Forum - View topicREVIEW: Whisper of the Heart Blu-Ray + DVD
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HaruhiToy
 Posts: 4118 |
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Good review of one of my favorite films of all time but I will repeat the question above -- why not straight A? Where is the flaw? Whar?
I have a times pulled the DVD off the shelf just to listen to the performance at about the middle of the film -- where Seiji plays violin and Shizuku sings. First in the English dub and then the original Japanese. Both are great. |
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Jose Cruz
 Posts: 1775 Location: South America |
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Indeed. This is the definition of masterpiece. One of the finest movies ever made. This certainly deserve A+, while movies like Paprika and that movie about a crazy race which I forgot the name got A+ and are surely inferior. |
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Jose Cruz
Posts: 1775 Location: South America |
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Indeed. Kondo was a director with great potential and could have turned out to be as great as Miyazaki and Takahata if he continued to churn out masterpiece likes this. |
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Angel'sArcanum
 Posts: 303 Location: Toronto, Ontario |
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So Ghibli is just innately exempt from having characters that just end up fitting into that mold? I find it hard to believe, and sure, feel free to disregard the fact that I already mentioned a few other Ghibli titles which I find to be great and wouldn't associate with those weird archetypes. The fact that I even mention the term in itself is a stroke against the film for having come to that end. Frankly I felt the characters were too excessively snobby externally while harboring some latent romantic interest they try to keep pushing aside and keeping secretive as much as possible which is kind of irksome in how actively it comes across. I'm sure some of the characters worked for others (as evident by all the praise others are giving) but I felt annoyed and a bit alienated from them myself given that they felt "too anime" (presentational) and by extension: "too tsundere" for me. |
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vanfanel
 Posts: 1242 |
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One of my favorites, too, and one I usually rewatch before starting any large writing project. The scene where the old man reads her story never fails to get me.
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ailblentyn
 Posts: 1688 Location: body in Ohio, heart in Sydney |
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One of the Ghibli films I never tire of watching, and will buy again and again (along with Only Yesterday of course, and Kiki, Totoro and Nausicaä). Like others here, I'm wondering what earned it the minus.
The only thing I dislike about the film are the fantasy sequences, which I find ugly and embarrassing — the ending I'm actually very fond of! |
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andyos
ANN Associate Editor
Posts: 262 |
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Re the 'tsundere' argument; I think Angel'sAcarnum has a point, but for me the sheer comedy value of the boy teasing Shizuku (especially the 'YOU READ IT!!' scene) justifies the device. The film seems very fond of teasing generally. There's the whole scene where the girls make fun of Shizuku for falling in love, which I suppose might seem unwatchably 'moe' to some fans post-K-ON!, but strikes me as utterly charming.
(I agree that the characters hardly feel naturalistic - by the time you get to that rooftop-in-the-rain scene, we're a long way from any naturalism, and closer to old-fashioned Hollywood romance... but I personally like old-fashioned Hollywood romance.) I'm cautious of using the label 'tsundere' for titles that aren't obviously created to the marketing formula that 'tsundere' is part of. As I understand, 'tsundere' comes directly from Japanese dating games, whereas the 'couple which starts out hating each other, ends up loving each other' goes back centuries and crosses continents, from Much Ado to Philadelphia Story. To use 'tsundere' to cover all that seems crassly ahistorical to me. Of course, Ghibli has used the device before. Look at Kiki's attitude to Tombo when they first meet, or the girl's attitude in Poppy Hill, or the whole story of Ocean Waves, or the sub-plot in Only Yesterday involving that grubby schoolboy from the wrong side of the tracks. Heck, San in Princess Mononoke is about as tsundere as you can get, if you want to take that line.... |
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Bonham
 Posts: 419 Location: NYC |
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Tonally it reminds me of those screwball comedies from the 1930s—without the fast-paced wit, of course. I think fans of either could find some enjoyment in the other. For me, Whisper of the Heart is definitely up there with Only Yesterday and Porco Rosso for the best of Ghibli. Michael Toole really gets at how beautiful it is in depiction of overthought maturation and the self-awareness that comes with it. Even though I was about the same age as the characters when I first saw it, Shizuku is still probably the protagonist I relate to the most out of all the Ghibli protagonists. I think anyone who goes through that kind of creative self-doubt—even when they know what they want to do—with prospects of travel after recently graduating (junior high, high school, or in my case, college) can relate to that.
