Forum - View topicHey, Answerman! [2006-06-09]
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MTierce
Posts: 33 |
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Kamon, I think "masculinity" as it were lies in the eye of the beholder. It entirely depends on what your conception of masculine actually is. If "masculine" is a John Wayne type character, then it seems Shuichi is not masculine. But John Wayne characters do go in and kick butt despite opposition. Shuichi doesn't look like a John Wayne, but I think his personality is far more important than his character look. The things I said are not exculsively masculine traits, but they do play into what our society seems to think men should be. The only real difference that I see between Shucihi and a typical masculine character is that he dosen't hide his emotions. Is that enough to make him a girl? I don't think so. Personally I'd like to know what you find so feminine about him.
[Edit] Actually its interesting that you bring up feminism. I'm not sure exactly what you are trying to say. I think you mean that the feminists that you know would sauy that those aren't exculsively masculine traits, and if that is the case my counter is that modern feminism is actively trying to redifine what is considered "feminine." In any case, I was more concerned with pointing out that Shuichi is a complex character and that it is worth examining his motivations and conflicts. I don't see him as very girlsih at all, and merely wished to point that out. That's merely my opinion, you are free to disagree. |
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halochief_90
 Posts: 466 Location: Canada |
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Good job Zac on another (mostly) great column. You're comment on the "concerned" Naruto people was great. LOL. While some might be able to simpathize with the rant (a good attempt at making things original I guess), but I didn't even know this whole "yaoi" genre existed, but honestly it sickens me. I think my mind would have been better off if I hadn't read this rant.
Last edited by halochief_90 on Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:11 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Dorian
 Posts: 111 Location: Houston |
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Thanks Zac
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jaybug39
 Posts: 552 Location: Oregon, Is it FOOTBALL yet? |
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That was the scariest thing I have read in quite some time.
I can't help but think that girls who watch yaoi, will have a view on sexuality that is quite different than previous generations. And I am unsure of who will be most affected, the girls, or the boys who date them. I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing. If it helps girls to not have self-esteem problems that I have read of these past few years, well I guess I would have to be ok with it. Just not sure if I would want to be an adolescent male around them. Glad I don't have to be a parent just now. |
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Cave
Posts: 80 |
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While it is great to have fantasies and whatnot, rape is just wrong. It's not even arguable. Some people may get off on rape, but I just hope that they remember... rape is a terrible, horrible thing. It can change a person's life forever. One thing maybe ALL fanfic writers of rape forget is the scarring after effects it leaves. If they truly want to get off on someone dominating another, they should stick to BDSM fics or something. I disagree with you that if a person watches/reads these kinds of fics then they won't want to do it. It could possibly have the reverse effect and they could want it even more and then eventually do it. |
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Pleroma
 Posts: 443 Location: Eromanga island |
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Rape fantasies are very common, no need to get worked up over it.
More on topic, I am not much of a follower of Yaoi (huge Yuri fan actually >.>) and I am curious if anyone can point out one show in this genre that WASN't so clearly aimed at the female fanbase. So ironic how the biggest consumers of gay romace are straight people. |
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Successful_Troll
Posts: 132 |
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First off, hehe LeBaron.
Which is why I think this topic deserves more thought. What exactly is drawing all these girls to Gravitation? It's a decent series, but it's not that great. If they just like it because it's about love, then what makes so many people flock to it rather then any of the many other love series out there? If it were a romance between a girl and a guy would they like it less? I personally don't think there's a problem with people watching Gravitation, but if we start getting a bunch of 13 year old Sensitive Pornograph fans showing up at conventions, then we've got a problem.
"Next time you have a thought, just let it go." -Ron White |
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machamacha
Posts: 1 |
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Ah, but are you? Really? Hentai? Probably, I wouldn't know, that's totally a guy thing. Yaoi? Surely not, sure, some yaoi stuff is only porn, but a big lot is a love story that simply shows the sex as well, you know, like every single heterosexual-romance-movie in existance? Yuri? You do know that shoujoai is a western created word and that yuri stories from women for women do not neccessairily include porn at all? So how are you beaten over the head with it? If you are so offended by homosexuality, avoid it. You don't have to watch it.
Ah, yes, that typical argument that is biting its own tail. Let's reword this a bit. Just showing love is not a good excuse to lax on story. Wait. *looks at romance novels, manga, and anime* WAIT...hmmm...so, why should yaoi and yuri be vastly superiour in plot and character development than heterosexual romances? You're just singling the non-straight pairings out because they are non-straight. If you'd actually compare the proper animes representing genres, you're suddenly lacking these explainations. They're the same. Some have better story and character development than others in heterosexual romances. Same goes for yaoi and yuri. I mean, this is actually common sense, lots of stories of something mean that not all of these are good. Big deal. I've yet to see all you fanboys whine about heterosexual romances. Where is all the crying about the bad plot and characterisation of, say, Naruto? Why doesn't anyone complain that Bleach is only successful because it caters in terms of heavy fanservice to teenage males, and otherwise is totally lax on story? Why? Because that isn't the point of these anime. Don't like it, don't watch it. Watching one anime of it, not liking it, and then declaring all of it is bad is very, very stupid.
Why should they like it more if it is girl and a guy? I consider guyxguy and girlxgirl to be way more interesting by default, for instance. Why is that bad, but thinking guyxgirl is better is acceptable? Makes no sense whatsoever.
