anime. You would think if they went through the trouble of making them fight before they did in the manga, why wouldn't they just kill her? Unless, they wanted to keep her alive in case of a possible continuation of the anime.] It would be one thing to not bring up or hint towards all of these in the final volumes and hope people didn't notice, but it felt like they didn't want you to forget. Maybe I'm just being too sensitive and literal in my viewing habits. Or maybe it's as simple as them just wanting people to start buying the manga, which I will.

Oh well, it's still a great series. Overall I'm still very happy with it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
Key
Moderator


Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18223
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:44 pm Reply with quote
dizzon wrote:
spoiler[ And what about prisilla? She wasn't killed in the anime. You would think if they went through the trouble of making them fight before they did in the manga, why wouldn't they just kill her? Unless, they wanted to keep her alive in case of a possible continuation of the anime.]


No, again, that has more to do with what the series is really about - i.e. saving Clare from herself, as well as Claymores in general struggling to find a balance between their humanity and monstrous sides - than about leaving an opening for a continuation. spoiler[In that final scene, Raki and Jean realized that if they let Clare carry through with killing Priscilla then all hope of salvaging Clare's humanity would be gone. Besides, sparing Priscilla under those exact circumstances - i.e. crouched on all fours like that, and exactly why the person standing over her spared her - makes that scene an exact parallel to Teresa's scene back in episode 8 where she had an opportunity to off Priscilla in town but didn't. The two scenes are too similar for that to be unintentional.]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
dizzon



Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 338
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 9:22 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
No, again, that has more to do with what the series is really about - i.e. saving Clare from herself, as well as Claymores in general struggling to find a balance between their humanity and monstrous sides - than about leaving an opening for a continuation. spoiler[In that final scene, Raki and Jean realized that if they let Clare carry through with killing Priscilla then all hope of salvaging Clare's humanity would be gone. Besides, sparing Priscilla under those exact circumstances - i.e. crouched on all fours like that, and exactly why the person standing over her spared her - makes that scene an exact parallel to Teresa's scene back in episode 8 where she had an opportunity to off Priscilla in town but didn't. The two scenes are too similar for that to be unintentional.]


That's all well and good, I understand the concept. The problem is the execution. The character of Priscilla is developed to the point that spoiler[leaving her alive without the thought of what the consequences of those actions are make no sense to me. I get the similarity with the earlier scene in the series involving Teresa, but I don't buy the idea that if Clair kills her all hope of salvaging her humanity is lost. Priscilla's character is far to dangerous to let go. Should I assume Clair's seemingly unreasonable plot device at keeping her humanity is a far greater priority than the countless other lives that will lost by keeping Priscilla alive.] Again the concept is sound, I understand it, again for me its the execution. I guess my problem is with how unpractical the scene is. I tend to take everything into account. So spoiler[forcing Clair to keep Priscilla alive in order for her to keep her humanity again, just seems unreasonable to me.]

I also understand the series is about Clair and all Claymores struggles with what they are, I just found so much of what surrounded that as being just as, if not more interesting. I just thought it was a shame that all of that great material will more than likely never get animated.

I appreciate your attempts at describing the series, but I think we will continue to see thing differently.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
Dorcas_Aurelia



Joined: 23 Jul 2006
Posts: 5344
Location: Philly
PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 10:48 pm Reply with quote
dizzon wrote:
The character of Priscilla is developed to the point that spoiler[leaving her alive without the thought of what the consequences of those actions are make no sense to me. ]

The character of Priscilla spoiler[has been seen by Raki to be a distraught and emotionally fragile young girl. Yes, she's a monster, and a powerful one, but she has no designs for widespread destruction, or an empire of some kind. She's really quite simple, and without Isley and his army, she would be no more of a threat to the general populace than any normal yoma.]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime My Manga
dizzon



Joined: 22 Sep 2008
Posts: 338
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:33 am Reply with quote
Dorcas_Aurelia wrote:
The character of Priscilla spoiler[has been seen by Raki to be a distraught and emotionally fragile young girl. Yes, she's a monster, and a powerful one, but she has no designs for widespread destruction, or an empire of some kind. She's really quite simple, and without Isley and his army, she would be no more of a threat to the general populace than any normal yoma.]


I'm not worried about any possible aspirations of power or widespread destruction on some biblical level. The problem is, even if she were only to act like a normal yoma like you suggest, that's still any number of innocent human lives. It's like in the cave scene. spoiler[Isley tells Raki that's how Priscilla gets her "nourishment". Left alive she is still going to continue killing and eating people.]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
Mike On Top



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 298
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:05 pm Reply with quote
dizzon wrote:

spoiler[Isley tells Raki that's how Priscilla gets her "nourishment". Left alive she is still going to continue killing and eating people.]