I find it similar to people who categorize and "critique" stories based on buzzwords and phrases found on TV Tropes. It's lazy. |
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Norbie
 Posts: 126 |
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I was surprised by how much I enjoyed this Ghibli film, it's one I can watch at any time, unlike Princess Mononoke or Spirited Away where I need to be in a particular mood to watch them.
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Angel'sArcanum
Posts: 303 Location: Toronto, Ontario |
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Fair enough. That's at least more elaborate and less bluntly dismissive of me than the first response. I guess I used the term to keep things more inclusive within anime or amongst Japanese games, manga, etc. in tandem with it being kind of shorthand for more catty characters and relationships I suppose (I'll concede to it being a bit of laziness as well). I simply don't connect to those kinds of people/romances in fiction and feel kind of irritated by them at times, and I guess this could in fact extend to some classical Hollywood films of a similar ilk ('His Girl Friday' wasn't my cup of tea). As I mentioned previously though, these kind of relationships feel a bit too simulated (to put it nicely) or 'presentational' I find, which clashes with some of the milder expressions in the film, and a lot of Japanese narratives tend to gravitate towards the presentational style, especially in anime, manga, games and other non-live action stuff that are un-real on a surface level, so un-real dialogue isn't totally out of place. With that said, it feels more convenient to compare it to certain terminology around the medium, sub-culture or country than something more broad, but perhaps that's just me; I felt the characters leaned towards more stock-y characterization than what I would've liked and what I was assuming the film would be from the first few minutes. Not to say that presentational is purely derogatory though, more plot-driven (especially fantasy) narratives aren't as much about the minutia of emotions and relationships and more about broader character motivations and such, and their dialogue is more centered around the events at hand; something a la Hunter X Hunter is quite good at that for example. Anyways, sorry if I perhaps generalized too much through using "tsundere" but I've tried to validate it nonetheless, although I will try to refrain from using it too superfluously if people don't want it communicated like that. |
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TEPopka
 Posts: 5 |
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I was wondering what you thought about this movie, Angels. I would argue that she wasn't being tsundere at all as much as she legitimately didn't like Seiji until she got to know him. Her reaction after learning who he really was was just her reaction to having one of her fantasies taken down, which I felt was part of the point of the whole movie.
The reason this is one of my favorite movies of all time is because I think Shizuku is a pretty straightforwardly portrayed character, but articulated cinematically. That, and the Country Roads performance around the middle is my favorite scene from any movie. I feel like the reason some people are averse to tsunderes is that they have this deliberately self-destructive behavior, sometimes for no other reason than plain immaturity, that annoys people. But I'd say Shizuku acted her age for pretty much the whole movie, and if she matured by the end it was because she was more aware. The very, very ending - like the last three seconds - are a little weird for me, but other than that this is very nearly my favorite Ghibli movie, and I'm a pretty big Ghibli fanboy. |
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Brutannica
Posts: 257 |
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This is also one of my favorite Ghibli films, and probably films, period. Although, I think a lot of it is because of the time and context I first saw it (high school Japanese class); if you look at it objectively it can come across as a cheesy romance story (the ending especially).
I also concur that Yoshifumi Kondou's death is one of anime's great tragedies. |
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Angel'sArcanum
Posts: 303 Location: Toronto, Ontario |
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Yo. Yeah, perhaps Shizuku didn't like him from their first meeting, but when I was watching, I think I got the impression that she wanted someone to give her feedback and that he might have seemed cute or something before they actually started to talk(?), the context is escaping me atm, so I can't really put my finger on it, but I remember that some secretive crush sentiments or something like that were hitting me early on and persisting through the film. What you mentioned about the self-destructiveness sounds about right, what is clearest to me is that their first interactions had Shizuku being a bit persnickety and came off as a weird faux pas when she seemed more sincere with her friend prior to that, those kinds of traits always kind of throw me off. I guess that ultimately kind of softened the impact of that fantasy being shattered (interesting execution when you put it like that though), but that could also play a part with the dramatic irony being drawn out a bit too much (or at least, I knew it was Seiji early on). There is definitely some self-reflexive honing later on in the film that is nice though, and Shizuku's passion is admirable, I did like that part about it for sure. |
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