Again, why? Male fans have obsessed over Asukas breasts for years now. Male fans buy human-sized pillows with the picture of the character on it and yell "Chii" whenever that chobits character appears, I'd think THAT to be a problem, not 13 year olds liking fluffy romances with homosexual characters. All that does is maybe making these 13 year olds more tolerant, you know. Tolerance, sadly a rarely used thing. |
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Successful_Troll
Posts: 132 |
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Err...I don't know if you've seen Sensitive Pornograph, but it's a hardcore hentai series. Which is why I said having a bunch of 13 year olds watching it would be a problem. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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Some would argue that yaoi reinforces stereotypes about homosexuals and is very exploitative. It's no different from hentai in that regard. Teenage girls who pretend they "understand" homosexuals and are oh-so-tolerant and supportive of gay rights because they watch animated gay porn get a big rolleyes from me. |
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hanachan01
 Posts: 504 |
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Don't assume that all yaoi fans are- a) female. I've talked to male yaoi fans. And yes, most are gay  All the ones I've seen were.
b)don't know about gay rights. Okay, many don't. But I'm a yaoi fan, but I'm also in my local GSA, and I read up on gay rights. I will hopefully be going with my GSA to Manhattan Pride as well. I als oparticipated in Day of Silence, which is a nationwide youth movement where we don't talk the whole day to protest the discrimination gays face. So while most don't, and yes, the posers get a  from me too, don't assume all yaoi fans are like that.
Oh, and I didn't join my GSA because of yaoi. I got interseted in Queer Eye for the Striaght Guy actually, which made me interested in gay rights. I first saw Gravi, my first yaoi, 6 months later. And yes, I agree that yaoi can reinforce some stereotpes. However, yaoi is meant to be fantasy, not an accurate depiction of real gay life. That's there's so much buttsecks! No real guy could take all that secks, or they couldn't walk! lol But anyways, it's aimed at women, not men. There is manga about gay men that's more accurate, but it's not yaoi.
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The Xenos
 Posts: 1519 Location: Boston |
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Well, it seems Naruto fans need to learn to read. The current release is labeled as edited and in English. If they are such a hardcore fan, I would think they'd have the brains to make sure they knew what they were buying.
Viz is coming out with unedited box sets, which is awesome. I wish to God that One Piece got this decent a treatment. Also, Dragon Ball Z took years to get uncut DVDs. So Naruto fans need to quit their complaining and realize how nice they have it. As for the idiot who wanted to ask the animation studio when he could get fansubs or non-filler ep... HA! Wow. That is pretty sad. Realize that the show you're always put on a pedistal isn't really as great as you say it is. The studio owes you NOTHING, especially if you jsut bootleg everything. Of course, speaking of needing to learn to read, if you read the damn manga and ignore the anime, you woudln't have to worry about anime filler. Man, that guy has no leg to stand on. He needs to quit comlaining and take what he can get. Maybe he can maybe take some time to find a decent anime series.
Bullcrap. Even you admit they are two different aproaches. They are different. One is pornographic and often fanfic while the other is an official story driven. It also makes the fandom more in its own little world. Again, Shonen-Ai is like a teen drama where Yaoi is gay pornography. Much yaoi that is bought or made is fanfic or doujinshi from what I see. I belive there are only a handful of offitially produced yaoi manga and anime. Let's not mix up terms. It's already difficult enough to maturely talk about anime and manga. Gravitation is simply not yaoi. The doujins of it that the fangirls hunt for, yes, but Gravitation is not. Do not let the fanfiction override the orginal context. I find that mentality disturbing and dangerous. It's a butchering of terminilogy just like anime fans insist otaku means anime fan and manga can be made in America. They're butching an redefining terms for their own selfish use. It's ignorant American arrogance and as an Amierican fan I'm sick of seeing fellow fans acting that way. You know what? If you think American comics can be manga and yaoi is any gay themed manga and anime, then why don't you just go around calling yourself Japanese. With this mentality, these fans are about two steps away from it anyway. -Xenos |
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xvkarbear
Posts: 21 Location: USA |
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You make it sound like I'm saying rape is okay. Real rape is horrible. I said it myself in the start of the post. Rape of women OR men.. there aren't words to describe just how wrong real rape is. Everything I said is my opinion, and so I respect yours. I disagree concerning the last bit, but then that's the big argument to my opinion. Does it help people live out their fantasies in a safe environment or does it just make them want to live out their fantasies for real? Maybe one day there will be statistics to back up one argument or the other. |
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astra
Posts: 131 |
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Rape is wrong blahblah. Gravitation turned me on alot when I was a tender lass of 15. By the way, this thread got fandomwanked if anyone cares.
Oh Answerman, would it be possible for you to announce when the contest has been won? I'd hate to think that I spent 3 hours looking at the art of a certain painter last night for nothing. Well, it wasn't that bad, I suppose 
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cyrax777
 Posts: 1825 Location: the desert |
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if I go to japan show one a Marvel comic and ask them what is this their going to say "MANGA". sorry im not rechanging the word manga is comics. just in the west we use the term to refer to comics from Japan. speaking of changing terms in Japan "Boys love or BL" refers to yaoi/shonen ai but in the states refers to pedophilia. |
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