Yeah, which means that people shouldn't ignore spoiler[Isely's presence from the side and his agenda of taking care of Priscilla. Neither the claymores, not I saw him giving up on her - if he had left her to die, a large hole threatens both the logic of the series and a possible continuation. Hence, the accent is on Clare's character development. The last episode hints a bigger picture behind the curtains, very directly in Miria's words, and actually resolves as much as it is necessary for Clare and the world of Claymore at the time. (Yagi didn't rush the events in manga either).]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
By_the_Jelly_Beans?



Joined: 12 Dec 2012
Posts: 39
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:37 am Reply with quote
Haven't read all the manga that is currently out but have read past what is covered in the anime.

My thought to why the anime ended the way it did is that they where trying to give it some sort of an ending. (Like they heard they where not getting a second season are where not expecting on in the first place.) The ending (in my opinion) isn't a cliffhanger. Yes there could be another season but it is left in a way that a lot of other anime ends where you can decide for yourself as to where it goes from there.

From what I've read of the manga they could bring in another season with a little rewrite for how the anime ended to bring it back on track.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
getchman
He started it



Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 9122
Location: Bedford, NH
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:01 am Reply with quote
By_the_Jelly_Beans? wrote:
Haven't read all the manga that is currently out but have read past what is covered in the anime.

My thought to why the anime ended the way it did is that they where trying to give it some sort of an ending. (Like they heard they where not getting a second season are where not expecting on in the first place.) The ending (in my opinion) isn't a cliffhanger. Yes there could be another season but it is left in a way that a lot of other anime ends where you can decide for yourself as to where it goes from there.

From what I've read of the manga they could bring in another season with a little rewrite for how the anime ended to bring it back on track.


you are on quite the necro bumping spree
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
nobahn
Subscriber



Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 5120
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:08 pm Reply with quote
getchman--
I thought so too, but I checked, and By_the_Jelly_Beans? actually has not necroposted.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Key
Moderator


Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18223
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:47 pm Reply with quote
nbahn wrote:
getchman--
I thought so too, but I checked, and By_the_Jelly_Beans? actually has not necroposted.

Correct. The whole idea of having dedicated series threads linked to the stickied index post is that the threads are always considered active. He's just choosing to post on a lot of series threads that haven't been commented on in a long while.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
getchman
He started it



Joined: 07 Apr 2012
Posts: 9122
Location: Bedford, NH
PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:49 pm Reply with quote
oh. thanks for the clarification
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
By_the_Jelly_Beans?



Joined: 12 Dec 2012
Posts: 39
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:23 am Reply with quote
Key wrote:
nbahn wrote:
getchman--
I thought so too, but I checked, and By_the_Jelly_Beans? actually has not necroposted.

Correct. The whole idea of having dedicated series threads linked to the stickied index post is that the threads are always considered active. He's just choosing to post on a lot of series threads that haven't been commented on in a long while.


Yeah sorry for all the confusion....I was late to the party by a couple of years.

Just joined and was putting in my half-cent-worth of comments on some of my favorite shows.

Had Claymore on my mind seeing that Funimation linked an article from this site saying that the manga ended. Which pretty much brought me here.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tuor_of_Gondolin



Joined: 20 Apr 2009
Posts: 3524
Location: Bellevue, WA
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:43 am Reply with quote
By_the_Jelly_Beans? wrote:
Had Claymore on my mind seeing that Funimation linked an article from this site saying that the manga ended. Which pretty much brought me here.

Just as an FYI: the Claymore manga is still ongoing. IIRC, it's on Chapter 134. I'm not sure how much longer it has until it is done, but it's not done yet.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail My Anime My Manga
Kruszer



Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 7986
Location: Minnesota, USA
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:04 pm Reply with quote
Tuor_of_Gondolin wrote:
By_the_Jelly_Beans? wrote:
Had Claymore on my mind seeing that Funimation linked an article from this site saying that the manga ended. Which pretty much brought me here.

Just as an FYI: the Claymore manga is still ongoing. IIRC, it's on Chapter 134. I'm not sure how much longer it has until it is done, but it's not done yet.


I'm fairly sure I read something here that it had ended as well. Very abruptly too as a whole bunch of people here commenting on it were not happy. I'm following the US releases, personally, so I'm only on volume 21 and wouldn't know.

Edit: Here it is.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> General -> Series Discussion All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous    Next
Page 64 of 65

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group